Stones for re-profile before Sharpmaker

L

likem

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Mar 16, 2005
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I have been reading the forums for info on sharpening
pocket, hunting, and kitchen knives. I think I am sold on the sharpmaker. Question is. What are best stones for the blade profile before I use it?: Diamond Stones or Water Stones or other.
I have no previous experience on either of them. At the present time I use an old Sharpmaster Silicon Carbide Combination 8 X 2 2-1/8 x 1-1/8. Have no isea of the grit size the box is only marked coarse and fine. The model # is UC143. Would this be ok for re profile before the sharpmaker or should I upgrade? You opinions would shure help in this decision. I really do not want to go for Apex with upgrade - 200. to 300. I hear they are a bit too much fuss with the cleanup and setup. Fifty dollar sharpmaker and a stone or two should be under 120.00. I am willing to go that much for sharp knives in pocket, kitchen and field.
Have a whole lot of mixed knives ATS 34, Stainless, D2 and High carbon steels. You thaughts on this purchase choice would be appriciated.
Thanks likem.
 
Any diamond stone coarse or xcoarse. The cheaper ones may wear out faster. If you want a more polished bevel, you also can go to a finer stone or sandpaper, and then finish up on the sharpmaker.

After I use a diamond stone to get the initial back-bevel, I like to work my way up in sandpaper grits (The diamond stone will see a lot of use to remove lots of metal, but you don't need to spend much time/money on the paper because you are just smoothing it out). Then I put a slightly higher edge bevel on with the sharpmaker.

You could also skip the sandpaper and flip the sharpmaker over and freehand sharpen on the med (brown) rods in the 'benchstone' sharpmaker configuration to smooth out the scratches from the coarse stone.

Bear in mind if the knife does not need an edge-angle change (reprofile) you can skip all the above and go right to the sharpmaker in V-mode.

grit size comparisons:
http://www.spyderco.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13424&highlight=grit+size
http://208.63.68.209/SharpenGuide.htm#Grit
 
DMT in blue (coarse) or black (xcoarse) will do the job handedly. Even the Red (fine) will reshape a blade with some doing.

_z
 
Another vote for the DMT #220 (black) or DMT #320 (blue) doesn't really matter which. I really like waterstones and at this grit they are actually cheaper than the Diamond stones, but the DMT's are very carefree and work really well. I just bought a DMT #220 + Sharpmaker combination for my father.
 
[x-coarse]


HoB said:
I really like waterstones and at this grit they are actually cheaper than the Diamond stones
Click to expand...
Yeah, in general I would take an x-coarse waterstone and some lapping compound for adjusting edge angle freehand, or some really x-coarse sandpaper on a had backing like a pseudo-file. However for some knives which can't take high pressure (thin blades, flexible) I would take the x-coarse DMT as they cut well even if you run light.

-Cliff
 
I took my table saw and set the miter guage from 90 degrees to 75 degrees. Then I cut across a piece of 2x6 at that angle. I flipped one of the resulting pieces over and voila, I have a 30-degree (included) vee. I mounted the two pieces onto the flat side of a piece of 2x4 and now I can set a coarse stone into the vee and I have a (much cheaper) version of a sharpmaker for cutting the back bevels. Once I've got the profile taken care of, I can switch to the Sharpmaker to smooth everything out better and then to the 40-degree angle to put on the edge bevel.

Obviously, this arrangement works better for some things than others, but I found it real good for taking down the relatively obtuse secondary bevel of something like my Benchmade 705 so that it made a better match for the Sharpmaker. It's less good for a recurved blade shape and clearly completely unsuitable for something that you want a convex edge on.

Since I have a fair range of different knives, I don't mind at all having spent a few minutes and a couple pieces of scrap lumber to make a jig like this for the odd occasion when I want it. If you don't have a table saw (or a radial arm saw or a miter saw or something suitable) and if you don't collect lumber scraps from other random projects, then you still probably know someone who does. It'll add a few minutes to the operation, but even then it shouldn't be too much trouble.

Paul
 
The stone that you already have should work OK for rough sharpening before using a Sharpmaker. In order for it to work most efficiently you need to keep the hone from smoothing up or getting clogged. As you use the hone the points tend to break off the surface grit so the hone gets smoother with use. Metal and hone debris also tends to clog up the spaces between the high points of the grit which also reduces the cutting speed of the hone. Traditionally aluminum oxide and silicon carbide hones have been used with oil. You might find the hone described as an "oil stone" on the box. The oil weakens the attachment of the hone's surface grit so that some of it comes loose to expose fresh, sharp grit as you work. It also lubricates the honing debris so that it doesn't stick in between the surface grit. Once a hone has been used with oil it is easiest to keep using it with oil. The oil residue on the hone surface gets thicker as volatile components evaporate. The hone still breaks down rapidly, but the debris tends to stick to the gummy oil residue and clog the hone surface.

You can use water with your hone instead of oil. This lubricates a bit less and seams to break down the hone surface a bit slower; on the other hand it is a lot neater. You just have to rinse the hone and or wipe it off a bit oftener as you work. The water will evaporate and run off faster than oil does. If your hone has previously been used with oil you need to clean the oil off before switching to water. You can scrub it with hot water and sink cleanser, you can boil it with detergent or you might run it a couple times through your dishwasher (on the pans setting).

Silicon carbide grit is kind of irregular in shape. It cuts fast, but leaves a rougher surface than some other types of hone. I would do most of my rough work using the coarse side of your hone, but I would be sure to smooth off the resulting surface by some significant honing on the fine side of the hone.

If you have a terribly dull knife you may find it quicker to begin by rough sharpening using the edge of your hone rather than the flat top surface. To do this you intentionally tip the blade away from horizontal so that you only contact the stone along the edge between the top and the side of the stone. This will get you a lot higher honing pressure. It is sort of like using the edges of the triangular Sharpmaker rods. Before you do this for the first time you might want to smooth the edges of you hone. I do this be rubbing the edges lengthwise along a smooth section of cement sidewalk.
 
Thanks everyone that replied. I am going to make a wood fixture and give it a try. Stopped at the Ramsey Outdoor store today for the sharpmaker but they only had Lansky's. I guess I will order online. I am also getting a diamond stone. Two different grits.
likem
 
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