Stockman question to the specialists

[Âchillepattada]

Hello ,

I'm a great fan of the stockman I've a question.
Does this model has always 3 blades or it exists with 2 ?
May be the 2 blades model has another name ?

Thanks

 

[Jolipapa]

IIRC the stockman is a 3 blades layout, clip/sheepsfoot/spey. Usually a main clip with a sheepsfoot or spey on the same axle, facing a spey or sheepsfoot depending (both smaller blades on the same spring). The handle shape (mostly serpentine, but also sowbelly, humpback, etc.) and size may vary, rounded or square ends.







I'm not sure there's a special name for the '15 &'18 BF knives, basically stockman with the 2nd blade removed.

 

[meako]

 

[meako]

 

[Jolipapa]

Thanks for the heads-up. Now I know that I am the proud owner of Double End Jacks!

 

[meako]

Ah sorry bout that double up....these Levines 5th......

 

[meako]

Yess.
Another global problem ..Solved on ye olde Porch.....to easy.

 

[Jolipapa]

Somewhere on BF I found this catalogue extract :
Keen Kutter

 

[pvicenzi]

A two blade version could be a Texas Jack.

 

[screened porch]

I bought a Boker "two blade stockman" which I would have called a serpentine jack. There's just no such thing as a two blade stockman.

 

[Jolipapa]

Thanks for the heads-up. Now I know that I am the proud owner of Double End Jacks!

In fact it says right here!

 

[Âchillepattada]

A two blade version could be a Texas Jack.

So this one could be called double end jack ?

Same name with one or two spring(s) ?

Â

 

[screened porch]

So this one could be called double end jack ?

Same name with one or two spring(s) ?

Â

I think it's a double-end jack if it's too big to be called a pen-knife. One or two springs doesn't matter.

 

[Ice Tigre]

Some have sold them as half stockman...
Or double end jack. Or a specific model name(Muskrat!). Good luck on this one, its been driving me nuts for a few years while trying to find my grail knife... makes having the right search terms a real PITA.

As a side note...
Never could understand how you get half knives, when you remove 1 of 3 blades! Half whittlers too... Guess 2/3 whittler just didn't sound as good in sales patter?

 

[Misplaced Hillbilly]

I bought a Boker "two blade stockman" which I would have called a serpentine jack. There's just no such thing as a two blade stockman.

Boker also calls some short bolster jacks they make "barlows" nowadays as well. It doesn't help when knife makers disregard long established terminology

 

[Âchillepattada]

As a side note...
Never could understand how you get half knives, when you remove 1 of 3 blades! Half whittlers too... Guess 2/3 whittler just didn't sound as good in sales patter?

mathematically it's a problem

 

[Arathol]

So this one could be called double end jack ?

Same name with one or two spring(s) ?

Â

Premium stockman, squared bolsters, 3 blades, 4 1/4" long

A double end jack made on a stockman-type frame with a single large blade on each end, usually one clip and one spey blade, is commonly called a moose pattern,

unless of course its a smaller frame with two similar long thin blades its a muskrat.

This is a Hawbaker muskrat, with a wharncliffe style blade-

which has a frame similar to this Deluxe stockman

Thats not to say all moose patterns are on a premium jack frame either, they can be on a equal end cattle knife or swell center frame too

So, as you can see nothing is cut and dried, or set in stone. Its pretty much up to the maker to decide what they want to call it......

 

[black mamba]

Never could understand how you get half knives, when you remove 1 of 3 blades!

That sounds like Yogi Berra math: "Baseball is 90% mental, and the other half is physical." Or, talking about a NY restaurant,
"Nobody goes there any more . . . it's too crowded."

 

[Jolipapa]

So, as you can see nothing is cut and dried, or set in stone. Its pretty much up to the maker to decide what they want to call it......

I agree ! I've been told this was not a moose. (but I can live quietly with it! )

 

[Will Power]

I'd certainly say that's a Moose (Elk ) two equal sized but DIFFERENT blades at opposite ends, just like the Forum Knife 2010 from Queen..

Naming nomenclature is hideously and notoriously a minefield Makers use a name loosely as maybe an advertising gimmick it takes on parlance then agéd experts tell you it was always like this OR conversely, a travesty and NEVER been this, fume

Streamlining is needed Stockman or Cattle Knives have always been 3 or 4 blades sometimes even more but not less. Stockman frames vary: Serp, Humpback, round bolster, square, shadow, Equal End Cattle knives, and SIZE varies too from mini to massive. Lot of people sneer at Half Whittler, Half Congress naming but it's taken on. Half Stockman seems a bridge too far...(gelded by having no Spey?) My own idiosyncratic approach is that I go along with those, who for clarity, define a Jack Knife as a 2 bladed knife from the SAME end or pivot and usually one of those blades is smaller than the other Master/minor. A Pen Knife is a knife with blades at opposite ends with one smaller than the other, usually but not necessarily, single-spring. I don't see size needing to come into it- CASE had a large Pen Knife until the mid 70s Clip/Pen and 3.75" / 9cm. Pen for me differentiates it from Jack.

Thus Jer's Böker as shown on post No. 10 is for me indeed a Serp Jack. Whereas I think I'd prefer to call the Forum Knife 15 and 18 which are clearly based on Stockman frames but in Pen arrangements as a Stockman Pen. Kind of suits the context no? And the blades are of different size unlike a Moose (Elk)

Stockman Pen is a lot sexier than Double End Jack, just saying'