- Joined
- Nov 18, 2006
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Originally, I set out to do a Spyderco Sage vs. Native IV thread. I ordered a Sage at the beginning of last week, and when it arrived, I wasn't 100% happy with it, so I went on and ordered a Native IV.
When the Native arrived, however, I realized that however similar they may look in pictures, they are very different knives.
Where the Sage is an open-backed, lightweight liner lock with a leaf shaped blade, the Native is a more solid feeling, slightly heavier but thinner and more compact lock back with a spearpoint blade.
The Sage is more of lightweight gent's knife, where the Native is a tough, compact utility knife made of upscale materials with a nice design.
The Sage has phosphor bronze washers, where the Native IV is a washerless design like the Caly 3. This makes it thinner than the Sage, but it will probably start to show the same circular wear pattern from opening and closing that the Caly 3 does.
One of the surprising differences, considering how similar they look in even my own pictures, is the size and shape of the handles.
They are really nothing alike, past being about the same general shape. The handle of the Native is thinner and smaller than the very large handle on the Sage, which is the opposite of what I originally expected.
The Sage's handle feels very large in-hand.
By contrast, the Native's handle is still large enough to be comfortable, but not large enough to over-extend past the palm like the sage, or to keep your fingers spread rather than allowing you to form a fist around the grip like you can on the Native.
In my opinion, the wire clip on the Sage is too far back, in that it interferes with the grip. It would have benefited from being designed as a tip-down carry knife. When gripping the knife, I'm constantly aware of the wire clip pushing into my palm.
The Native doesn't share the same issue. It's clip is moved out of the way, so you can get a solid grip on its' handle without the clip digging into your hand.
Notice the open backspacer on the Sage as compared to the clean, solid steel back of the Native.
In my opinion, the Native also looks better closed. It forms a nice compact package, where the Sage is a little oversized for the size of the blade.
I'm not thrilled about the "tail" sticking out when the Sage is closed either. It almost strikes me as a design oversight. I haven't been able to figure out why that corner at the butt of the grip was left on, and if it were cut off to match the downward curve of the blade when closed, in my opinion the knife would be better looking. Again, this really is just a personal annoyance, and not a big deal.
Another thing of note is the difference in the scales. Although both knives appear similar, the scales on the Native have a smooth, matte finish, while the Sage has a textured "weave" pattern, following the weave of the carbon fiber. It's something I've never seen on a carbon fiber knife before, and very cool.
Also in regaurd to the scales, the screws on the Sage are all recessed into the handle, a cool feature. On the Native, the screw side is recessed, while the "bump" cap nuts rise just a bit above the level of the scale.
As far as locking mechanisms, I'm a lot happier with the lock on the Native IV. This is probably because I started out as a fan of back locks, and was initially suspicious of linerlocks because I haven't had great experiences in the past.
However, the Sage's liner is not as beefy as I would've liked, especially when compared to a knife like the Tenacious.
Speaking of which, the Tenacious is rumored to have some blade detent problems. I noticed immediately that the blade of the Sage didn't seem to be held strongly enough into the handle for my own taste. It worries me a little, as a tip-up carry knife, to have what I think is a weak blade detent on a linerlock with a blade like this.
It hasn't come open in pocket, so I may just be overly paranoid, but there you go.
All in all, both are very nice knives. It's also cosmetically very nice, fit and finish is top rate.
Unfortunately, I can't say the same about the Native. Although it is my favorite of the two, the blade has some definite up and down play. You can visibly move the blade up and down while locked while pinching the spyderhole and moving it up and down relative to the handle.
The pivot screw, while I was handling the knife, began to back out. I cycled it through a multiple open and close sessions right after I got it, and when I looked down the pivot had worked it's way out of the handle to the point that it was sticking out about a 1/8th of an inch or so. I put a little loctite on the screw, so it's an easy fix, but be aware.
There's also a flat spot on the edge grind that looks like a mistake during sharpening, and the grind width varies on the other side of the blade. Not a completely even grind.
There's a little paint that bled out of the Spyderco bug logo into the grind lines on the blade, and a small but deep nick in on the handle liners where your middle finger would rest.
Blade play aside, these really aren't big issues, but for the cost of the knife I must say I'm a little bit disappointed.
Not because I don't think I can get it fixed quickly by Spyderco, but in that I just got the knife and I want to carry the thing, not send it off in the mail again!
When the Native arrived, however, I realized that however similar they may look in pictures, they are very different knives.
Where the Sage is an open-backed, lightweight liner lock with a leaf shaped blade, the Native is a more solid feeling, slightly heavier but thinner and more compact lock back with a spearpoint blade.
The Sage is more of lightweight gent's knife, where the Native is a tough, compact utility knife made of upscale materials with a nice design.
The Sage has phosphor bronze washers, where the Native IV is a washerless design like the Caly 3. This makes it thinner than the Sage, but it will probably start to show the same circular wear pattern from opening and closing that the Caly 3 does.
One of the surprising differences, considering how similar they look in even my own pictures, is the size and shape of the handles.
They are really nothing alike, past being about the same general shape. The handle of the Native is thinner and smaller than the very large handle on the Sage, which is the opposite of what I originally expected.
The Sage's handle feels very large in-hand.
By contrast, the Native's handle is still large enough to be comfortable, but not large enough to over-extend past the palm like the sage, or to keep your fingers spread rather than allowing you to form a fist around the grip like you can on the Native.
In my opinion, the wire clip on the Sage is too far back, in that it interferes with the grip. It would have benefited from being designed as a tip-down carry knife. When gripping the knife, I'm constantly aware of the wire clip pushing into my palm.
The Native doesn't share the same issue. It's clip is moved out of the way, so you can get a solid grip on its' handle without the clip digging into your hand.
Notice the open backspacer on the Sage as compared to the clean, solid steel back of the Native.
In my opinion, the Native also looks better closed. It forms a nice compact package, where the Sage is a little oversized for the size of the blade.
I'm not thrilled about the "tail" sticking out when the Sage is closed either. It almost strikes me as a design oversight. I haven't been able to figure out why that corner at the butt of the grip was left on, and if it were cut off to match the downward curve of the blade when closed, in my opinion the knife would be better looking. Again, this really is just a personal annoyance, and not a big deal.
Another thing of note is the difference in the scales. Although both knives appear similar, the scales on the Native have a smooth, matte finish, while the Sage has a textured "weave" pattern, following the weave of the carbon fiber. It's something I've never seen on a carbon fiber knife before, and very cool.
Also in regaurd to the scales, the screws on the Sage are all recessed into the handle, a cool feature. On the Native, the screw side is recessed, while the "bump" cap nuts rise just a bit above the level of the scale.
As far as locking mechanisms, I'm a lot happier with the lock on the Native IV. This is probably because I started out as a fan of back locks, and was initially suspicious of linerlocks because I haven't had great experiences in the past.
However, the Sage's liner is not as beefy as I would've liked, especially when compared to a knife like the Tenacious.
Speaking of which, the Tenacious is rumored to have some blade detent problems. I noticed immediately that the blade of the Sage didn't seem to be held strongly enough into the handle for my own taste. It worries me a little, as a tip-up carry knife, to have what I think is a weak blade detent on a linerlock with a blade like this.
It hasn't come open in pocket, so I may just be overly paranoid, but there you go.
All in all, both are very nice knives. It's also cosmetically very nice, fit and finish is top rate.
Unfortunately, I can't say the same about the Native. Although it is my favorite of the two, the blade has some definite up and down play. You can visibly move the blade up and down while locked while pinching the spyderhole and moving it up and down relative to the handle.
The pivot screw, while I was handling the knife, began to back out. I cycled it through a multiple open and close sessions right after I got it, and when I looked down the pivot had worked it's way out of the handle to the point that it was sticking out about a 1/8th of an inch or so. I put a little loctite on the screw, so it's an easy fix, but be aware.
There's also a flat spot on the edge grind that looks like a mistake during sharpening, and the grind width varies on the other side of the blade. Not a completely even grind.
There's a little paint that bled out of the Spyderco bug logo into the grind lines on the blade, and a small but deep nick in on the handle liners where your middle finger would rest.
Blade play aside, these really aren't big issues, but for the cost of the knife I must say I'm a little bit disappointed.
Not because I don't think I can get it fixed quickly by Spyderco, but in that I just got the knife and I want to carry the thing, not send it off in the mail again!
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