some wood carving, mora, ratweiler, rat trap

[Cliff Stamp]

I started off by splitting a small round with the Rat Trap. Split it twice to get three slabs, this compacted the face of the liner lock visibly. The lock is a little floppy now meaning if I snap my wrist I can hear it move. Still stable under spine whacks though.

I cut a spoon first. I used the Ratweiler to cut it basically to shape by chopping, this is many times faster than carving, less than a minute to take the basic shape. Using a narrow mora the handle was refined and the hollow cut out with the point. The really small and narrow blade works very well here.

The Mora doesn't actually doesn't cut into the wood any better than the Ratweiler as that knife has a similar edge grind. It is slightly more obtuse at the very edge, 12-14 per side, but once the edge goes over 0.015" it sweeps back to 8-10 and then even more acute once it hits the primary grind.

However the overall handling of the Mora is much better and the tip is much more able to work in the hollow. The narrow blade also readily cuts the rounds necessary to taper the handle into the spoon. It is also much lighter of course and thus the fatigue is lower.



I then repeated this making a spatula, which is very similar to a spoon but jsut much easier as you are carving a flat and not a hollow.



The handle is thin as there was insect damage but it only has to turn foods so it doesn't need serious strength anyway.



A digging stick, basically a flat heavy spoon, with a pointed top to give it more pick function.



It easily goes through some sod and pops up some decent rocks, saving the edge on the Mora for easier cutting :



-Cliff

 

[hikeeba]

Neat stuff Cliff! You never cease to amaze and inspire me. Thanks!

 

[kel_aa]

Do the Rat trap and Ratweiler have similar blade geometries? I find the wooden handles of the Moras much more comfortable than Opinel handles for wood working.

Can you give more details on the chopping? My prefered method of material removal is batoning.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

Do the Rat trap and Ratweiler have similar blade geometries?

The Rat Trap is a 1/8" thick folder, the Ratweiler a 1/4" thick, 7" long bowie style blade. The edge geometries are in fact almost identical as I reground both to similar profiles. The Rat Trap just doesn't have the extra sweep in the last 0.015" of edge as it doesn't see the same kind of chopping impacts as the Ratweiler does.

I find the wooden handles of the Moras much more comfortable than Opinel handles for wood working.

I like the Opinels for a folder, but there are ergonomic issues with the blade slot and locking ring, minor though compared to using a Sebenza or similar though.

Can you give more details on the chopping? My prefered method of material removal is batoning.

Starting off with a stick :



You chop it to shape with something suitable. Here a Bruks Wildlife was used. This was a piece of knotty pine, there isn't much worse wood to use to try to make something out of. The wood is soft and weak and full of knots which make it very difficult to carve and it is prone to fracture. To clip off the knots, lead with the extremes of the bit, the toe or the heel. You want to work very hard with well controlled impacts.

You first just plane off the head, basically chopping the axe into the wood and then turning it to make the cuts run vertical. You then cut out the basic handle by going in on a 45 under the handle and then going up to the head and repeating. The cuts under the handle prevent it from splitting off. You first frame out a very square looking object. This only takes less than five minutes, and most of that was wasted removing the knots.




and a decent taper :



You can finish the project with the axe, but smoothing out the handle and refining the blade is much more efficient with a knife. I used the same Mora in the above here again. The axe cuts pretty much the same on woods because again the edge is almost the same. However the blade is much lighter in hand and much easier to turn and refine the handle.



It isn't actually any more productive at this stage than when it was just cut with the axe. It just looks nicer. You can finish it by sanding and applying a coat of linseed oil. This wasn't done here as this was a demonstration piece I did awhile ago for my 10 year old nephew on basic wood working.



You can do this in less than 15 minutes with the right tools. It takes far longer if you want everything smooth and symmetrical. It is much easier if the wood can be split well, but that was way too knotty. On a larger piece you can make it easier to cut out the handle by sawing into the wood at intervals which makes it easier to cut off the waste. Mears demonstrates this on TV. The local woods are not however hard enough to make that productive.

Neat stuff ...

There is a lot of this in Mear's TV series, it is interesting watching if you like primitive tools and outdoor living.


-Cliff

 

[laurens]

no surprise that the mora was the best carver .cliff what mears episodes do you get over there the early tracks series or the newer episodes.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

Bushcraft, and Extreme Survival. What would be interesting would be to see a TV show where several of such individuals on a show presented and discussed their methods as many of the "experts" are in conflict about several key issues. Have say for example each of them train a group of people for a short period of time and then test them on basic skills and see which group is more productive/efficient. Swap around the chosen optimal gear and see which group is more versatile. Move them to different enviroments and see which group adapts better. The group should be diverse to see if the methods are dependent on physical ability.

The handle on the slim Mora is a high point for most wood carving as it is neutral in orientaton. Most current knives, especially the tacticals are focused on 1-2 specific grips, usually hammer. Security is often high through use of deep finger choils however if you turn the handle around and attempt to use the knife as you would a crooked blade, that index finger point goes right into your palm.

The Paramilitary is nice in this regard as even though the index finger choil is significant, it is really well rounded and this works well against the palm. However the clip is squarish and could really benefit from an upgrage to the newer rounder clips. I tend to prefer the wire frame ones for maximum ergonomics, but you could get better comfort if the flat ones had similar well rounded edges.

-Cliff

 

[darkestthicket]

Cliff,

I would love to see a tv show such as the one you described, Tom Brown had a tracking tv show somewhat similar to that but i did not have direct tv at that time so i never got to see it. That would so rock.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

There is growing interest in it now however much of the so based shows tend to be "enhanced" to sell to the general public. Watch for example "Ted or Alive". Nugent makes outdoormen look like the worst kind of idjits by the way he acts on TV. He does teach them basic skills and have them compete, such as for example a few lessons on x-bows and then target shooting, but then he has tasks like drive around a track and see how many animals you can run over, they are stuffed and explode with simulated blood when hit.

-Cliff

 

[darkestthicket]

"but then he has tasks like drive around a track and see how many animals you can run over, they are stuffed and explode with simulated blood when hit."


Holy sweet baby jesus! ill have to find this! the only shows i generally find are survivorman (les stroud is hillarious especially when one of his methods fail)
and another one on Naty Geo, called extreme situations or something like that. If i can find Ted or Alive ill have to tivo it, do you know the station?

Edit:
Ted making outdoorsmen look like idjits? hes been doing that for years! muahahah.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

In Canada they are all on OLN, Ted really plays up the "wild man" approach and is extremely dramatic and graphic. Referring to butchers for example as assassins you pay to kill your animals for you.

-Cliff

 

[darkestthicket]

In Canada they are all on OLN, Ted really plays up the "wild man" approach and is extremely dramatic and graphic. Referring to butchers for example as assassins you pay to kill your animals for you.

-Cliff

Oh yeah checking the tv for this show when i get home, i believe i i have oln, and the wifey likes Nuge so this should be interesting if for nothing other than a good laugh, thanks Cliff.

 

[LHD]

(les stroud is hillarious especially when one of his methods fail)

In the first episode when he attempted to "grab a bird" I about wet myself. He's mostly full of reasonably good info but every now and then he does something rediculous.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

The show has lots of nice information about fire starting and shelter building, but there is just way too much "I'll just do this and hope nothing goes wrong". Over and over he does something that could get you killed if the weather turns, or chance doesn't favor you such as eating wild mushrooms you can't identify, stagnant water you have not purified, not building a shelter, etc. . It would be fine if it was clearly entertainment like Survivor where you watch people hack at ferrocium rods with machetes and chop them in two, but when someone constantly speaks to the audience as an instructor, is billed as an expert, references himself teaching survival, etc. . Mear's does something similar as he takes famous survival stories and describes what regular people did to survive and then talks about what you can do better in a similar situation.

-Cliff

 

[kel_aa]

Can you give more details on the chopping?

Starting off with a stick...

Okay, so here you are talking about using an axe. Would a flat/high saber fixed blade on 4mm stock in the 9 inch region be a decent subsitute?

I know you have some large chopper blades. How important is it to you that when you are in a more remote area to have one of those acessible compared to commonly carried pocket knives and smaller fixed blades (<=5 inch class)? From a monetary point of view if you can afford some of the nicer folders you can afford a niced blade (most budget would probably be Becker, then going to Trailmaster/Swamp Rat...?), but the utility seems dubious as well as being very unPC. It looks like you clear plots of land regularily and you enjoy using large choppers. But for something like camping or making a shelter, does one really want to chop down so many polls and such? What are your perspectives on this?

 

[Cliff Stamp]

Okay, so here you are talking about using an axe. Would a flat/high saber fixed blade on 4mm stock in the 9 inch region be a decent subsitute?

A 7.5 inch blade with the right balance will be in the range of 50-75% of the chopping ability of a quality hatchet like the Bruks on small woods, 2-4". The knife gets relatively better on smaller woods and worse on larger woods. This is enough to make the chopping power very useful from a shaping perspective meaning much faster than trying to carve off woods. It also has enough length to split wood really well as a froe which unfortunately is a long forgotton tool apparently :

http://www.kk.org/cooltools/archives/000583.php

But for something like camping or making a shelter, does one really want to chop down so many polls and such?

No, you want to minimize the amount of wood you have to cut; felling is dangerous, it wears your tools, and requires effort. In a survival situation you really don't seek out that kind of work, the only real use for it would be recreation/excercise/experience. You should be looking for deadfall. Such as :



Which almost has the basic frame constructed. Fill it out with dead sticks :



The only real cutting comes from making the overlay :



This was done with a Manix in a short period of time as there was a lot of dead wood on the ground. Now in the winter (if there is heavy snow) there is more reason to chop/split woods because you can't go digging up the wood on the ground, plus even if you could it would be frozen in place.

A decent chopping tool will cut 1-2" poles almost instantly of moderate woods like spruce, meaning just a few cuts. They will also shear off branches of large fir trees very quickly and thus you can frame out a bough cave easily in 10-15 minutes and form a wind/snow break. However even with such tools you still look for dead woods first.

Aside from larger tasks, the ability to split/chop wood is fundamental to all wood craft. Shaping spoons, or clubs, or walking sticks, or making bows are all usually much more effective if the wood is split. Even when splitting isn't necessary, like this bird snare there is still benefit to a larger chopping tool :



The main pole has to be cut, pointed at both ends, a hole drilled in the top, and the bait stick cut and pointed. This was done with a Paramilitary by spine impact chopping, but would have been many times faster with a small axe / large blade. A decent saw can substitute as well but is generally much more limited than the blade/axe. Very few traditional carpenters won't have a solid assortment of chopping/splitting tools for these reasons.

There is a massive amount of arguement built around implication the larger knives are a huge burden. In reality, even the larger ones are the weight of a small bottle of water and these are the ones with the full thickness tangs and such, the pure wood craft versions are significantly lighter. Of course the large TOP's blades with the shallow sabre grinds don't make that class of knives look very productive as wood craft tools and most wood workers would find them ridiculus looking. But that is an inane arguement, it would be like juding the abilities of axes from the crude versions you find in hardware stores or the really thick tactical prybar/entry tools.

-Cliff

 

[kel_aa]

I've made a bird trap like that too. The string is wedged between the trigger and post? What are you using as bait? Have you ever caught anything in such a trap?

Yeah, I don't think it's a big burden in terms of weight in most instances (although it may be an unnesscessary weight for some). Having a 12- 15 inch object hanging from the waist will not be as comfortable as a 9 inch object though for sure. So suppose you are at a provincial park where people do day-hikes. Do you bat a brow at someone with their 9inch chopper? You wonder are they going to build a log-cabin or something. I suppose one shouldn't care what other people think, but sometimes you can't help feeling something's out of place.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

I've made a bird trap like that too. The string is wedged between the trigger and post? What are you using as bait?

Yes, a knot holds the stick in place. It wasn't baited, I have been meaning to actually spend some time trapping/snaring. The basics like Codger noted awhile ago are simple but actually being productive catching them is a different matter.

Having a 12- 15 inch object hanging from the waist will not be as comfortable as a 9 inch object though for sure.

A lot of it is dependent on body size. Someone 6'4" and someone 5'4" have different viewpoints on large objects. Most tradesmen won't even feel a knife on the hip due to being used to very large work pouches full of nails, tape, hammer, screwdriver, square, etc. . They also judge even the largest of knives as very light because compared to a hammer most knives are weightless.

So suppose you are at a provincial park where people do day-hikes. Do you bat a brow at someone with their 9inch chopper?

I'd be curious as to why they were carrying it and ask them to see it. This is a really rural place. I was fishing awhile ago with some friends and someone got into trouble close by and emergency responce was called to get them out. By the time the cops/firemen arrived everything was ok. I was talking to the cops with a massive amount of knives on me, folders and several belt knives including one very large chopper. I was carrying them just to work with them on the fish.

-Cliff

 

[DOC-CANADA]

I was talking to the cops with a massive amount of knives on me, folders and several belt knives including one very large chopper. I was carrying them just to work with them on the fish.

-Cliff

I would love to seen the look on their faces!
Doc