Some customers are just jerks.

T

TomW

Joined
Oct 7, 1998
Messages
1,128
Ask a knifemaker.
They supposedly take an interest in the makers knife then complain in a public forum about the way he might discount his knives to a dealer that breaks his hump promoting the makers knives while travelling all over the country doing it. The dealer that's been selling the makers knife for years. Long before he became famous.
They expect the knifemaker to answer their e-mails before they even go offline. Expect him to spend a hours of his 30 hour workday on the telephone going over their knife like it's his only order.
Then there is the guy that isn't a customer and probably never will be that still blocks the knifemakers table at a show telling him how knives should be made ,keeping the genuine potential customers from getting a chance to talk to the man.
Some knifemakers are jerks. Yep for sure.
And so are a lot of customers.
Am I right?
 
Word up !

After all, we are all human. Let the judging be left for the One who always watches us from above.
 
Tom,

You're absolutely on the money here. I know of collectors who have done exactly what you're talking about: stand in front of the maker and tell him all the things wrong with his knives, while simultaneously blocking the table from real customers. Outrageous!!! I've seen this at nearly every show I've been to. I guess to a certain extent I'm guilty of occasionally blocking a table in a conversation with a maker, but I try to be aware of other customers so that everyone can see and knives.

There are makers on my blacklist, I wonder if I'm on any makers blacklist??? :confused: :eek:

~Mitch
 
You're right Tom, and it's a shame. I am sure that there are plenty more pain in the ass customers than there are makers that are jerks.
 
Great thread Tom. More times than not I am amazed, bothered or amused by the stories of knifemaker friends. I have heard the most unusual and unrealistic stories regarding customers from makers than I have from any other profession that deals with the public.
 
It sounds like Tom has been to a knife show or two. Dealing with the public at large can provide a very unique perspective on the human race :)

Yep, there are plenty of customers and NON-customers who are total jerks or just inconsiderate people.

I find it amusing to see someone who really thinks they know knives and knifemaking criticizing a knifemakers work in person. There is a difference in a review and criticism after all. I will give them credit for not hiding behind a keyboard and e-sniping on the internet.

A Potential Customer dominating a table or knifemakers time is just as frustrating for other customers as I'm sure it is for the knifemaker. A few of us customers are patient enough to either wait the coversation out or come back later but, really, can't you share? :confused:

People whining about price? I don't see anyone holding a gun to your head forcing you to pay that much for a knife. Benchmade and Spyderco make a good value priced knife for the general public at large street market and, there are cheaper alternative from China, India and, Pakistan for those customers that don't value quality or their fingers. There are a lot of great knifemakers at all price ranges. After all, for an everyday user and beater, do you really need all the expense for the upgraded cosmetic features anyway? Yea, you may want them but, that doesn't effect the performance.

While there may be a few knifemakers who are jerks (probably just once caught out of context but, marked for life), by and large the general public sets the standard on the bad end of the scale. Nobody remembers the name of John Q. Public who was a total ass but, if a man or woman with a name and a singular instance of improper action or word, potentially caught out of context, will mark you for life because the public will indefinitely repeat and expand the incident over time.

In the end, we are all people who make mistakes. Those who make the most mistakes often believe they are always right (perfect :confused: ) and are often the harshest on others.
 
Originally posted by Sid Post
I find it amusing to see someone who really thinks they know knives and knifemaking criticizing a knifemakers work in person. There is a difference in a review and criticism after all.
Click to expand...

While there is little about human behavior that surprises me anymore, I cannot imagine criticizing a knifemaker's work at their table. It's just rude. When my wife and I are at a show, looking at a maker's work, and there's a deficiency in a knife (at least in my opinion -- I could be wrong) that one of us is interested in, I walk away from the table before explaining to my wife why I think the knife wouldn't be a good choice.
 
Sid is right. we all are humans who make mistakes.
Add to that that most makers are somewhat introverted or at least happy to work day in and day out alone in their shops, all of a sudden being put in a position of Marketing the knives they put part of their heart and soul into. and potential customers/collectors who are looking for a good deal on that one knife that just tweeks their fancy. It is an emotional time to be at knife shows both as makers and as buyers...I've been both, and it is no less difficult to be a good customer than it is to be a good maker/seller. We are dealing for some pretty high ticket items and the reputation behind those items... Some potential customers aren't used to negotiating for handmade goods in the price range of our knives...and those who are, usually are good folks to deal with. Many makers don't deal in this price range as buyers or sellers except at knife show...so many of us are a little out of a comfort zone at shows.
If you don't want some guy on the other side of the table to act the way he's acting, then figure out a way to turn him the direction you want...lead and he will usually follow. If you have someone who really isn't a potential buyer, using your knives and time to show what he believes he knows, steer him away from the topics he feels comfortable with and take him to an area where he can learn from you...you might turn him into a customer....and you might not....but it is a challenge we makers, as marketers, need to meet.
Stay Safe,
 
Sid is right. we all are humans who make mistakes.
Add to that that most makers are somewhat introverted or at least happy to work day in and day out alone in their shops, all of a sudden being put in a position of Marketing the knives they put part of their heart and soul into. and potential customers/collectors who are looking for a good deal on that one knife that just tweeks their fancy. It is an emotional time to be at knife shows both as makers and as buyers...I've been both, and it is no less difficult to be a good customer than it is to be a good maker/seller. We are dealing for some pretty high ticket items and the reputation behind those items... Some potential customers aren't used to negotiating for handmade goods in the price range of our knives...and those who are, usually are good folks to deal with. Many makers don't deal in this price range as buyers or sellers except at knife show...so many of us are a little out of a comfort zone at shows.
If you don't want some guy on the other side of the table to act the way he's acting, then figure out a way to turn him the direction you want...lead and he will usually follow. If you have someone who really isn't a potential buyer, using your knives and time to show what he believes he knows, steer him away from the topics he feels comfortable with and take him to an area where he can learn from you...you might turn him into a customer....and you might not....but it is a challenge we makers, as marketers, need to meet.
Stay Safe,
 
The excitement of a knife show put all of us in another world. We all make mistakes. The interpersonal dynamics within the world of knves are complex to the newcomer as well as those of us who have been here a long time.

Fate recently put a book in my hands, "Forgiveness, The Greatest Healer" by Jampolski. I find a lot of answers to human relations opportunities described within the pages.

A recent post described a man who was hard to get along with, who later died due to a brain disease. That thought really hit home. We never know what motivates some acts by those, both animals and people, we share time with. A few of the folks who really aggrivated me later came to be good friends when I gave them a chance.

All we can do is our best.
 
Ed, once again you have stated something very eloquently and I couldn't agree more.

Tom, I think that this topic needed to be addressed. It does seem that many customers seem to think that it is the maker that is being a jerk when in fact it may well be something that they inadvertently did or said that has caused a misunderstanding. It may also be that the maker has just had a customer from hell and you were unlucky enough to be the next person to talk to him.

I have always found that when you react to someone that is having a bad day with kindness and understanding they will usually turn out to be a lot better people than you first thought.
 
I guess I'm lucky. I can find humor in just about any given situation. Most of the time.
Greg
 
I guess I must be one of the lucky ones also as 99.9% of the people I 've met at shows were great.The makers, customers and even the tirekickers make this worthwhile.I have had only one real sour note, and that person saw my sheathwork in the Knives annual.He called me and asked for a quote.I was not expecting to hear from him but about three weeks later, I got his knife.I called to tell him that I received it,but he didn't have a phone.He gave me his moms phone and he doesn't live there.I had run out of belt clips the day before I got the knife and had placed and order for more the day I got it.He called two days later wondering why I wasn't done and just went off on me.I promptly told him I was sorry and that I would return his knife without the sheath next day.I paid for the shipping and returned all his money.I didn't think even the best sheath would have pleased him, so I just backed out.Fortunately customers like this seem to be rare.Dave:)
 
I spend day in and day out all alone in my shop. The only people I see are my wife, two kids and father-in-law. While I love my family to death, I sometimes crave a little more interaction. About once a month I can get out of the shop and hang with some friends. But this is mostly in another shop, or sometimes a luch or dinner.

When its time for a show, I love it. I don't care who is at my table, if they want to talk I am game. If they insult my work (sadly it does happen), I try to find out if they have a valid point. If they do, I try to learn from their input. If your tire kicking, thats fine too. I try hard to greet every person at my table. If that means postponing a current conversation then thats what I do. I do not believe that anyone has walked away from my table feeling brushed off.

Basically I am saying "its all good". Knives sell themselves. A person either likes it or does not. I am not a car salesman pushing a product. I give the info when asked but otherwise any topic is up for grabs.
 
from my side of the table i have learned to listen twice as long as i talk with a person. i have sold used cars:) and had alot of fun doing it. the rewarding part to me is everything from profile grind to the sale! instead of a faceless product.
 
Fun thread....

I'd love to hear about the worst experiences you've had with customers. That will help educate customers about what they might think is no problem but is in fact for the maker (like, call them to chat once in a while....)

I remember reading the autobiography of Robert Heinlein where ha talks about getting *tons* of fan mail, most of the time letters into which the fans had put a lot of time and thought. Each of them had probably put several hours into a letter, and replying in kind would soon have consumed his days, living no time for food or sleep, much less work! So after a while he resolved to some drastic solutions. I can't remember exactly what it was, maybe not respond, or respond with form letters? Anyway, it put a totally different spin on things.

JD
 
Originally posted by Gus Kalanzis
Great thread Tom. More times than not I am amazed, bothered or amused by the stories of knifemaker friends. I have heard the most unusual and unrealistic stories regarding customers from makers than I have from any other profession that deals with the public.
Click to expand...

Hehe...you try being in the IT department somedays. Hmmm...Maybe it's the same customers?;)

-SB
 
I've got an interesting customer story.

At the Blade Show '89 I was standing behind the table and a blind man (dark glasses and white walking stick) with a beautiful wife on one side, and an equally beautiful daughter on the other stopped in front of my table. I greeted them and the man asked if he could "look at my knives". I thought that odd but said, sure, please do. He picked up one of my first folders and "let his fingers do the looking". He held it for 5 minutes or so and I asked him if he "saw" anything wrong. He pointed out several things that I seriously had trouble seeing. He told me to "let my fingers look" and handed me the knife. Sure enough, I could feel the places he pointed out, just couldn't "see" them.

I learned a valuable lesson that I use everyday. Next time you finish up a knife, use your eyes and fingers to "look" at it.

BTW, he bought the knife. :)
 
Wow... that should really have been an enlightening experience... :eek:
Anyway, I'm one of those guys who can remain at the table of a maker whose knives I like for more than an hour, but I always care to stand BESIDE the table, so others can have a real view, and if I chat with the maker am careful to leave others see and real customers buy, without monopolizing the maker's time. After all he's there to sell his knives and make them known to the public :D
I find that there's no harm in criticizing a maker's work as long as you do it in a polite and, above all, constructive way, and I've found that most makers are actually happy of the feedback. Obiously there's a HUGE difference between saying "I like it, but why don't you do some of these without the enmgravings? They could be very nice anyway with their clean lines" and saying "What's this crap?" :D
Unfortunately, even without being a knifemaker, I personally witnessed a couple of such cases, when I was at the table of a couple makers in Milano show. After which me and the maker exchanged long looks along the line of "what a jerk!"
:rolleyes:
But I guess if somebody wants to be exposed to the public, he'd better grow a tough skin, as the public is full of inconsiderate, rough people...
 
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