Soldier Seeking Recommended Projects Suitable for Very Limited Available Facilities

Joined
Mar 21, 2011
Messages
4
Gentlemen and Ladies,

I am a novice to the forum as well as to the actual bladesmithing process. However, I do have extensive experience and knowledge in the realm of cold weapon (particularly edged weapon) evolution, historical role, varied cultural examples, materials, design, utilization (functioning as a tool and as a weapon), and blade geometry, in addition to a basic working knowledge of metallurgy as it applies to the distinction between hardness and toughness. During my upcoming deployment, I am very much looking forward to a project or two to help me retain what remains of my sanity, as well as get a bit of experience in a field that is a great interest of mine, one which I intend to pursue full time as a Master upon my retirement from the Army.

Previously I had intended to construct a full-size, custom-fitted hauberk from titanium wire, then attempt to anodize it to brilliant onyx-black. However, research into the matter revealed that it is almost impossible to reliably anodize titanium black. Worse still, precisely welding thousands of individual titanium links would require a laser welder operating in an atmosphere completely devoid of the many elements found in atmospheric gases. Thus, regardless of the work and dedication put into the project it would still be extremely expensive due to the mass of skilled labor required, as well as the cost of the laser welder and a containment unit that will permit the fine manipulation of the links without contamination from exposure to atmospheric gases.

Thus, I am back at something that has interested me for fifteen years: Bladesmithing. Due to being deployed and moving around a great deal, I will not have any access to the heavier tools and facilities such an anvil, power hammer, forge, or large belt grinder. What I will have is an extensive Dremel set, 18v DEWALT hammer-drill, basic hand tools, possibly an acetylene torch and belt grinder, any additional portable tools and materials I can reasonably have shipped from the states, and finally substantial dedication, willpower, and motivation.

Can anyone recommend a few suitable projects to help me practically familiarize myself with at least some of the processes and concepts involved in bladesmithing, whether they apply to constructing and assembling a small, automatic pocketknife, a versatile utility knife, a respectable combat knife, or a large, live-edged sword? I have the motivation and the dedication, just not access to all the tools and resources. Once more, I am interested in field for the long term.

Finally, can anyone recommend resources (freeware/reasonably priced drafting software, design databases, etc.) suitable for planning blade geometry as well as blade composition and treatments?

I offer advance appreciation to any assistance that can be provided.
 
Hi Brian!

First of all...Thank you for your Service!

I've been retired for a while now, but my last tour of duty in the Middle East was spent in Qatar and around that general region. During that tour I was in charge of all security for Red Horse units though out the theater.
When I did get free time, I was at the Vehicle Maintenance area, forging blades, using the Oxy/Acty torch for a heat source, and the back of a big bench vise for an anvil.
My wife sent me a few hand tools and sanding supplies from my home shop, and I managed to produce 3 completed knives during the 9 month tour.
The most difficult part of making knife there was finding a way to heat treat them....hardening not so much as tempering. The mobile kitchen ovens are not the most accurate, and everybody was always worried that "The Colonel" would show up and want to know why the cooks where baking knife blades! :)
One of the cool things was there there were always materials from wrecked or damage vehicles around the Vehicle Maintenance area...and although I was never total sure of the exact material, I did what I could.
I gave all of those knives away, including one that got presented to the Base Commander, who really liked it.
Have someone stateside send you some books.....Wayne Goddard's $50 Knife Shop would be a good one, and just about anything on basic knifemaking would help you.
Be safe on your tour, and THANK YOU for serving!
 
You may want to start with a kit blade that you install handles on., specifically Knifekits.com has some button lock folders that you could build an auto from.

and I hit new forum members with this as a resource.


Have you seen this ?

The Standard Reply to New Knifemakers v13

The answer to a 13 year old student is different than to a 40 year old engineer.
We may recommend a local supplier, or you may have a helpful neighbour; but that depends on where you are. We have members worldwide.
Fill out your profile with your location (Country and State at least), age, education, employment
.

Look at the threads stickied at the top; many are expired, but not all.

The basic process in the simplest terms

Absolute Cheapskate Way to Start Making Knives-Printable PDF
Absolute Cheapskate Way to Start Making Knives-Website


Web Tutorials
Detailed instructions by Stacy E.Apelt

The Things I Advise New Knife Makers Against-Printable PDF

Handle Tutorial - Nick Wheeler-Website

http://www.engnath.com/manframe.htm

Books

A list of books and videos
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9435307&postcount=43

BladeForums - E-books or Google books
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=603203

I like:
David Boye-Step by Step Knifemaking
Tim McCreight-Custom Knifemaking: 10 Projects from a Master Craftsman
These are clear, well organized, widely available and inexpensive too.

Knife Design:
On the Google books thread, you can find
Lloyd Harding drawings
and
the Loveless book with large variety of proven classic styles.
Google books thread


Forging Books:
Lorelei Sims-The Backyard Blacksmith
An excellent modern book with colour photos for forging in general - no knifemaking.

Jim Hrisoulas- has 3 books on forging knives. Check for the cheaper paperback editions.
The Complete Bladesmith: Forging Your Way to Perfection
The Pattern-Welded Blade: Artistry in Iron
The Master Bladesmith: Advanced Studies in Steel

Machine Shop Basics -Books:
Elementary Machine Shop Practice-Printable PDF

The Complete Practical Machinist-Printable -1885-PDF
It’s being reprinted now, you can get it for $20 ish


The $50 knife Shop
It confused me for a long time.
Forging is NOT necessary; you can just file and grind to create a knife (stock removal)

The goop quench is total Bull, commercial quench oils are available, even grocery store canola oil works much better.

Junkyard steels require skill and experience to identify the steel and heat treat it properly.
You can buy proper steel like 1084FG from Aldo very cheaply.

I like cable damascus, but that advanced project has no place in a beginner’s book.

The home built grinders are the best thing about this book, but there is now a huge amount of info for 2x72” belt grinders on the web, including free plans.


Videos

Heat Treating Basics Video-downloadable
Right click and save this. Watch it once a day for 10 days and you will understand it much better.
http://www.archive.org/download/gov.ntis.ava08799vnb1/ava08799vnb1_512kb.mp4

Many specific how to knifemaking videos are available, some are better than others.

The best overall Knifemaking video I have seen is
“Steve Johnson-Making a Sub-Hilt Fighter”

The best video on leather sheath making I have seen is
“Custom Knife Sheaths -Chuck Burrows - Wild Rose”
-(Paul Long has 2 new videos, his sheath work is fantastic. I hope the videos are too)

Green Pete's Free Video
Making a Mora bushcraft knife, stock removal, hand tools, neo tribal / unplugged heat treat.
"Green Pete" posted it free using torrent files.
Be sure to look at the other titles too-The account index has disappeared, but search for LOTS of info.

Greenpete Knifemaking Basics-on TPB

You can see a list of videos and reviews at this rental company; some are worth buying, some renting…
http://smartflix.com/store/category/9/Knifemaking


Draw Filing Demonstration
YouTube video -Draw Filing-for a flat finish

Steel
The “welding steel” at Home Depot / Lowes… is useless for knives.
If you send out for heat treating, you can use O1, A2, D2, CM154, ATS34, s30v, 440C, plus many others.

If you heat treat yourself, find some 1070, 1080, 1084,
1084 FG sold by Aldo Bruno is formulated just for knifemaking.
http://njsteelbaron.com/
Phone # 862-203-8160

You can find a list of suppliers here
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=699736


Heat Treating
You can send blades out for heat treating at $10 or $15 per blade for perfect results, and avoid buying the equipment.

This PDF brochure gives a good overview
http://www.buckknives.com/resources/pdf/Paul_Bos_Brochure.pdf

http://www.petersheattreat.com/cutlery.html
http://www.texasknife.com/vcom/privacy.php#services
http://www.knifemaker.ca/ (Canadian)

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9143684&postcount=7

Grinder / Tools

Hand Tools
You can do it all by hand with files and abrasive cloth like the Green Pete video.

Photo of a nice bevel filing jig .
http://www.flemingknives.com/imagesPrime/FileStation/KPicB007.jpg

Entry Level Grinders
Many makers start with the Sears Craftsman 2x42 belt grinder.
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00921513000P?prdNo=3

Commercial Production 2 x 72” Belt Grinders
http://www.prometheanknives.com/shop-techniques-3/grinders

Mapp arm – Grinder Toolrest
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=466024


DIY 2 x 72” Belt Grinders

KMG Clone
Free Plans
http://www.dfoggknives.com/PDF/GrinderPlans.pdf

NWG No Weld Grinder
http://www.usaknifemaker.com/plans-for-the-no-weld-grinder-sander-nearly-50-pages-p-723.html

EERF Grinder (EERF =“Free” backwards)
Free plans
http://wilmontgrinders.com/EERFGrinder.aspx
http://blindhogg.com/blueprints.html
http://www.atlasknife.com


Buy the kit
http://polarbearforge.com/grinder_kit.html


Safety Equipment
Protect your -Eyes, Ears, Fingers, Lungs - take off jewelry and put on safety gear.

Respirators

The minimum I would consider are the 3M 7500 and North 7700 silicone half masks with a P100 Filter;
even better are the powered positive pressure fresh air systems.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=788837
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=726309


V13 Edited dead links
 
Last edited:
Thank you for your service. No I have not served, I thank those who do and have.

The easiest tool for planning knife profiles and designs is pencil (with a big eraser) and paper. I have a little "blank book" (about 5 inch by 7 inch) that I keep design ideas, notes etc in. You can get all sorts of knife steels from Aldo ( njsteelbaron.com) If you get an air hardening steel you can send it to Paul Bos heat treating service for heat treating (probably the best reputation) or Peters Heat Treating. You will then not have to worry about figuring out how to do the most critical part of the process yourself. If you want to do your own heat treating, get some 1084 from Aldo, you can do a reasonably good job of heat treating it with even the most rudimentary setup.

-Page
 
Can anyone recommend a few suitable projects to help me practically familiarize myself with at least some of the processes and concepts involved in bladesmithing, whether they apply to constructing and assembling a small, automatic pocketknife, a versatile utility knife, a respectable combat knife, or a large, live-edged sword? I have the motivation and the dedication, just not access to all the tools and resources. Once more, I am interested in field for the long term.

What if you took several blade blanks with you? They are not THAT big. You could work on these with a file, a board, a couple clamps, and sandpaper. In the meanwhile you build yourself a one-brick forge or something like that, keep your eyes open for suitable handle material and steel to continue building more knives once your blanks run out.

I don't feel there is that much to be gained designing/drawing knife designs on a computer, especially in a combat zone. Paper, pencil, straight-edge and french curve work pretty well. Actually I work out most of my ideas with cereal box cardboard and pair of scissors. I draw an outline of the knife (full tang) and cut it out. Then I continue to cut out variations on a theme, changing different aspects of the design. When I find something I like I already have a template to trace onto a piece of steel. You want to smack hot steel with a hammer, but maybe you could work on a stock removal blade or two until you can cobble together a working forge.


I am a novice to the forum as well as to the actual bladesmithing process...
Previously I had intended to construct a full-size, custom-fitted hauberk from titanium wire, then attempt to anodize it to brilliant onyx-black. However, research into the matter revealed that it is almost impossible to reliably anodize titanium black. Worse still, precisely welding thousands of individual titanium links would require a laser welder operating in an atmosphere completely devoid of the many elements found in atmospheric gases. Thus, regardless of the work and dedication put into the project it would still be extremely expensive due to the mass of skilled labor required, as well as the cost of the laser welder and a containment unit that will permit the fine manipulation of the links without contamination from exposure to atmospheric gases.


Yea, this is a great idea for a first knife!?!?!?! (Can you visualize me rolling my eyes back in disbelief?) I realize you have "extensive experience and knowledge in the realm of cold weapon (particularly edged weapon) evolution, historical role, varied cultural examples, materials, design, utilization (functioning as a tool and as a weapon), and blade geometry, in addition to a basic working knowledge of metallurgy as it applies to the distinction between hardness and toughness." I guess you just enjoy a challenge.

I suggest that you do what you can do. If you can't forge a blade right away you can still do stock removal. A big knife requires removal of a lot more steel than a small one does. This is a consideration when using files. I have no idea what sort or size of knife you would find most useful but for learning purposes consider a knife with a blade not more than 4" long, and not more than 1" wide (top to bottom), and 1/8" thick. Yea, I know EVERYBODY uses 1/4" stock for blades. Call me a rebel. We're talking about getting some experience under your belt before you make the knife of your dreams.

I've yammered on long enough and probably only made sense to myself. (Definitely OCS material, huh?)

Good luck, happy knife making, and God bless.

- Paul Meske
Alias LonePine
 
Hi Brian, there was a thread not too long ago by another guy wanting to make knives while deployed, it might answer some of your questions- http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=768881&highlight=deployment

If you are already familiar with the mechanics of edge geometry then there is probably no reason to spend too much time with software-based design, especially if you plan to smith (forge) you blades as opposed to stock removal.
IMO the best way to sink your teeth in is to design a small-ish blade, maybe 7" to 9" overall, from 1/8" or 5/32" stock, profile using the best means you have, and do the bevels by hand with files and then sandpaper. This will give you a taste of all the processes involved without sinking too much time into your first piece. Believe me, your second will be better, and the third even more so. Save the large/complex designs until you achieve some consistency with the simpler stuff.
If you plan to heat treat yourself with a torch, use a fairly simple oil hardening steel like 1080. If you plan to send it out for professional heat treat then you can choose from air-hardening and stainless steels also.
Thanks for your service, I will try to help out as more questions come up.
 
Mr. Caffrey,
Qatar, eh? Not a bad assignment; not a bad assignment at all. And I think you are right on the money regarding motor pool facilities.

Fellow smiths,
Thank you very much for the kind words, well wishes, fine advice, and words of encouragement and support (especially ‘012345678910’; SUPERB list of references and resources). Allow to clarify my previous post and answer questions. I apologize for how long it has taken me to reply; my processor melted and both hard drives are inoperable; I am sending this from work. And while I am fully aware that I need experience before attempting advanced projects, I am a person who prefers to plan months or years ahead.

I actually am not presently deployed, but will be in the very near future. I currently am intentionally keeping myself very lean on tools and materials until I know what my resources will be in terms of free time, facilities for me to utilize, and how long a stay I will have in theatre (not to mention how much moving around I will be looking at). I have absolutely no space to pack tools or resources into my bags, but once I know what my address is and what assets I will have access to, I will purchase the needed supplies online and have them shipped to me. Fortunately, I am a very resourceful shopper and know where to buy even the heaviest items (excluding anvils) online at good prices and still not have to pay for shipping. Bottom line: While I greatly appreciate the offers of spare materials, I won't be able to even receive them for a few months.

I expect my Dremel to serve me well for fine work such as decoration and handle shaping. Actually, for handle/scale material I intend to cut up some old, damaged uniforms, then laminate them in layers with an epoxy-like substance, essentially creating what I refer to as ‘U.S. Army Micarta'. Otherwise they just get shredded anyway. If I can find a non-flammable laminate, I will use my damaged fire resistant uniforms.

I intend to make friendly with the mechanics in the motor pool. That way they may let me use their grinders and torches (and hopefully one of them will teach me how to use the torch). This will allow me to cut, grind, sharpen (to a certain level), shape, and anneal steel. For blade material, I doubt I will have much trouble finding some old vehicle springs or suspensions, or possibly even some discarded vehicle armor (though considering modern composition, that likely would not be suitable for a functional blade, though it would fit beautifully with a handle of 'U.S. Army Micarta' to create an engaging thematic piece.... Sorry, I need to set that line of thought aside and stick it in the ‘Future Projects’ category).

I have packed away a basic drafting kit I assembled in anticipation of designing. Be that as I may, I would love advice on a decent drafting program suitable for these designs (and not in the $300+ range). This would allow me to safely store a large number of designs, as well as easily take elements from numerous projects and incorporate them into a single item (mixing and matching my favorite features). In all honesty, my TBI limits what I can repeatedly draw on paper with consistent scale and shape, so manual drafting tends to greatly frustrate me. Another reason I would prefer computer-aided drafting is that I think the best way for me (personally) to be competitive in the custom blade industry is to incorporate my strengths in composing exotic designs that will strongly interest the collector as opposed to user desiring utility. In other words, I routinely mentally design unusual items such as (literally) a flaming sword, spiked knuckle dusters with a spring-loaded retractable blade (automatic trench knife), telescopic automatic spike, collapsible spear, and numerous other designs which require precise mechanical planning and depictions of different alignments of moving parts. (Yes, I fully realize I am years away from actually being able to construct blades at this level, but I do greatly enjoy a challenge and an original design I can take pride in.) Given the likelihood of the forum having numerous members with experience as engineers or in mechanical industries, can anyone recommend a program that would be effective for my needs?
Can anyone recommend where to buy knifemaking books sold as e-books compatible with a Nook (such as PDFs)? I don't mean torrents (I have a serious ethical grievance when it comes to piracy), but rather a good book in a legitimate, legal electronic format. In my line of work hard copy books with photos and diagrams are very easily damaged/destroyed (even when off duty), as well as impractical due to spatial/weight considerations. Now I try to only purchase e-books I can put on my Nook. If it is a crucial volume, I can slice off the spine and run the pages through a scanner, but this absolutely will not happen until after I redeploy (I have way too much on my plate now).
Final questions: Since even stock removal may be impractical and I may be forced to only use a kit, is there any advice on choosing a kit/ vender of kits? I have found kits online, but they all seem to at least one of the following limitations: Too cheap; Lousy blade geometry; Does not indicate whether the shaped blade is already fully heat treated (If it is alterations will be much more difficult; If it isn't, I have several options but would rather know before purchasing). Also, does anyone know of venders still around that sell quality kits for automatics (I have the legal documentation needed for purchasing and possessing)? If not, any advise on finding appropriate components ideal for building an automatic? I read solid design information in Benson's “Switchblade: Ace of Blades”, but it was meant for the collector, not the designer or constructor.

Once more, thank you everyone for your assistance and well-wishing. I look forward to future correspondence.
 
Thanks for the advice. KnifeKits.com does seem to be what I was looking for. I was absolutely certain I had checked that site, but I must have been wrong. All the other kits I found online were very cheap (and I greatly appreciate quality).

Good find on the CD! I don't often get surprised like that. I would not have expected Amazon to sell in that format. I just hate their Kindle-ready e-book format (from what I can tell, instead of dowloading a .pdf you download a file that actually alters the Kindle Reader software, adding the book to the program itself; thus there is no easy way to put it on something else without buying third party software).
 
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