Shipping Auto and Balisong

miltmaldo

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Just wanted to give a heads up to members. I was looking at the new ZT and saw this posted .

PER FEDERAL LAW, AUTOMATIC & LUCHA KNIVES CANNOT BE SHIPPED THROUGH THE UNITED STATES POSTAL SERVICE (USPS). ANY POST OFFICE BOX ADDRESSES WILL BE CANCELLED FOR THESE ORDERS. ALL AUTOMATIC & LUCHA ORDERS WILL BE MOVED FROM USPS TO UPS GROUND IF USPS IS SELECTED FOR A PHYSICAL ADDRESS.
 
Just wanted to give a heads up to members. I was looking at the new ZT and saw this posted .

PER FEDERAL LAW, AUTOMATIC & LUCHA KNIVES CANNOT BE SHIPPED THROUGH THE UNITED STATES POSTAL SERVICE (USPS). ANY POST OFFICE BOX ADDRESSES WILL BE CANCELLED FOR THESE ORDERS. ALL AUTOMATIC & LUCHA ORDERS WILL BE MOVED FROM USPS TO UPS GROUND IF USPS IS SELECTED FOR A PHYSICAL ADDRESS.

This has always been true.
 
This has always been true.


If you have a PO Box at a PO that offers "Premium PO Box Services" you can use your PO's street address & list your box as a Unit # and it will be delivered to you by UPS/FedEx or whatever method of delivery the dealer chooses to use. to protect itself from liability. I do this all the time.

See: https://postalpro.usps.com/mailing/competitivepoboxes

Otherwise, just have it delivered to where you work or to your house.

Some dealers don't pay attention to this law. Others do. Just use the address (&/or dealer) that works best for you.
 
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Or one can just skip the nonsense and not take any unneeded risks by just not using the USPS.

I think it’s unreasonable to demand a business take risks by breaking the law because they find USPS deliveries more convenient.
 
And it doesn't matter.

If you have a PO Box, you can use your PO's street address & list your box as a Unit # and it will be delivered to you by UPS/FedEx or whatever method of delivery the dealer chooses to use. to protect itself from liability. Otherwise, just have it delivered to where you work or to your house.

Some dealers don't pay attention to this law. Others do. Just use the address that works best for you.

Except ---- this is not universal. Most smaller POs do not accept UPS/FEDEX deliveries. The three closest POs to me do not accept these deliveries.

I have to use a larger city's PO, about 26 miles from me, to have a PO Box for UPS/FEDEX deliveries.
 
And it doesn't matter.

If you have a PO Box, you can use your PO's street address & list your box as a Unit # and it will be delivered to you by UPS/FedEx or whatever method of delivery the dealer chooses to use. to protect itself from liability. Otherwise, just have it delivered to where you work or to your house.

Some dealers don't pay attention to this law. Others do. Just use the address that works best for you.
I agree I just let them send them by UPS or Fedex without any issues. And there are definitely some suppliers that I use who will send by USPS regardless. We need to support the AKTI who is working to get these meaningless laws abolished on the state levels and hopefully eventually on the federal level. But we are still miles above other countries like Britain where many types of knives are illegal. They have politicians who have said that anyone carrying any knife is a criminal.
 
Except ---- this is not universal. Most smaller POs do not accept UPS/FEDEX deliveries. The three closest POs to me do not accept these deliveries.

I have to use a larger city's PO, about 26 miles from me, to have a PO Box for UPS/FEDEX deliveries.

Noted. This is a "Premium PO Box Service" that may not be available at all POs. Prior post edited to reflect this.

See: https://postalpro.usps.com/mailing/competitivepoboxes
 
Or one can just skip the nonsense and not take any unneeded risks by just not using the USPS.

I think it’s unreasonable to demand a business take risks by breaking the law because they find USPS deliveries more convenient.

No one is demanding the dealers to do anything.

Under existing laws, the liability for shipping you an auto is theirs (not yours) & it's their choice (and risk) to use USPS or not.

The Postal Inspectors cannot inspect every piece of mail even if they know it's being sent by a knife dealer.

So, this is really much ado about nothing. 🤷‍♂️
 
The postal service laws are separate and different from the federal interstate commerce laws.

Shipping an auto or gravity knife or whatever prohibited item via USPS puts BOTH SHIPPER AND BUYER IN LEGAL JEPARDY REGARDLESS OF WHETHER THE BUYER IS AN IDIVIDUAL OR BUSINESS.
 
Greater has this correct. The inter state commerce law is the seller's issue, BUT use of the USPS can cause a legal issue for BOTH buyer and seller. READ the law carefully. Anyone who uses the USPS for sending these is causing a violation for both sender and receiver of the item. Using UPS/ Fedex will eliminate this issue.
 
A few years back I did a hard internet search for any prosecutions of the Federal Switchblade Act. And going all the way back to 1983, I found only three. Federal prosecutions are a matter of public record, so I'm confident that if there were more I would have found them.

Here are the three prosecutions I found-

1. In 1983 Douglas Nelsen, owner of the Crowley Cutlery Company was prosecuted and convicted of importing and shipping switchblades across state lines.

2. In 1985 Glenn and Robert Murphee were convicted of importing switchblades into the US. They were importing switchblades with no springs.

3. In 2007 Spyderco was prosecuted for importing butterfly knife parts, and shipping butterfly knives across state lines. They pled guilty, paid a heavy fine, and lost all butterfly knife parts to seizure.

And that's it. I have never found any prosecution of anyone for buying/receiving a switchblade shipped across state lines by either the USPS or a private carrier.

Considering how many vendors are openly advertising switchblades and butterfly knives for sale, and shipping them across state lines, I'm sure that if the Feds were truly interested in prosecuting such "crimes" that they would have no difficulty finding defendants. But since the last prosecution I can find was in 2007, I'm inclined to believe the Feds have more important things to focus on.

Even Amazon ships switchblades across state lines. And I mean actual Amazon, shipping from Amazon warehouses, I'm not referring to third-party vendors.

As someone who both ships and receives switchblades, I don't lose a moment of sleep worrying about being prosecuted, regardless of what carrier is used.
 
Wow, learn something new every day.

I’m not a lawyer but my understanding is recent 2A court decisions cover many weapons that have been banned in the past, including various types of knives. I wouldn’t want to be the test case but any weapon (firearm, knife, baton, taser, pepper spray, etc.) that is in common use for lawful purposes enjoys 2nd Amendment protection. Limiting shipment would seem to be an infringement.
 
Greater has this correct. The inter state commerce law is the seller's issue, BUT use of the USPS can cause a legal issue for BOTH buyer and seller. READ the law carefully. Anyone who uses the USPS for sending these is causing a violation for both sender and receiver of the item. Using UPS/ Fedex will eliminate this
Wow, learn something new every day.

I’m not a lawyer but my understanding is recent 2A court decisions cover many weapons that have been banned in the past, including various types of knives. I wouldn’t want to be the test case but any weapon (firearm, knife, baton, taser, pepper spray, etc.) that is in common use for lawful purposes enjoys 2nd Amendment protection. Limiting shipment would seem to be an infringement.
Last one i shipped, admitedly a couple if years ago, clerk said it just had to go ground. No priority or express.
 
A few years back I did a hard internet search for any prosecutions of the Federal Switchblade Act. And going all the way back to 1983, I found only three. Federal prosecutions are a matter of public record, so I'm confident that if there were more I would have found them.

Here are the three prosecutions I found-

1. In 1983 Douglas Nelsen, owner of the Crowley Cutlery Company was prosecuted and convicted of importing and shipping switchblades across state lines.

2. In 1985 Glenn and Robert Murphee were convicted of importing switchblades into the US. They were importing switchblades with no springs.

3. In 2007 Spyderco was prosecuted for importing butterfly knife parts, and shipping butterfly knives across state lines. They pled guilty, paid a heavy fine, and lost all butterfly knife parts to seizure.

And that's it. I have never found any prosecution of anyone for buying/receiving a switchblade shipped across state lines by either the USPS or a private carrier.

Considering how many vendors are openly advertising switchblades and butterfly knives for sale, and shipping them across state lines, I'm sure that if the Feds were truly interested in prosecuting such "crimes" that they would have no difficulty finding defendants. But since the last prosecution I can find was in 2007, I'm inclined to believe the Feds have more important things to focus on.

Even Amazon ships switchblades across state lines. And I mean actual Amazon, shipping from Amazon warehouses, I'm not referring to third-party vendors.

As someone who both ships and receives switchblades, I don't lose a moment of sleep worrying about being prosecuted, regardless of what carrier is used.
Nothing after 2013, for sure
 
There was one other Customs case against a large importer in the South. If I recall correctly they charged them with both import and sales across state lines.
 
I took another look around, and searched the DOJ archives again, and I found two prosecutions of the Federal Switchblade Act that I previously missed-

In the year 2000 Michael C Neece of Missouri was convicted of importing switchblades.

In 2005 Muhammad and Farhan Aslam of Maryland were convicted of importing switchblades.

I still haven't been able to find any after the 2007 Spyderco case.
 
Greater has this correct. The inter state commerce law is the seller's issue, BUT use of the USPS can cause a legal issue for BOTH buyer and seller. READ the law carefully. Anyone who uses the USPS for sending these is causing a violation for both sender and receiver of the item. Using UPS/ Fedex will eliminate this issue.
I am sure that the interstate commerce law against shipping auto knives is selectively enforced, just like many other laws. I live in Massachusetts, right on the border with NH. Last week, I saw some nice Benchmade auto knives at an army/navy store in Salem, NH. Also saw some at the Kittery Trading Post in Maine last summer. They didn't get there by a Star Trek transporter beam, that's for sure. Benchmade is located in Oregon, so we are looking at a trip of +/- 3,000 miles. Since we are legal to own and carry such knives now in Massachusetts, I fully expect to see them in local gun shops and retail sporting goods stores. As for me, I'll stick with my Cold Steel 4" Voyager. I've carried one for over 20 years and it works fine.
 
The general feeling is that FFL dealers can buy them across state lines. I believe Benchmade only sent repaired ones back to FFL dealers. There are many dealers that will send them to retailers and individuals over state lines, but that does NOT make it legal.

Killgar I believe the 2005 case is the one I was thinking of.
 
The general feeling is that FFL dealers can buy them across state lines. I believe Benchmade only sent repaired ones back to FFL dealers. There are many dealers that will send them to retailers and individuals over state lines, but that does NOT make it legal.

Killgar I believe the 2005 case is the one I was thinking of.


It's my understanding that the Federal Switchblade Act provides only two legal ways to ship switchblades across state lines-1. "pursuant to contract with the Armed Forces" (Section 1244 part 2), and 2."The Armed Forces or any member or employee thereof acting in performance of his duty" (Section 1244 part 3), in other words, military personnel shipping switchblades to other military personnel/units after the knives have already been purchased pursuant to official contract. The Act makes no reference to vendors shipping switchblades across state lines to anyone else, including civilian FFL holders.

There is debate regarding whether or not it's legal to use "common carriers" to ship switchblades across state lines (Section 1244 part 1). AKTI says "common carriers" are exempt, but Kniferights doesn't. Kniferights appears to say that the "common carrier" exception only provides the carriers with legal protection if they transport switchblades across state lines, with no mention of immunity for the sender or recipient. But frankly, I think the issue is moot at the point, particularly if the Feds are not interested in enforcing The Act.

Lots of people in this country, and lots of businesses are violating the Switchblade Act. But you are correct, the fact that a law is not being enforced is not the same as something being legal. But if the law is not being enforced, there's a lot less reason to worry about it.

Like I mentioned, there are many online knife retailers, both big and small, who openly advertise switchblades for sale, and ship them across state lines. And I know from personal experience that some of them use the USPS to ship them. I would imagine that big online knife retailers have a lawyer, if not a law firm on retainer to handle all of the many legal issues that come with owning and operating a business, not the least of which are liability concerns, particularly important for a company that sells knives and weapons. And I also imagine that those companies, and their lawyers, have carefully and thoroughly researched the matter, likely even consulting the DOJ.

I doubt that any of the online retailers who openly advertise, sell, and ship switchblades across state lines to the public would risk Federal prosecution, lawyer fees, crippling fines, and seizure of assets, just to sell Joe Average a switchblade, if they thought there was the slightest chance of being prosecuted. Especially when you consider how easy it would be for the Feds to make a slam-dunk case. So my guess is, they have inside information and know the Feds aren't enforcing The Act.

I would also point out that MANY of the switchblades being openly sold by online vendors, both big and small, are imported into the US from other countries. Another violation of the Act. And I don't mean a few switchblades, I mean LOTS of switchblades (mostly from China). But apparently the vendors aren't worried about that either.

I think the fact that so many online retailers are openly selling imported switchblades to the public says a lot about the current status of the Federal Switchblade act.
 
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I had a discussion on this topic with two well known dealers recently. I had forgotten that in the late 1990s there was a Customs agent that was given a copy of the News Letter ( a switchblade monthly news letter) that showed several dealers listing their sale of switchblades. There were about six dealers that had the police go to their house and confiscate all the imported switchblades, but left a few of the USA made ones as they only cared about the imported ones. These dealers all had to go to court in Florida where that agent was posted. I was told by one of these dealers they all had to pay a $10,000.00 fine. This was of course a importation enforcement case.
 
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