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Sharpening newbie

JasonBrent

JasonBrent

Joined
May 16, 2014
Messages
34
Hello all. I just got my hands on a Spyderco Sharpmaker and became instantly frustrated. I feel like I need to take a step back and fully understand sharpening before I waste any more time. Before I sharpen a knife, I am assuming I need to know what the angle of the edge is. If this is correct how would I be able to find what that is? I tried to sharpen my Benchmade Small Summit Lake with S30V and got nowhere. I then tried to sharpen a cheap Spyderco pen knife (both at 40%) and it made the knife duller. I didnt pay much for the Sharpmaker so if I have to ditch the system for something else, I would be up for suggestions. I read in another thread that the DMT Magna Guide was recommended. If I would try to use the Magna Guide, does anyone have any tips on maintaining the edge? This is my first post and probably seem all over the place but I need help to get down the right path.

Cheers

Jason
 
The Sharpmaker can be frustrating; It has only two angles and the ceramic rods are not able to cut quickly. Fortunately, you came to the right place. I'd suggest reading the sticky on the top of the page "What is sharpening a knife about." It explains what the angles are and how to find them. After that, just start looking at threads on the sharpmaker and others (Edge Pro, Wicked Edge).

Best of luck with it,
Dave
 
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Color the edge bevels of your blade with Sharpie or another marker. Then do some strokes on both sides with the SharpMaker. The black marker will be removed where ever the stones are touching the blade. If you still have black leading down to the edge, then the edge isn't getting sharpened. This is either because the edge angle is larger than 20 degrees per side (40 degrees inclusive), *OR* you aren't holding the blade straight up and down.

The sharpie technique is a huge help and can show you things that are very hard to see with the naked eye. I too was frustrated with the SharpMaker when I first got it. My problem turned out to be simply that my blade was dull enough that it needed 20 to 30 minutes of attention on the SharpMaker. I was expecting results more quickly, but my blade was too dull.

Let us know what you find and we can try to help you along.

Brian.
 
I will try to use the sharpie method tonight. I read over the "What is sharpening a knife about" thread and found it very helpful. I guess I just need to learn patience with this.

Thank you for your input!

Jason
 
Jason, I spent 8 months reading every post on this forum and 2 others before I chose a system of sharpening. It has proved to be very helpful for me. I am not saying that is what you have to do. I am saying that a little knowledge does help. I learned about steel types, and different techniques. It helped me pick a system that suited me. It also prvented much frustration. This is a great board with a lot of knowledgeable people. Welcome aboard.
 
I got the diamond rods for mine. Made sharpening S30V possible. Otherwise you are just wasting time unless your blade angle is 30 or 40 degrees. The sharpmaker is great if you only want a 30 or 40 deg. angle on your blades. I use the 30 for all of my folding knives.
 
Danketch said:
I got the diamond rods for mine. Made sharpening S30V possible. Otherwise you are just wasting time unless your blade angle is 30 or 40 degrees. The sharpmaker is great if you only want a 30 or 40 deg. angle on your blades. I use the 30 for all of my folding knives.
Click to expand...

Just got the diamonds also. We'll see how they work for reprofiling my delica with uneven edge angles.
 
I just started with the Sharpmaker too and initially found it frustrating. But I realized that I was starting on some crappy kitchen knives (didn't want to experiment on any of MY knives... haha) that were incredibly dull. So more patience helped and really just going way past the "20 strokes" method that is recommended in the instructions. I also did a few with the 30 degree angle and that helped. I'm not "there" yet but they are much sharper than they were.
 
Thank you for all the input. I have not had a chance to get back to it. The Man's got me working pretty much lately. I may get the diamond rods. Are they coarse enough to remove enough steel to create the new angle?
 
I tried the sharpie technique last night and it helped greatly. I was just needed to spend more time on the first grit. That really boosted my spirits. Now its just practice, practice, practice.

Thank you everyone for your help and generosity.
 
Once you get it figured out, i can recommend the ultra fine stones as well- just got mine in and putting a pretty good hair-whittling edge on S30V. But I think the diamond stones are almost an essential part of the Sharpmaker system now, given today's modern super steels. Those brown stones will take approximately forever to re-profile an edge.
 
Received a Sharpmaker for a gift and have been experimenting with it for a couple of days, learning on a used Leek I picked up on BF.

I've been trying to take my time and pay attention to where I'm sharpening and how the edges line up. I'm super paranoid about maintaining the knife's edge as I move it down the stones.

I have the ultra fine stones, but not the diamond ones. I'm thinking I will need them once I get into more advanced steels (VG-10, ELMAX, etc), yes?

I will say, something that hasn't been mentioned ITT yet is to pick up a loupe so you can really see what's going on. You can get them for less than $5 on Amazon. I got a 20x, but I think a 30x or even 40x might be better. Probably not essential, but for less than a sandwich, not a bad thing to have.

Always looking for new tips and techniques. Anyone have any favorite threads or Youtube videos?
 
I would definitely recommend the diamond rods. Sharpening S30V on the brown rod takes too long if the edge is not set at 30 degree already. I don't have 30 minutes to waste on one knife. Just use light pressure on the diamond rod to avoid ripping the diamond particles out of the substrate. I see the warning about this for the CBN rods, but not for the diamond rods. Does anyone think the diamond rod is more robust than the CBN rod?
 
The sharpie trick is key for most any type of sharpening. If you're not hitting the edge, then you're not getting sharp. Also, with practice the stock Sharpmaker at that old 40 degree angle will get your knives sharper than you'll realistically ever need. It is not a reprofiling tool by any means. The extra fine rods are great for S&G.
 
I have the Sharpmaker and Edge Pro. I would just about bet you're not getting your knives sharp on it because you're sharpening the shoulders of the edge, instead of the actual edge. The Sharpmaker is a great sharpener and can produce hair whittling edges on a knife within about 5 minutes, if your bevel is already set.

My recommendation is start of by getting yourself two things.

1. A Sharpie marker
2. Order the course stones. I think they're diamond if I remember correctly? These will help you set the proper bevel faster than spending an hour with the medium stones.

Use the marker and mark lines on your current bevel and Edge. This will help you see exactly where your stones are taking metal off.

Then put your rods in the 30° angle slots. (15° each side equalling 30° total.) Then go to town with about a couple pounds of pressure. You don't need a ton of pressure. This will take your bevel back, grinding the shoulders off. A.k.a... back beveling.

You'll need to learn to feel for a burr. It will help you to learn when you've reached the Apex of the edge. It will always form on the opposite side of the blade you are sharpening.

When you've set your bevel, some will leave the 30° angle on their edge... others will move the rods to the 40° angle and then put a micro bevel on their edge. The micro bevel tends to make your edge a bit stronger.

It wont take any time at all putting the micro bevel on. Very light strokes and usually only a few needed per stone.

Keep your knife straight up and down as possible through the whole process. Like someone above mentioned, jdavis has a great YouTube channel teaching a lot of techniques. Highly recommend subbing his channel.
 
What would be the pros/cons of buying the CBN rods over the Diamond rods? I'm about to start working through my collection and doing some rebeveling but don't have anything more aggressive than the medium rods that came with the SM.
 
bgentry said:
Color the edge bevels of your blade with Sharpie or another marker. Then do some strokes on both sides with the SharpMaker. The black marker will be removed where ever the stones are touching the blade. If you still have black leading down to the edge, then the edge isn't getting sharpened. This is either because the edge angle is larger than 20 degrees per side (40 degrees inclusive), *OR* you aren't holding the blade straight up and down.

The sharpie technique is a huge help and can show you things that are very hard to see with the naked eye. I too was frustrated with the SharpMaker when I first got it. My problem turned out to be simply that my blade was dull enough that it needed 20 to 30 minutes of attention on the SharpMaker. I was expecting results more quickly, but my blade was too dull.
Click to expand...

This. I just had four co-workers over to my apartment to teach them sharpening, including the Sharpmaker. The marker trick was key in helping them visualize how the angles worked. The marker trick works for any sharpening technique. I cover it (albeit for convex sharpening) in my 2-minute video here.
 
Successfully put nice edges on a cheap Kershaw and then a user Sebenza with my new (-ish) Sharpmaker before I decided to undertake a rebevel and edge job on an ELMAX ZT0566.

Wow, what a PITA that is! I'm not sure if rebeveling with the Sharpmaker is this much of a chore (I was using the diamond rods) or if ELMAX is just that difficult to work with, but I don't think I'll be doing that again. Going to be using the Sharpmaker for standard resharpening from here on out, but if I decide to put a back bevel on something, I think I just need to look into getting something more robust.
 
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