Sharpmaker 204 Diamond Sleeves and hardness related question for Sal Glesser, etc.

[Donald]

Sal,

I. Is there any progress regarding Diamond Sleeves for the Sharpmaker 204?
These would be useful in getting a good angle on a blade with poor grind lines or one that is exceedly dull and/or damaged. Further, I am concerned for the reasons raised in Part II.

II. A related issue was discussed in these two threads:

Busse Basic #7 http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/001035.html


Best blade steel from resharpening stand http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum32/HTML/001107.html

I hope someone (e.g. Sal

) has an answer, because it took me an embarassingly long time :O to find the first thread, which is why I had raised my question in the second thread, as I gave up locating it the first time.

I read a article several years ago in a knife or outdoor magazine with the point that stainless steel knives were not always appreciated because ordinary sharpening methods were insufficient to get a good edge. Recently Cliff Stamp raised the same or similar point in the Busse thread wherein he states:

If you don't reform the bevel with an abrasive hard enough to cut the carbides you will end up with a very thin highly polished edge containing worn, rounded carbides.

My question in the steel thread to Cliff was:

Do you feel that the alumina particles, or synthetic saphires, in the Sharpmaker and similar products can do this? Spyderco states that "these ceramics are hard materials - measuring up to 9.22 in hardness on the Mohs Scale."

He kindly replied:

Donald, SiC is around 9 on the Mohs scale as well so in theory the Sharpmaker should work fine. However my experience with ceramic rods (not Spyderco) is otherwise. After a period of sharpening with them I start to see honing make less of an impact, when this happens I recut the bevel.

Are the Spyderco 204 triangular rods hard and aggressive enough to cleanly cut any large worn carbides and therefore get a cleanly sharpened edge?

I am not sure I have worded this question in the most felicitous manner, but it should suffice. I ask this not only for general knowledge, as KnifeKnuts want to know, but I have some knives that I just cannot get as sharp as I would like. I seem to have the most trouble getting some knives made out of ATS-34 as sharp as I would like. On the other hand knives made out of BG-42 (CRK) or 440-V (BF Native) I can get hair popping sharp (shaves mostly clean, the first time and every time) and will cleanly push cut (as opposed to just slicing) small curls of paper. The Spyderco Morans (all 3) came this way. The Moran I have used in the kitchen I just restored to this sharpness, or perhaps got even sharper, on a leather strop (Pro Combo 17) from http://www.handamerican.com/

Although I can get a knife reasonably sharp free-hand, I purchased the Sharpmaker 204, for the reasons it was designed, to conveniently ensure a more accurate angle, and thus a sharper knife. It seems every once in a while this does not hold true, either because of the steel structure, very hard rounded carbides, or perhaps user error.

If you answered all this in the video, I an sorry, but I have not yet gotten mine.

I look forward to THE ANSWER

. Thank you for your attention.

Donald
Miami, FL

 

[Nakano 2]

Funny. I recently dug out my many years old but seldom used speed sleeves. I experienced a hard and long time trying to even out the uneven edge of an M2 steel AFCK on the coarse stones. I slid on the speed sleeves which BTW does indeed fit over the new stones of the 204, and proceeded to stroke. In only a short time, the edge was rebeveled to a keen but unpolished edge. An edge that "bites" or is grabby has worked best for me.

So to answer the question, yes the speed sleeves does indeed do a quicker and more efficient job of removing steel. And boy do you feel the the sleeves cutting into the edge.

L8r,
Nakano

 

[Donald]

Nakano, Thanks for the imput. I think the holdidays have slowed traffic. My question was only down a few topics. I also see you answered in the similar later thread. Obviously, diamond sleeves would be a popular option.

 

[Joe Talmadge]

The diamond sleeves worked well. The toughest thing for diamond hones is keeping the diamonds bonded to the metal sleeve, but the old version seemed to do just fine. Mine are many years old but still cut.

However, I don't really use them. When I want to remove metal fast, I lean my 6"x2" DMT diamond hone up against the ceramic v-stick and sharpen on it. Since it's laying against the v-stick, it's at the exact same angle. When I've removed enough metal from one side, I switch and do it against the other side. The DMT coarse stone cuts fast, the x-coarse astoundingly fast.

Joe

 

[Sal Glesser]

Donald - The ceramic is indeed hard enough to remove large carbides. The diamonds do it faster. When the edge feels like it "just aint doin' it like it should", I rebevel as Joe does. The 30 degree on the corner section of a gray stone (slightly worn cuts faster) does a very nice job.

The primary problem with the diamond sleeves was in fact longevity of the sleeve. ELU complaints of short life and high cost were common. They were also very expensive and almost "non profit" on our end.

Sorry to be slow on the product development of the diamond triangles. We hope it to be an improvement over the sleeves. We are in fact having difficulty finding a supplier that can form a 7" x 1/2" close tolerance hollow steel triangle. Any of you have a source, Email me.

We are also a small company with too many irons already in the fire.

sal