I have been thinking about getting a small fixed blade for general utility, and like Marble's knives for their traditional designs. I was wondering if anyone has an opinion on which would make the best, all-round utility knife, the Sport or the Trailcraft?
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Sport or Trailcraft
- Thread starter W.T. Beck
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I'd persoanlly buy neither if it's made by "Marble's Outdoors". The rumor is that they don't even make the knives in Michigan themselves anymore. The rumor is that Camillus is makng these fixed blades for "Marble's Outdoors" and until recently there was very little known about this mysterious Alchemite MC steel that was being used.
Now if I were looking to buy a Marble's knife then I'd be looking for an aftermarket dealer who has some 1997 -2000 new (old) stock and buy one of these fine knives. During this brief period "Marble Arms" was being run by the Stewart family (now ownwer/operators of Bark River Knife & Tool) and they made very nice knives from 52-100 ball bearing steel (on the smaller hunters) and 5160 steel (on the larger Trailmakers). These knives that I'm refering to are well documented real life users, that as an added benefit happen to do really well for themselves on the secondary resale market. Many of these knives, that originally sold under $100.00, now fetch almost 1.5 to 2 times their original MSRP. This says something to me.
Also, since I've mentioned "Bark River Knife & Tool", maybe you should give their knives a looksee as well. Many of their prototypes are being sold currently for >$65.00. I'm not sure if they're producing leather handled knives as of yet but I think I remember hearing that they were going to give it a try. I myself hope so. I've read nothing but rave reviews regarding this new knife company. *Note - There was some problems with the sheaths that they were having made because the weren't holding up to the wickedly sharp convex grind that Mike Stewart puts on a knife. I understand that this problem is being worked out by going with a better leather that is more suited for the task.
It seems to me that buying a BRK&T knife would be much like buying a 1997 - 2000 Marble's without the associated high price tag. The best of both worlds, no??
As for the new "Marble's Outdoors" knives, well, they may prove to be good knives after all but for me the jury is still out and I'm not wasting my "hard earned's" until some good reviews roll down the road. Actually, strike that, I'm really not interested in investing any money into the new "Marble's Outdoors" company. I'll buy 1997 - 2000 and pre WWII but not any of this this Alchemite MC stuff or any of the business that the new Marble's is selling.
--The Raptor--
*Note - If you want to know more about this subject then check out the (factory abandoned) Marble's forum over at KFC and read all about it.
Now if I were looking to buy a Marble's knife then I'd be looking for an aftermarket dealer who has some 1997 -2000 new (old) stock and buy one of these fine knives. During this brief period "Marble Arms" was being run by the Stewart family (now ownwer/operators of Bark River Knife & Tool) and they made very nice knives from 52-100 ball bearing steel (on the smaller hunters) and 5160 steel (on the larger Trailmakers). These knives that I'm refering to are well documented real life users, that as an added benefit happen to do really well for themselves on the secondary resale market. Many of these knives, that originally sold under $100.00, now fetch almost 1.5 to 2 times their original MSRP. This says something to me.
Also, since I've mentioned "Bark River Knife & Tool", maybe you should give their knives a looksee as well. Many of their prototypes are being sold currently for >$65.00. I'm not sure if they're producing leather handled knives as of yet but I think I remember hearing that they were going to give it a try. I myself hope so. I've read nothing but rave reviews regarding this new knife company. *Note - There was some problems with the sheaths that they were having made because the weren't holding up to the wickedly sharp convex grind that Mike Stewart puts on a knife. I understand that this problem is being worked out by going with a better leather that is more suited for the task.
It seems to me that buying a BRK&T knife would be much like buying a 1997 - 2000 Marble's without the associated high price tag. The best of both worlds, no??
As for the new "Marble's Outdoors" knives, well, they may prove to be good knives after all but for me the jury is still out and I'm not wasting my "hard earned's" until some good reviews roll down the road. Actually, strike that, I'm really not interested in investing any money into the new "Marble's Outdoors" company. I'll buy 1997 - 2000 and pre WWII but not any of this this Alchemite MC stuff or any of the business that the new Marble's is selling.
--The Raptor--
*Note - If you want to know more about this subject then check out the (factory abandoned) Marble's forum over at KFC and read all about it.
Thanks for the info, Raptor. But I am not sure why having the knives made by Camillus would be a bad thing. Last I heard, the Camillus knives are made in the US, and are of high quality. At least Marble's hasn't exported any jobs to a Third World country.
The reason I like the Marble's knives is that they have sufficiently long brass guards. In fact, the new ones have longer guards than the old ones. I looked at some of the Bark River knives and they did not appear to have the long guards I am seeking.
I have more concern than most about accidental cuts. I take blood thinning medicine and have to be very careful about cutting myself, as I could bleed to death from a small cut. For this reason I choose knives with the longest possible guards.
The reason I like the Marble's knives is that they have sufficiently long brass guards. In fact, the new ones have longer guards than the old ones. I looked at some of the Bark River knives and they did not appear to have the long guards I am seeking.
I have more concern than most about accidental cuts. I take blood thinning medicine and have to be very careful about cutting myself, as I could bleed to death from a small cut. For this reason I choose knives with the longest possible guards.
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Hi W.T.,
Your point regarding the guard issue is well taking. I happen to agree with you regarding the guard size even without being in your condition.
As for the Camillus issue....I'm not knocking them in any respect, but rather Marble's Outdoors, for not being forthright in their business practices in the more recent past. Why make consumers quess what they're buying? I just don't like it.
So many people see the Marble's name and associate it with their respectable cutlery history. I just want the record to stand that they've changed that history, for better or worse, over the past couple of years and this should be noted.
I'm sorry I couldn't answer your question directly and also for taking your thread in this direction but I just couldn't let someone buy something that they may be thinking is something that it's not.
--The Raptor--
Your point regarding the guard issue is well taking. I happen to agree with you regarding the guard size even without being in your condition.
As for the Camillus issue....I'm not knocking them in any respect, but rather Marble's Outdoors, for not being forthright in their business practices in the more recent past. Why make consumers quess what they're buying? I just don't like it.
So many people see the Marble's name and associate it with their respectable cutlery history. I just want the record to stand that they've changed that history, for better or worse, over the past couple of years and this should be noted.
I'm sorry I couldn't answer your question directly and also for taking your thread in this direction but I just couldn't let someone buy something that they may be thinking is something that it's not.
--The Raptor--
Thanks again for responding, Raptor. You make a good point about the steel issue, with Marble's calling it Alchemite instead of naming the actual steel. It is like Cold Steel using the name Carbon V as if it is a unique type, while reports are that it is whatever ordinary steel they are using at the moment. I think in both cases what is currently being used is 176 (not sure if I've got this right) - the same steel that Camillus uses in its BK&T line.
I think if a company uses some phony name to mask the actual steel they use, they should be charged with deceptive advertising. It makes it appear that they have developed some new, advanced steel, when in fact it is an ordinary steel that has been in use for a long time.
I think if a company uses some phony name to mask the actual steel they use, they should be charged with deceptive advertising. It makes it appear that they have developed some new, advanced steel, when in fact it is an ordinary steel that has been in use for a long time.
Buzzbait
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I've tried both the Sport and the Trailcraft. I personally prefer the Trailcraft because of the longer handle. A short handle and a large guard can be a little uncomfortable in my hand. But if you really want the longer blade of the Sport, it's a superb knife with a dynamite blade shape. As far as grinds go, my Trailcraft has the thinner cutting edge, which is also to my preference.
Unfortunately, you'll probably want an aftermarket sheath either way you go. The newer sheaths are nothing to write home about.
Another great option is the Blackjack Small available at Knifeware.com . The Small is like a Trailcraft with a smaller handle and no ricasso. You can get it in either AUS-10 stainless or 1095 carbon steel. The standard sheath is better than a Marbles sheath, and the optional back pocket sheath can be a huge convenience. The Blackjack Slick looks pretty cool too, although I've never tried one.
Unfortunately, you'll probably want an aftermarket sheath either way you go. The newer sheaths are nothing to write home about.
Another great option is the Blackjack Small available at Knifeware.com . The Small is like a Trailcraft with a smaller handle and no ricasso. You can get it in either AUS-10 stainless or 1095 carbon steel. The standard sheath is better than a Marbles sheath, and the optional back pocket sheath can be a huge convenience. The Blackjack Slick looks pretty cool too, although I've never tried one.
I have looked at some of the other brands, like Bark River and Blackjack, and it does look like better quality knives are available for similar prices to the Marble's offerings. I was especially impressed with the fact that Bark River uses A2 steel in some of their smaller knives, along with micarta scales.
But, in my case I have to put alot of emphasis on a secure grip, and I don't see anything that compares to the Gamegetter handles that can be gotten on Marble's knives. It's a most unfortunate dilemma!
But, in my case I have to put alot of emphasis on a secure grip, and I don't see anything that compares to the Gamegetter handles that can be gotten on Marble's knives. It's a most unfortunate dilemma!
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In reply to your saying that Marbles out doors does not make their knives in Michigan I can understand your confusion as I have heard this many times from many sources, but let me be the first to say, I make Marble Outdoors knives in Gladstone,MI. Now as to your comment on the mystery steel that they use, I will agree that it is a mystery to me as well, it is only labled as "high carbon steel" and that is as much as I am told, or allowed to be told. As to Mr. Becks' query on what knife to use, I would go for the Sport just because the Trailcraft has been discontinued, unless you are able to find one that is in a dealers hand.