Steel? Edge holding vs. Ease of Sharpening

Mitchell Knives

Mitchell Knives

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Hi. All of the knives I have right now are CPM-440V steel. While this steel does hold a "working edge" for a very, very long time, it is hard to obtain and maintain a "scary sharp", "hair popping" edge. Also, this steel is kind of hard to sharpen. I'm looking for a new steel to try that is a good compromise between edge holding and ease of sharpening. I want something that will hold a "hair popping" edge well, or at least better than CPM-440V, and can be easily sharpened in minutes. (I use a Sharpmaker) In the past I've tried AUS-6, AUS-8, and ATS-55. I was pretty disappointed at their performance, as they became dull rather quickly. I would appreciate any suggestions, opinions or experiences. Thanks.
 
The folks who can talk metallurgy and molybdenum and other such things are going to run rings around me here -- but I've tried a dozen or so different stainless steels, and I think the one you're looking for is VG-10.
 
I'm a 100 % with James! VG-10 is the steel to look for! I have many knives from Fallkniven made of VG-10 and they are my favourites in any situation! Try it and you'll never regret!

greetings
sniper66
 
Like the previous suggestions, I've heard that VG-10 is awesome for edge retention and ease of sharpening. I just purchased the new Spyderco Delica model in VG-10 steel today with the full Spyderedge, it's pretty impressive.:eek:
 
Dunno about vanadium, but I'll speak of my personal experience.
For what I've experienced edge holding vs ease of sharpening is a non-issue.
It matters only for those who don't properly maintain their knives. If you allow a blade become so dull it's difficult to resharpen it you have gone much too far without sharpening it.
Some steeling will help maintain sharp a balde, and a good stoning every now and then on an extra-fine stone will keep ANY blade perfectly sharp.
The trick, therefore, doesn't lie in how to resharpen certain steels, or which steels sharpen better. It lies in never, ever letting a blade get dull.
Softer steels aren't easier to resharpen, they just reach the point where sharpening is a tough job more rapidly than good, hard steels.
Edge holding, therefore, is the only issue. The more the better.
 
If you have trouble finding a knife you like in VG-10, consider BG-42 and Benchmade’s M2. Both of these are pretty tough stuff, but can actually be sharpened in the field.

D2 is even reasonably easy to sharpen. Not as easy, IMHO, as BG-42 or M2, but still not bad.

Just about ANYTHING is easier to sharpen that 440V. I’d rather sharpen diamonds!!!!
 
In my experience, Spyderco's VG10 and Benchmade's 154cm are both good compromises between edge holding and ease of sharpening. I have tried about nine different steels including Spyderco's cpm440v and i would agree that it is quite hard to sharpen and doesnt seem to take a hair-popping edge, great for retention though.
Good luck ;)
 
I'm surprised that no one has mentioned forged steel. There is no comparison between a stainless steel and a forged blade steel in how long it takes to sharpen them. Just my two cents!
 
I happen to like 154-CM, my wife likes CPM-440V. We buy from good quality companies with good reputations.

However, some chefs use knives with a softer alloy. They sharpen often to always have a sharp edge for thin slicing. Consider the guy who slices prime rib. He's always steeling.

I've often wondered about buying a knife from a quality company with a softer steel for an EDC. Sure, you'd have to sharpen more often, but the edge would always be fresh; and I don't mind using the Edgepro. For example, I like the Kershaw Whirlwind I have for that exact reason.

Don't you think that sometimes a softer steel isn't such a bad thing?
 
Thanks for the suggestions. I've been able to get a hair popping edge on my CPM-440V knives, but it never seems to hold it long...not to mention that it took forever to get it that way.

I was thinking about VG-10, especially since Spyderco switched from ATS-55. I'm really curious to see how it performs. I might have to get a Lum Tanto or an Endura to try it out.

Benchmade's 154-CM had come to mind, since they offer a lot of designs I like and seemed to be reasonably priced. I certainly hope its not like ATS-55.

D2 was another possible choice, specifically in the Camillus Madd Maxx. I'm not very familiar at all with this steel but, a lot of custom makers use it.

I agree that a hair popping/shaving edge is not all that practical, I just love to have a knife so sharp that it scares me. It's a hard decision on which steel to use so, keep the opinions coming. Thanks.
 
You're talking compromise here. The same hard carbides that allow you to hold an edge also make the knife more difficult to sharpen. The type of heat-treatment and the tempering will also have a major effect. But you can't have your cake and eat it, too.

The "hair-popping" edge really impresses a newbie, but isn't very practical. The vast majority of folks are far better off with a knife that will take a good working edge and keep it a long time, with minimal difficulty in sharpening and touch-up.

There are a lot of hot new steels out there, such as VG-10, S60V, D2, etc. Oh, yes, let's not forget Talonite and Stellite, along with other cobalt alloys. But there are all-too-few knife makers and/or knife factories that have the capability of using the potential of such materials.

So you end up with compromise. If you want a hard material that will hold a sharp edge, you'll get a knife that will do precise cutting very well, but will have poor shock resistance and will chip out relatively easily. If you want a tough material to stand up under heavy chopping and abuse, don't expect precise cutting and long-term edge holding. You're only kidding yourself if you believe the hype that says otherwise for every new blade material that comes along.
 
Surprised no mention of forged differentially hardened, and multiple-quenched 52100.

Excellent edge-holding properties coupled with ease of sharpening.

AL
 
...or of Stellite 6K or Talonite.

Get a diamond hone, and practice. There is no such thing as a knife that is hard to sharpen.
 
Both excellent alloys.... I own blades in both.

Re sharpening; Angled jigs are fine, but if you have learned early how to sharpen free-hand on a stone, you can produce a razor-sharp edge with your eyes closed. It just becomes all feel.

You know how when you're an experienced driver, your hands make all those micro-adjustments while steering, with little or no thought?

Sharpening free-hand is much the same way. No edge, steel, or cobalt alloy is too much of a challenge.

On the other hand, I might be full of s**t! ;)

AL
 
I agree 100% with Kwaiken56...Get yourself a GOOD bench stone, and learn how to use it. I think that you will be suprised with the results. (I have a Smith's Tri-Hone, and since obtaining it, I rarely use my Sharpmaker anymore.).

Also, you might want to give 5160 carbon steel a try, as the couple of knives that I have (Bill Siegle Bowies) in this steel sharpen VERY WELL, and hold a pretty good edge. The way the steel is tempered (heat treated) has ALOT to do with how it takes and holds an edge, and it's ease of re-sharpening.
 
VG-10 is the only stainless steel I've come across that is close to high carbon steel when it comes to edge holding, but it is more time consuming to sharpen than carbon steel. VG-10 compares well to Carbon V, for instance. The best edge holding steel I have ever found, as someone else noted here, is 52100, specifically, my Marbles Campcraft and Fieldcraft. It's also very easy to sharpen.
 
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