Some interesting reading............. and stuff.

[Clay]

http://cutlerscove.com/customfolders/butterfly-tak.htm

http://starbulletin.com/1999/03/18/news/story3.html

http://www.cs.cmu.edu/afs/cs.cmu.edu/user/wbardwel/public/nfalist/auto_knives/taylor_v_us.txt

http://www.tcce.gc.ca/appeals/decision/ap91122e/ap91122e.htm

I thought this little blip was interesting (the 800 AD part):
One interesting weapon of Arnis is the indigenous balisong. To the western world, the balisong is a new weapon, but to Filipinos, the knife’s ancestry dates back to 800 A.D. Its name was derived from the barrio of Balisong in Batangas which is famous for its "butterfly knives" whose blade is known to pierce coins. It could have also come from the Tagalog words "bali" (to break) and "sung-ay" (animal horn). The most common handle of the balisong is carved from animal horn, especially deer. The balisong is one of the favorite knives of the Filipino, which is useful not only as a self-defense weapon but also for shaving. Some carry it for its artistic value, particularly the design and the fascinating sound it makes while being manipulated. In Arnis, the balisong is taught in the most advanced level with safety and respect as very important components for learning.

The above was found in here:
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/edessaramos/Arnis2.html



------------------
Clay
www.balisongxtreme.com
Because......
getting 'em open
is half the fun!

 

[JohnR7]

>>The most common handle of the balisong is carved from animal horn, especially deer.

Deer are not native to the Philippines, and so it is not as common material to use for Balisong Knives. Also, a handle made out of deer antler would be a stag handle not horn. What they often use is the horn from the Carabao. That is a very common animial used even today to plow the land or for transportation. My wife tells a story about when her brother sent his son to get the Carabao. Only it was dark out and he brought home the neighbors by mistake. So her brother was all worried the neighbor would be upset. But it was no problem and everyone got a good laugh out of it. Thanks, JohnR7
<img src=http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/Harbor/4250/carabao.jpg>

 

[DETONICS]

As Clay stated "sung-ay" for ANIMAL HORN,
it is not necessarily deer antler or stag,
although they often use them, when they are
available for their custom orders , for they
are nicer than carabao horns. But lately they
use bones and make them look like antler or
stag handle.So yes,they do have deers in
Philippines , not too many, especially lately
for they do not have hunting laws (except from the BALAHAP's & N.P.A's).And I could undrstand why your brother-in-law would get worried, most people in Philippines would kill for their carabao , for most of them
it's their helper to support and feed their
family. Nice picture though.....

 

[Gollnick]

Actually, Tak Fukuta did not make that knife. He designed it, but it was made by American Blade, though in Japan. Anyway, Tak Fukuta did make one handmade prototype. I'll leave you to guess who's collection that piece is in. Some of you may have seen it in a "vault" appearance last year.

I've heard wild claims that these knives go way back in the Philippines, but nobody has produced a single shard of evidence for me. The earliest knives I've seen and the earliest documented evidence I've seen point to Europe, especially France, in the mid or late 1700s.



------------------
Chuck
Balisongs -- because it don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing!
http://www.balisongcollector.com

 

[Lew]

I've got one of those in my collection...

Thanks for the info Clay...

Lew
http://members.xoom.com/Ken_M.1/LewCollection.htm http://home.san.rr.com/balisongfans/galleries/lew/index.html




[This message has been edited by Lew (edited 08-30-2000).]

 

[JohnInNH]

I looked at the post of the 1 of 600 1984 ABC blade made by Tak Fukuta ... Funny *I* have #1 of 600 on my desk in front of me as I type. I wonder how many #1 of 600 knives there are!

(Clay I sent you a pic of mine.... FYI)

Humm... was I ripped off? OR the knife in that pic on the web is now in my office.

[This message has been edited by JohnInNH (edited 08-30-2000).]

 

[Clay]

JohninNH,
I don't think you got ripped off. I think you just mis-interpreted the "one of 600" as a serial number, when I think it actually means you have one knife in a batch of 600......... as do 599 other people.

Did anyone read that legal document about a shipment of Taylor Balis detained by customs??? It was pretty interesting (to me anyway) to see how much thought and effort goes in to preventing us from having a Balisong.

------------------
Clay
www.balisongxtreme.com
Because......
getting 'em open
is half the fun!

 

[JohnInNH]

Gee,

Clay I have no idea why *I'd*

think that.. Seems every OTHER #/## I have is like that. If you bought a "Print" and it was #1/of 10 wouldn't YOU think it was the first of a series! I'm Sure our knives from Mr. Ralph will be like that

I'm not busting you about it. But I was sold a #1 of 600 and there is NOTHING to discourage me or others from thinking the same way, like a comment, "All knives marked as 1 of 600". Buyer beware!

I personally feel it is a huge scam!

Maybe I'm just stupid and knives are that way. All the artwork I own is not. How about the BM knives of the pre production...

I'm digressing sorry.

FYI the Tak Fukuta I have has the kick ground off and the cups are to deep. It closes and opens sloppily. For SHAME on the blade grinder! But it has nice looking handles

To bad such a nice looking knife was assembled so poorly. My understanding was the handles were made by Tak and they were assembled in mass. But that may be BS too.

Rants of a frustrated bloke subject to declining QC and commonplace fraud. Gee just look at the President ...fine example .... oh never mind.

 

[Lew]

Mine says the same thing, 1 of 600.

But the dealer I bought mine from did tell me it was 1 of the batch of 600. He was honest about it...

Lew
http://members.xoom.com/Ken_M.1/LewCollection.htm http://home.san.rr.com/balisongfans/galleries/lew/index.html

 

[Gollnick]

They all say 1 of 600 except for mine which says "Prototype" in Tak's own handwritting. (Sorry, just had to get that in.)

The number on these knives is inked on. You would have to make a different stencil for each knife if you wanted to individually number them. So, the "One of 600" means just that. The rest of you have one of the six hundred production pieces that were made, not necessarily the first one, just one of the six hundred made.

Benchmade used to acid-etch their pre-production and first-production knives. Again, this process uses a stencil. To avoid having to make several hundred expensive stencils, they just marked them all "One of X". This does not apply to Bali-Songs because they did not release any new Bali-Song models under this process. Today, BM uses a very impressive laser etching machine to mark their blades. It's almost as fun to watch as the laser cutting machines which never cease to captivate me. It's relatively simple and low-cost to have this machine increment a serial number. So, now BM actually individually serial numbers their pre- and first-production runs just as they did on the 42.

Anyway, sorry to dash the pride of all of you who thought you owned serial number one of the Tak Fukutas. Remember, if it IS really special, it's probably already in MY collection.



------------------
Chuck
Balisongs -- because it don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing!
http://www.balisongcollector.com

 

[Gollnick]

Sorry, but I'm just gloating over a few recent acquisitions... some of which I may eventually post pictures of.

But, when I get a spectacular new piece, I often go through a very possessive phase where I don't want anyone else to even look at it. It's mine... all mine... and nobody else can even look at it much less touch it. Sometimes, I get over this and will display and even let other people handle the knife. I don't know why I get this way. It just happens.



------------------
Chuck
Balisongs -- because it don't mean a thing if it ain't got that swing!
http://www.balisongcollector.com

 

[JohnInNH]

The Blade of the Tak I have is "etched" and Inked. Looking at the etching of the 1 of 600 there is no room for any more than 1 or 2 digits.. so, had I seen the knife, I would have realized it was not serialized.

I stand corrected and humbled. However...

It also says "HANDMADE BY TAKFUKUTA" (printing is in caps FYI I'm not yelling) I would believe a customer should be justified in believing it WAS made by him, not just the prototype. Maybe Tak did make all 600

What SHOULD a person think if they read that? If the knife was not handmade by him, it's false advertising IMHO

It should have read "Original by ..." or "Designed by..." not "HANDMADE BY TAKFUKUTA" If, in fact, he did not make each knife.

I love the handles it is a beautiful piece. I do wish the blade had been fit correctly with a "kick" and proper pin/cup fit. It would have made it exceptional! If there were a way to add a kick and fit a proper pin size w/o devaluing the knife I would do it. Any takers?

I'm not really angry just sad .. such potential!