Stabbing with a Khukuri??

Joined
Jun 11, 1999
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Hey Everyone,

Got into a rather lengthy discussion at my FMA class this evening about whether or not it was possible to stab someone with a Khukuri.

I've watched Lynn Thompson stab one of those Japanese mats they use for cutting tests on the "More Proof" DVD. If that mat had been breathing it would have been very dead.

Just looking at one it is obvious that it is not primarily a stabbing weapon, but in a pinch it would burrow one hell of a hole with that huge sharp point!

Just because it isn't usually done doesn't mean it is impossible.

Am I missing something here?

- Anthony
 
I've long noted that the more martial khuks tend to be more acute angled than those for general puposes.

The more acute the angle, the easier it is to "hammer" the point in. Think of the khuk as a spike hawk held spike forward. It's then easy to imagine it being driven ( hammered ) straight into a line, producing the effect of a stab.

Whether that is a thrust or a strike is debateable. That they produce the same type of wound initially is not. The fearful thing about a khuk is the way it's energy flows from thrust into slash without thinking.

IMHO, of course.
 
Dr Winborne showed how to use a khuk to stab. It wasn't just a "last ditch" effort move either but a regular viable strike.
 
From what I have seen done by advanced martial artists they can use just about anything as an effective weapon. Stabbing with a kukri is possible, especially if you are using a 'sirupati', but ask a Gurkha who has used one in combat and you will get the typical Gurkha answers:
"Do you use the kukri to slash an enemy or stab him?"
"Yes sahib"
"Well, which part of the blade do you cut him with?"
"All"
"Do you cut up or down?"
"All sahib"
"Any other ways?"
"Knock him out with the side or back of our kukris, or break his arms. Sometimes not to kill. Always to hurt"
 
John, that is perfect. Seems to me, with minimal word changes, you can summarize almost any conversation with a Gurkha using your scenario.
 
Just about. It is incredibly charming up to a point, but can get a bit frustrating. Ask Bill.
 
about a Gurkha charge uphill against troops with fixed bayonets, in which the Gurkhas dodged UNDER the rifles/bayonets and slashed upwards with their khukuris.

Sucessfully.

There's something about those guys.
 
You sure can stab with a khukuri. If I stick one in a log when I take a rest from chopping, I use a thrust and it sticks in as deeply as a straight knife.
The Uncle Bill Especial and the Movie Model khuks are better suited to it, though. I really like that upswept UBE.
 
For stabbing/thrusting the khuk doesn't have a guard to keep the hand from sliding forward. To take care of this just strengthen your grip. You may still get hurt if the khuk is bloody/greasy and your hand slides forward. Remember if your in a knife fight your probably gonna sustain some damage to yourself even if you win! Thrusting can be very deadly. A friend from high school recalled getting cut then stabbed. He said when the knife was stabbed into him (about the kidney) it was lights out! Warriors noted this in the past that stabbing had a more deadly effect than slashing in most cases. :barf:
 
I think some people miss one important aspect of the thrust in a Khukuri and that is the natural alignment with the forearm.

For martial artist this would be a lot like a sun punch. The forearm aligns with the backbone of the blade making this a reinforced object.
The blade and the forearm work in harmony with each other increasing the stability (not bending the wrist) and the overall thrusting power.
Keeping the elbow near the body this becomes very powerful in comparison to a straight sword.

The Khukuri has a lot of martial principals hidden in it but if you know how to look at this blade you can see dozens of principals that most people never think of.
I have been using this as my primary martial arts weapon for about 23 years and I still find new things to learn.

Another thing to think about is the ability of this blade to control all the way through a pary into a counter thrust.

As far as depth... how far in do you need to go?
 
Kismet,
There are more than a few stories and descriptions about going in low, fast and slashing upward then going at the belly and opening it with one swipe.

Lovely stuff, but war is a lot different than the displays we see. Nasty business.

I really like what Azis said about there being a lot more to a kukri than meets the eye. One of the Gurkhas I spoke to said that his grandfather had once hit a 'bad guy' with a kukri that was still in its scabbard. It cut right thru that and still almost took off the guy's arm at the shoulder!
 
I'd like to second what JP and Azis said.

The sirupati and chainpuri have a minimal (relatively speaking) drop in angle for a khuk. They can be used very easily to thrust.

Khuks with a larger drop in their angle can be used to stab in a punching manner with a fistlike grip. It's different than a dagger with a "T" shaped handle but the same principle.

For that matter the HI kagas katne's and biltons can be reversed and held with the blade coming out of the bottom of the fist, edge forward like he knives currently a big hit on the Usual Suspects Net. Forget what they are called.

Then with the khuks having really acute angles of of drop, you can get a horrific hammer blow in with the tip's point.

Finally, we had some folks describe the effect of pulling a 15" AK on the blue line in Beirut; countering a knife threat at a gas station by pulling a khuk (don't remember what model); and the effect of responding to a knife threat with a twelve inch khuk ( some more eastern states permit knife carry under ccw ). I don't doubt that a large khuk would be better at ending a threat immediately than pointing a 41 mag at the perpetrator in many circumstances.

I think it was JP who quoted an officer who had served with Gurkha's as saying "The fastest thing you'll ever see is a Gurkha charge downhill."
 
Originally posted by Rusty


For that matter the HI kagas katne's and biltons can be reversed and held with the blade coming out of the bottom of the fist, edge forward like he knives currently a big hit on the Usual Suspects Net. Forget what they are called.

Then with the khuks having really acute angles of of drop, you can get a horrific hammer blow in with the tip's point.

I think that knife is a karambit. Wasn't there a design thread for an HI karambit a while back?

The "new model" also suits itself to reverse grip (edge out) very well. I bought it as a camp and kitchen knife, but it's no slouch in the weapons department.

edit

Well, I just went out and stabbed at a log after I put a cap & rotor on my 'stang. The new model stabs excellently in reverse grip, and is solid especially if you put your thumb over the buttcap. Stabbing in saber grip is also strong but didn't feel as safe because it has no real guard to stop your hand from sliding forward. The standard khuks with the carved handles would have a better grip, I'd think.
 
Kerambit, korambit. That was the name, and thanks for jogging my memry, Stripey.
 
I haven't had my hands on all the HI khuks but to me the one that really is a tool to stab with is the 15" Sirupati. The one I have was made my Sanu and really has a mean looking point on it. My other Siru's and the Kobra would stab pretty well too but there is just something about that 15" knife that says stab. I would try to grip the smallest part of the handle to stab or even roll the little finger behind the butt of the knife.:)
 
A long time ago I once read of the reminisces of an old retired Green Beret sargent that had fought in Vietnam. He was on leave in Hong Kong and wound up carousing with a bunch of off duty Ghurkas. They all began swapping stories, with the Ghurkas being very interested in the combat the US Army was seeing Vietnam.

The Ghurkas asked the American sargent to stop by their barracks the next day where upon they gave him one of their issue Khukuris and spent a good chunk of the day showing him all of basic moves on how they used it in a fight. He said he paid close and serious attention to all they taught him. He then took the Khukuri back to Vietnam with him and wound up carrying it the rest of his time there.

The sargent mentioned on how he found the Khukuri to be not only the best camp and fieldcraft knife he ever had, but one of the best hand to hand combat weapons besides a firearm one could have.

As far as stabbing goes, he mentioned that due to the shape of the blade, it was far more of a natural stabbing weapon than one would think. Also due to the shape of the blade, when you stabbed someone in the gut and then quickly yanked it back out, it had the natural tendency to open up the entire abdominal cavity, disemboweling your opponent.

He also mentioned that the Khukuri was also the best knife ever for cutting a throat, since when you drew it across someone's neck it's shape and length immediately sliced everything open. The sargent also mentioned on how in a fight the Khukuri could easily take the hand or forearm off of an opponent. You could also do something which few other 'regular' fighting knives could do easily and that was to quickly drop a charging attacker with a single strong whack to the skull, dropping them like a sack of potatoes.
 
MROSTOV: you're gonna fit in with this bunch of nuts just fine.
 
If you recall Dr. Duvon said the preferred move was the thrust or stab. The Gorkha who killed the leopard with his khukuri made the kill with the khukuri in the scabbard -- no time to draw.
 
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