Sharpmaker instead of Steeling?

D

dirtsqueezer

Joined
Sep 30, 1999
Messages
135
It's my understanding that using a steel on a blade realigns the edge and increases the duration that you can maintain a sharp edge between sharpening sessions. (I hope I got that right)

If this is the case, does it make sense that you could achieve this alignment simply by running the knife (very lightly) through a sharpmaker or a similar V sharpener at a 20 -25 degree angle?

Just thinking of my reasons to get a sharpmaker....

-j-
 
well, technically yes, but you are still gonna remove some metal unless you stroke extremely light which may not do anything.
Buy the sharpmaker-its the best. I work with pressman at the NY Daily News who have sharpened their own knives for 20-30 years who now ask me to sharpen them for them on my sharpmaker.

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lifter
Phil. 4:13

Dave
Wharton,NJ

 
If you want to maximally preserve the steel of your blade you should steel your edge with a smooth steel. Subsequently do what ever honing you need. If you don't have a steel handy when you need it take a relatively fine abrasive (like a sharpmaker rod) and strop the blade with the sharp-edge trailing a few strokes before you start honing in earnest. This will partially allign and partly abrade your edge (a compromise).
 
dirtsqueeser,

The plan you outlined works for me. I use crock sticks in the kitchen instead of a steel. They are as quick as a steel, and sharpen as well as align.

A fine abrasive like in the crock sticks or the fine sharpmaker sticks will take a long, long, long time to cause significant blade wear.



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Howard Wallace
Khukuri FAQ

 
Jeff, this is getting mildly off topic, but you seem to have a preference for smooth vs ridged steels?

Most of the ones I see have ridges. Are you concerned about the added wear, or is the preference a performance thing?

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Longden Loo - Ventura, CA
Technology's the answer, what's the question?

 
I use a smooth steel also, though I have a grooved steel as well.

dirtsqueezer, don't make up justifications to buy the Sharpmaker, it's worth buying, period! But thinking you'll use it as a steel isn't the best idea. The nice thing about steeling on a smooth steel is that it removes no metal, so you can do it as often as you'd like. Grab yourself a steel for steeling, the Sharpmaker is worth the money for what it's good at, sharpening!

Joe
 
Where can you recommend getting a good steel and who makes some good ones?

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I can see how it might be possible for a man to look down upon the earth and be an atheist, but I cannot conceive how a man could look up into the heavens and say there is no God.
*Abraham Lincoln

Romans 1:20-22


 
Longden,

There are two distinct types of steels. Some just call them ribbed and smooth, others call them butcher's steels and meat packers steels respectively. Here is a quote from Steve Bottorff's sharpening primer:

"A butcher's steel is a round file with the teeth running the long way. They are intended for mild steel knifes that are steeled several times a day, but are not suitable for today's tougher and harder steels. I know a knife shop owner and knifemaker that disagrees, but in my opinion they belong in a knife museum along with natural stones.

A meat packer's steel is a smooth, polished steel rod designed for straightening a turned edge. It is also useful for burnishing a newly finished edge. Because steels have a small diameter they exert high local pressure. Therefore they affect the metal in a knife when used with very little force."

I would only use a ribbed steel on a very cheap blade. A ribbed steel uses up a blade fast because it is basically a file. Files work excellently on meat cutting edges since the rough shaved edge they leave is perfect for meat cutting. The trouble is the rapid edge loss. It is also hard to file or rough steel an edge that is above 58 RC.

I haven't looked extensively for the best steel. I'm using a Chicago Cutlery steel I got at Goodwill.

 
I think the sharpmaker is on the list of new purchases. Right now, I'm using a colorado abrasive's V-sharpener with settings for 15 and 22 degrees. It is an excellent little sharpener for $15 - and its performance has skyrocketed after I've read the FAQ's from Joe and Cliff. But,.....little voice says sharpmaker, Christmas and Birthday......

As far as steeling goes, If I go buy a $40 steel and free-hand poorly, am I worse off than steeling with a $3 chunk of hobby steel placed in a guide and using a constant angle? The angle, I assume is the same as the one I sharpen to?

Thanks

-j-


[This message has been edited by dirtsqueezer (edited 15 November 1999).]
 
The Sharpmaker is the most useful I've found, but it doesn't do two things well - remove a lot of metal quickly when you need to re-do th back bevel, put the final edge on that a well-made smooth steel can.

I use a Razor's Edge system for new knives and those that need a new back bevel. Then, it's all Sharpmaker. Once I have a hair-shaving edge, I grab the smooth steel from my Razor's Edge kit, and give the blade about 10 extremely light (2-3 oz tops) strokes on each side. Doing that always brings the edge up to scary sharp. If you don't have a smooth steel, the edge of a car window can usually work as well.

I spent several years in the restaurant business. A rough steel was useful because it help somewhat to keep a decent edge during the day so you didn't have to go to the stones, getting the knife dirty, and then have to clean it. The steel eliminated the washing at a cost of a lesser edge. For those folks that rely solely on a steel, the rough is the way to go. Once an edge is gone, no smooth steel is going to help - you have to remove some metal to get the edge back.

I will never use a rough steel again because they are abrasive. When you are at the stage of maintaining an edge, an abrasize is not what I want. I want something smooth to bring out that last bit of sharpness.

Ray

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Knowledge without understanding is knowledge wasted.
Understanding without knowledge is a rare gift - but not an impossibility.
For the impossible is always possible through faith. - Bathroom graffiti, gas station, Grey, TN, Dec, 1988

AKTI Member #A000831

[This message has been edited by Codeman (edited 15 November 1999).]

[This message has been edited by Codeman (edited 15 November 1999).]
 
dirtsqueezer:

I don't know how others feel about this, but I've always felt that it's less important to hold the angle perfectly with a steel than when sharpening. With a smooth steel, all I'm doing is re-pointing the edge downwards again, not grinding in a new bevel. I do try to keep a constant angle, but even when I'm not obsessive about it, the steel yields the same good results.

I use a smooth steel from Razor Edge. It hold the angles for you. Bernard Levine sent me a note a while back telling me who he thought made the best smooth steels (he's a smooth steel fan also), but I can't remember what his recommendation was. You might try asking on rec.knives, he monitors that group often.

Joe
 
Here's an excerpt from Bernard Levine's posting in rec.knives. He was replying to my post saying that I prefer a smooth steel.

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I, too, only use a dead smooth "slick" steel, and no professional
butcher or cook should use anything else. F. Dick now makes the best
slick steels, but I happen to have an antique I. Wilson slick which
works equally well. A grooved steel can HARM the cutting edges of good
knives, unless it is used with a very light touch; better not to use
it at all. A smooth glass bottle will work better than a grooved
steel.
 
Dirtsqueezer - When I want to steel a blade, I also prefer a smooth steel. My preference is to use the "Razor Edge" smooth steels by removinmg them from thrir handle and setting them in the grooves of the Triangle facing each other and sharpen as normal. Don't know if John (Juranitch) would approve, but it works well.

sal
 
I worked in a pork plant this summer with upto 4 knives in my scabbard and a smooth steel on my belt. Seeling removes no metal (or at least a negligible amount) and actually improves the length of the life of your blades. Steeling often reduces the number of sharpenings which means less steel is stripped from your blade than normal. Smooth steel is the way to go. I have the Razors Edge kit too- GREAT smooth steel. My mother has a Henkels steel and I must say that it does a great job on her chef's knives (and my LTC Kukri too!)It isn't smooth but the grooves cut into it are ***very*** fine ones compared to other steels. I found that steeling at the same sharpening angle is great but sharpening at a slightly bigger angle works great too. The key is not to steel hard- light pressure is all that is required.
 
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