steel question

J

joeyabs81

Joined
Jun 8, 2004
Messages
36
Quick question for you all...
Between 154CM and D2, which of the two has better overall edge retention? Thanks in advance.
 
It should be pretty close, though I'd take 154-CM for it's stainlessness.
 
D2 is nearly as stainless as 154CM. It doesn't have enough chromium to technically be called "stainless", but it is very resistant to rust compared to other tool steels.
 
Now, to just make sure all are happy, 154 is a fine steel. But I have to say that D2 is such a super edge holding steel it is like no other. While both are fine steels, pick the D2 for the edge. There is no better steel to hold the edge.
 
Larrin said:
It should be pretty close, though I'd take 154-CM for it's stainlessness.
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by you standards they would be the same steel :rolleyes: I mean, really, there are only minute differences in both:yawn:
 
I am in love with D2.

D2 Ka-bar, D2 Griptillian, Bog Dogs, the works. The only question is where will I get the $$$ to pay for it? :eek:
 
Rededge, I have never found either of these two steels hard to sharpen. they both take a keen edge. My experience lies with Benchmade and Microtech and swamprat though.
 
Hair said:
D2 is nearly as stainless as 154CM.
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While 154CM has only a slightly higher amount of Cr, after heat treating there is 11/12% of Cr free in 154CM, only 2-3% of the Cr is actually in carbide form. D2 retains much more of the Cr in carbide due to the much higher carbon content and lower soaking temperature and thus is much lower in corrosion resistance. This can be significantly influenced by how the two steels are heat treated of course.

joeyabs81 said:
Between 154CM and D2, which of the two has better overall edge retention?
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154CM and D2 have similar max hardness and D2 has a much higher wear resistance, thus they will be similar on some cutting and D2 will have an advantage on others, so unless corrosive materials are cut D2 is likely the better cutting steel assuming both are heat treated for optimal hardness / wear resitance.

-Cliff
 
I sure wish I had a knife in D2. I've got all these 154CM blades lying around, and I'm never cutting ropes soaked in saltwater & acid!

S
 
You can see the effect just cutting materials outside in the rain or cutting various fruits and vegetables in the kitchen.

-Cliff
 
I have actually cut ropes soaked in salt water, it was a fishing community here so it wasn't an uncommon task to work on such materials, and of course salt water fish.

-Cliff
 
154CM and D2 have similar max hardness and D2 has a much higher wear resistance, thus they will be similar on some cutting and D2 will have an advantage on others, so unless corrosive materials are cut D2 is likely the better cutting steel assuming both are heat treated for optimal hardness / wear resitance.

-Cliff
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According to what I've been told and CPMs data on the two steels 154CM has a slightly higher wear resistance to D2 and both are near identical in toughness.
http://www.crucibleservice.com/datash/dsS30Vv4b.pdf

Personally I have both and think D2 has a better biting edge. Both 154CM and ATS34 give me fits for getting the kind of edge I like on them. This is why I most always get them in a combo edge whenever its that steel. I just can't get that satifying bite on those two steels like I can other steels. They get sharp but it is an edge that fools you. Seems to me that 154CM and ATS34 take a very fine edge that is better for push cuts than slicing. (another reason why I prefer them in a combo edge because with the serrations you can now slice well too in most materials.)

This is based on my own observations from use. D2 slices well, and seems to hold an edge a long time. Up there with S30V until it is something like oranges or other high acid fruits or veges. When D2 will slice right through something 154CM has to be sawed through with a bit more force from what I've seen in my own knives. Both hold a good long edge though. Once you get them sharp that is.

STR
 
Last summer my family was boating on a large lake in northern Utah (Not the salty one, ironically). A big storm swamped the boat in knee-deep water, but it was still tied to the anchor. The boat listed to one side, but could not be freed because of the rope. I was the only one there with a decent knife (BM 735). My dad and brother looked at me like I was about to labor through that rope as though I had one of their anemic knives. I effortlessly severed that inch-thick rope in one pass, and the boat rocked over to the other side. Their eyes nearly popped out of their heads, and my brother bought a new Benchmade a few weeks later. I suppose I'm a fan of 154CM, but I have wanted a Dozier for years, partly because he uses D2 exclusively. Kind of a long story with no point really. I don't think you can lose with either steel unless you don't take good care of your stuff.
 
STR said:
According to what I've been told and CPMs data on the two steels 154CM has a slightly higher wear resistance to D2 :
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Crucible uses adhesive wear :

http://www.crucibleservice.com/datash/ACFC3C.pdf?CFID=340403&CFTOKEN=23616192

Check ASM references for example and the D2 will rank very high, Ref :

http://groups.google.ca/group/rec.knives/msg/0c6b3f6a1af662d0?hl=en&

Note the difference of 440C vs D2 vs Crucibles data. How you harden it of course makes a huge difference, D2 can be tempered low for a very high HRC and wear resistance, 64 HRC at 300 F.

-Cliff
 
Cliff, that second link is the only site I believe I have seen that places D2 higher than M2 for wear resistance. I have to question the opinion on that one.

I think the data they provide at Crucible is for "optimal" hardness on steels based on what I've read.

STR
 
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