Sharpmaker Scary Sharp help?

krazichinaman

krazichinaman

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So I know a lot of people here use the sharpmaker and have had great results. I've had decent results where I can shave, but I'm now desiring the next level. My question for us is what is the sharpest you have gotten your knife on the Sharpmaker?

I personally have the diamond rods as well as the UF rods. I've been using the sharpmaker at the 40 mark just until a few days ago.(Is it just me or is there just a very slight difference in the results from the 30 and 40 settings?) Once I finish up on the UF, I move it to my leather strop loaded with "white rouge buffing compound 2-5 microns. At both 30 and 40 settings, I can get my knives to where it will send a hair flying across the blade of my leg/arm and you can hear that "pop sound". I can acheive this before I finsih it off on the strop.

My problem is that I can't seem to get that "tree topping sharpness" that I see so many people talk about. I see people talk about push cutting toilet paper and I just dont see how they can get it that sharp. Is it possible to sharpen your knife to the point where you can pushcut tp with the sharpmaker? I've beenable to get my blades to the point where I can cut standing paper that is taped into a tube.

Note*I get the same results with 154 Cm, VG-10, S30V
 
C. Man,
I don't know anyone that can pushcut TP. I sometime slice cut a sheet of TP as an edge test. You need a good edge just to do that.

Good thread subject. I'll be following this one.
 
You know what - I think you're knives are sharp. Now start using them! That way you will get a nick and a roll and get to do it again.

From personal experience - the point where you say - 'okay its sharp' as opposed to 'I wonder if I could get it a little sharper' is pretty much all psychological. Really now, if you can push cut TP will it make your knife function any better. Your knife will probably just dull faster if it performs that well - good for TP, rolls on wood :(

There are 12 steps. The first is to admit you have a problem....

EDIT - Oh and I just love how Thom just dings his $400 plus knives to hell on bedframes. Seriously I love the guy - he loves to sharpen. Thom when is sharp sharp enough?
 
kgd said:
You know what - I think you're knives are sharp. Now start using them! That way you will get a nick and a roll and get to do it again.

From personal experience - the point where you say - 'okay its sharp' as opposed to 'I wonder if I could get it a little sharper' is pretty much all psychological. Really now, if you can push cut TP will it make your knife function any better. Your knife will probably just dull faster if it performs that well - good for TP, rolls on wood :(

There are 12 steps. The first is to admit you have a problem....

EDIT - Oh and I just love how Thom just dings his $400 plus knives to hell on bedframes. Seriously I love the guy - he loves to sharpen. Thom when is sharp sharp enough?
Click to expand...

Until I can split an atom it isn't sharp enough for me. Never mind that I won't survive the blast, I just need that sharpness. And yes, Thom is the man for blasting his bad ass knives into bedframes. The man knows how to have fun and put his tools to use!

Mike
 
Personnaly, I'd try taking the hones out of the base and laying them flat in the back of the mount. Freehand the UF hones followed by stropping with cardboard. Your blade will be scary sharp and then some ...

NJ
 
I started getting shaving and hair popping edges with my Sharpmaker, and like you, wanted more. First I recommend getting a loupe, or even better, a Radioshack 60-100X lighted microscope for checking your edges. Magnification is invaluble for tracking what your edges are doing, and any burr you raise (I try to avoid raising burrs completely). Speaking of burrs, I've found minimizing and removing any burr you form to be the most important factor for me to be able to get a sharp, long lasting edge. Jeff Clark's method of raising the angle and using light strokes until the burr is gone works great. Another good tip that Cliff Stamp gave me was to cut straight into the stone to dull the blade to remove any weakened or fatigued steel before a fresh sharpening, and this also helps a lot to minimize burrs and give better edges.

When I really started improving my results was when I went to benchstones. I find that with their greater surface area I get less burring than with the Sharpmaker rods. I use DMT XX coarse and X coarse for reprofiling, and DMT fine for refining that edge, then I use Spyderco benchstones in medium, fine, and ultra fine to sharpen my microbevel. Microbevels are tiny little bevels just at the very edge that are a few degrees above the main bevel angle you have set. When Sal says in the Sharpmaker video to set a 15 degree back bevel and use a 20 degree edge bevel, the edge bevel he is talking about is a microbevel. I go much more acute with my angles than that, but you get the point. I have found that my edges tree top arm hairs nicely with the Spyderco Ultra Fine finish. To bring out that last bit of bragging sharpness I use a 1 micron polishing cloth (thank you Thom Brogan) superglued to a plastic clipboard (glass would be better) and strop the knife on that. Last night I was able to whittle hair for the first time after finishing on the polishing cloth. You can get the same results as I get on my benchstones with your sharpmaker, as they are the same grits, but I prefer the benchstones for more versatility with your angles and the smaller amount of burring I get. If you aren't ham fisted like me then the sharpmaker will do you just fine, and polishing cloths or lapping fils can bring out that last bit of sharpness for you.

Mike
 
Would it be possible for anyone of you master sharpeners to take some pictures through your loupe or microscope? If you could point out what we are seeing I think it would help us beginners to use the loupe and microscope effectively.
 
gunmike1 said:
First I recommend getting a loupe, or even better, a Radioshack 60-100X lighted microscope for checking your edges. Magnification is invaluble for tracking what your edges are doing, and any burr you raise (I try to avoid raising burrs completely).
Mike
Click to expand...


I actually was a jeweler for 2 years so I do have a loupe. I also did pick up that Radioshack 60-100X microscope but my problem with that is its hard for me to keep the blade still and beable to focus on the edge. I tried placing the blade on a table, but when you try to get it to focus on the edge, I tend to accidently nudge the knife so you have to re center everything. Not only that, the little light on that thing isnt bright enough so when you look through it, everything is super dark. I tried using my Stream Light Tl-2 for brighter light, but thats just too bright! haha
 
Chinese man said:
I actually was a jeweler for 2 years so I do have a loupe. I also did pick up that Radioshack 60-100X microscope but my problem with that is its hard for me to keep the blade still and beable to focus on the edge. I tried placing the blade on a table, but when you try to get it to focus on the edge, I tend to accidently nudge the knife so you have to re center everything. Not only that, the little light on that thing isnt bright enough so when you look through it, everything is super dark. I tried using my Stream Light Tl-2 for brighter light, but thats just too bright! haha
Click to expand...

It just takes some practice, I had the same problem at first. I just hold the knife in my left hand, lay the scope flat on the blade with most of it hanging off the edge, and slowly slide it toward the edge until I can see it. From there you can slide it back and forth along the edge to see what is going on. I usually do it in a well lit room, as I found that helps. If you get it too far beyond the edge onto the blade the picture gets dark.

Mike
 
kgd said:
Your knife will probably just dull faster if it performs that well - good for TP, rolls on wood
Click to expand...

Hi kgd! What you're saying is true if the edge being made is a piece of burred steel which should've ground from the edge, but otherwise, what's good for whittling is what's good for bumwipe (unless you whittle swamp oak in which case, steel is the wrong material).

Mr. Chinese Man,

Make sure to periodlically clean your Sharpmaker hones and your results will get better. Sometimes, applying a final, 40 degree edge (or microbevel) with a few, super-light alternating strokes will let you get that tree-topping edge.
 
I quit using the 30 degree slots for sharpening the Henckels kitchen knives. The edges chipped and rolled too much. Those knives seem to do better with the 40 degree slots.

The magic marker trick for assuring that the Sharpmaker stones are contacting the edge of the blade is fundamental. This tip helped me a lot when I was first learning to sharpen.

My other favorite tips for the Sharpmaker: (All learned from this forum:cool: )

1. Keep the stones clean. (There have been several threads devoted to this one topic in the last year.)

2. Avoid dings in the stones by using another side, or hone out the dings with another stone. I'm pretty sure the stones come pre-dinged straight from the factory.

3. Use light strokes and go progressively lighter as the knife gets sharper.

4. Get the optional ultrafine stones if you want to experiment with polished edges. They make a noticeable difference.

5. I gain a little added sharpness by stropping with CrO loaded paper on glass as a final step. Maybe this is removing very small burrs from the Sharpmaker ultrafines. The improvement seems to come after a dozen or two honing strokes. The stropping method I use is desribed here:
http://drsharpening.com/leatherhone.html

6. Sometimes it's best to deliberately blunt an edge (lightly on one of the stones) before starting to sharpen. I do this only when I can't seem to get a cleanly formed edge and I want to start over.
 
I clean the sharpmaker stones at least once a week. I do have the ultra fine stones as well. As far as the micro bevel that was stated. So say I sharpen at the 40 mark, I should take a few swipes at the 30 mark on the Ultra fine stones once I'm done? Than I should strop? Or strop, than do a few swipes at the 30 mark on the ultra fines?

Or should I sharpen at the 30, than strop, than do a few passes on the ultra fine at the 40 mark? If we go this route at the 30, won't I eventually need to back bevel the blade at an angle steeper than 30 to "grind down" the shoulders?
 
Hi Chinese man,

Despite my post in jest earlier, my understanding is that the micro bevel is established at a larger angle than the primary. So you would sharpen at 30 and then perform featherstrokes at 40 followed by stropping.
 
kgd,

If it's any consolation, the edges that slice toilet-paper will be totally destroyed cutting wire ties. Just confirmed that the upsetting way.
 
Thom,

Thats exactly what I found as well (though never got my knife to cut TP). Last week I had to rip down a snow fence in the back yard and took my hair popping sharp 119 buck (I know 420HC isn't the best for edge retention but its my backyard knife) to cut off the zip-ties. Dulled the knife pretty fast and even chipped in a place where I cut through the tie and accidentally banged the edge against a rusty fence post that the tie was secured to.

Anyways, this is what prompted my first post to Chinese man. Actually when I saw the chip, the first thought was dam.. then the 2nd thought was hey I'll just ground that chip out/resharpen and that is much more fun than cutting the grass.

By the way - thanks to gunmike1 for the suggestion of really dulling the blade before re-sharpening. That makes a lot of sense, but not the kind of trick you would intuitively do prior to sharpening. I will definitely try this next time.
 
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