Stabilizing wood AFTER knife is made

StoneAndSteel

StoneAndSteel

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Can you stabilize a wooden handle with resin after the blade is made? I can get into the details and circumstances, but that question encapsulates the short of it.

Follow on questions:
- I would like to do this myself and am willing to buy the appropriate equipment. But is this the kind of project that needs a high level of skill that I should leave to a true bladesmith?
- If it's tricky, is there anyone out there that offers this service?
 
StoneAndSteel said:
Can you stabilize a wooden handle with resin after the blade is made? I can get into the details and circumstances, but that question encapsulates the short of it.

Follow on questions:
- I would like to do this myself and am willing to buy the appropriate equipment. But is this the kind of project that needs a high level of skill that I should leave to a true bladesmith?
- If it's tricky, is there anyone out there that offers this service?
Click to expand...
Short answer is no, long answer is the process of even home stabilizing using a vacuum chamber is best done while the handle material is still a rough block. Majority of the resins used in stabilization are heat cured so you have to bake the material after it absorbs the resin, this would be pretty problematic with thin scales already attached to a knife, chances are they would warp, damage the glue bonding them to the blade or possibly effect the temper of the blade depending on the steel and what temp you need to use to set the resin. Vacuum stabilizing is also not as simple of a process as people tend to think, it has a lot of nuance to get decent results and even then industrial stabilization is going to give better results overall. Why do you want to stabilize a handle already on a finished knife? Are you having an issue with the current handle material?
 
Joshua answered it correctly - No,

Photos and a full description of the issue would help us a lot to answer your question.

If there is a handle problem, remove the scales and replace them with new stabilized wood.

If you are trying to preserve an old worn handle to make it look better or last longer, there are penetrating wood preservatives by Minwax and other companies and finishes that can help. Take the knife to a good woodworking supply shop like Woodcraft or Rockler and see what the reps there suggest.
 
Joshua Fisher said:
Short answer is no, long answer is the process of even home stabilizing using a vacuum chamber is best done while the handle material is still a rough block. Majority of the resins used in stabilization are heat cured so you have to bake the material after it absorbs the resin, this would be pretty problematic with thin scales already attached to a knife, chances are they would warp, damage the glue bonding them to the blade or possibly effect the temper of the blade depending on the steel and what temp you need to use to set the resin. Vacuum stabilizing is also not as simple of a process as people tend to think, it has a lot of nuance to get decent results and even then industrial stabilization is going to give better results overall. Why do you want to stabilize a handle already on a finished knife? Are you having an issue with the current handle material?
Click to expand...

Ok, this is what I suspected. I was just hoping social media would give me the answer that I wanted. The maker stated that it was stabilized wood, then it turned into "stabile" wood... now there is some warping. Nothing major, but I suspect it will get much worse over time.

Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
Joshua answered it correctly - No,

Photos and a full description of the issue would help us a lot to answer your question.

If there is a handle problem, remove the scales and replace them with new stabilized wood.

If you are trying to preserve an old worn handle to make it look better or last longer, there are penetrating wood preservatives by Minwax and other companies and finishes that can help. Take the knife to a good woodworking supply shop like Woodcraft or Rockler and see what the reps there suggest.
Click to expand...

I have purchased a wood preservative to do just that, but thought that IF it was possible to stabilize it with resin, I wouldn't want to soak the handles in a preservative first. At this point, the die is cast and I am going to ride these handles as long as they function. Eventually they will need to be replaced--just one more project for retirement.
 
The old-timers used to soak the handle of some knives in a jar of boiled Linseed oil for between a week and a month. Then they would wipe it dry and let it cure for a week to a couple months. Before modern resins, this was the only "stabilizing" done. You can certainly try it.

What treatment did you buy?
 
I have had that happen before. A batch of wood I was sent for 30 knife handles for a store wasn't rested/stabilized properly. I did the handles and they arrived great, then a few months later, the wood started curling/splitting/cracking/shrinking and moving on the handles. Had to redo almost all handles (some people took a discount instead of having them redone). I took some of the removed scales and when I put them into a freezer, they would flatten out, then take them out on a warm day and they would curl up again (or vice versa, it's been a while!), even several months later. Stabilizing is tricky to do right and if the wood is not prepped properly, things can go very wrong, but sometimes not until months afterwards! Shipping often involves aircraft, which travel high and unpressurized holds can do weird things, as can temperature changes, humidity changes, even if it is properly stabilized! I prefer synthetics for that reason since they are more stable and try to go with commercially stabilized wood and not home done set ups. I have tried some with cactus juice and wasn't as happy as stuff done by K&G.

Non stabilized woods can move as they dry out, or with temp/humidty/pressure changes a lot, too. Sometimes the movement doesn't happen right away, either!
 
I have a set of beautifully figured turkish walnut scales that I WILL not use because they curved sitting in the drawer. These were allegedly stabilized. Not worth the potential headache.
 
This is the unfortunate thing about beautifully figured wood. If it's got figure, it means that it grew up under stresses.
The tree adapted to those stresses by "pushing" against them. That "push" is still in the wood.
It WANTS to bend and twist, quite frankly it's a miracle that we get any straight wood with figure!
 
navman said:
I have a set of beautifully figured turkish walnut scales that I WILL not use because they curved sitting in the drawer. These were allegedly stabilized. Not worth the potential headache.
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Send it to K&G….they have had a “walnut specific” resin for awhile now. Works very good on the feather crotch I’ve sent to them. And yes, I have sent walnut to them that an attempt was made to stabilize by a backyard stabilizer which turned out as expected . K&G got it right, which shows the former guy had no idea what he was doing.
 
A.McPherson said:
This is the unfortunate thing about beautifully figured wood. If it's got figure, it means that it grew up under stresses.
The tree adapted to those stresses by "pushing" against them. That "push" is still in the wood.
It WANTS to bend and twist, quite frankly it's a miracle that we get any straight wood with figure!
Click to expand...
Olive wood comes to mind… beautiful figure….walks all over the place.
 
In both walnut and olive, drying time is the key to why it warps. Olive can require decades to properly dry. Walnut is the same. Even after cutting well-seasoned boards and rounds into blocks, I let the blocks sit for several more years.
I sent a batch of olive blocks to Mike at WSSI many years ago. I had purchased to boards from a reliable importer and cut them up. I assumed just because the moisture was low enough, they would stabilize fine. Every single one came back twisted or curved. It was an expensive lesson to learn. It made really expensive firewood that winter.

Other very long drying time woods are snakewood, ebony, and lignum vitae. I've never dried desert ironwood, but would assume it takes a long time, too. I am sure it is because of the oily/waxy nature of these woods that they need a long time.
 
There is also the fact that even with dry stuff there can be internal stresses, so when you cut it there will still be movement. And being wood not a spring that can take a while
If you're doing twice turned wood bits you still get a bit of movement on the second turning even after the bowl has been drying for ages
 
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