Stropping when finishing at lower grits?

[kniferbro]

For those of you that finish your edges at lower grits, lets say <=1000, do you strop afterwards?

I'm finishing at 600grit and don't know how much I should strop afterwards. Just enough to remove the burr? A normal amount? I'm using basic green compound from Lowes.

 

[Rhinoknives1]

Its a personal choice thing after you have removed the burr, how much do you want it to shine?

I personally like to polish it up some so that it gleams in the sun when the customer looks at it. After about1000- 2000 and burr gone I don't think it makes much difference on slicing.

 

[Scarface48]

I think it's a personal thing, based on you and the use you put your knife to. In the kitchen, I touch up my knife on a crock stick and a strop each time I use it. I don't even now what grit the crock stick is, but it was a cheap one, so I assume it to be low. I hand my strop in the pantry and pull it out each time I cook. For me, it makes a difference.

 

[Ernie1980]

I finish some knives off at 600 grit, and do strop after just to make sure the burr is gone. I just do a few passes since I am not trying to polish the edge.

 

[HeavyHanded]

For those of you that finish your edges at lower grits, lets say <=1000, do you strop afterwards?

I'm finishing at 600grit and don't know how much I should strop afterwards. Just enough to remove the burr? A normal amount? I'm using basic green compound from Lowes.

Normally when I stop at 600-800 grit is so the edge has some nice irregularities that will help it draw cut better. I find if I strop on paper, maybe two sheets wrapped around a stone with light to moderate pressure, I can bring the edge up quite a bit in terms of quality without diminishing the more aggressive qualities (this also does a great job revealing any latent burrs). This doesn't work well for routine maintenance, but to finish it off is a nice touch. Normally at that level of finish I just de-burr on the fixed abrasive and call it a day - no stropping.

Am not sure I'd even use compound to finish at this level unless it was some black emery - even then there is generally some erosion of the edge features unless done on a very hard backed surface. This may or may not be a problem, but the edge will slowly convert over to more of a carver, chopper, shaver, instead of a toothy draw cutter. If that is the goal, you generally get better results going to a higher grit fixed abrasive rather than trying to do too much refining on a strop (unless you happen to be using a Washboard, in which case strop away and don't spare the elbow grease).

Martin

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

This afternoon, I've been tinkering with a couple of new sharpeners I picked up recently. One, an EZE-LAP 10" diamond 'steel' (oval) in what they spec as 600 grit diamond (feels a little coarser than DMT's '600' mesh). The other sharpener is a simple little AlOx pocket stone I picked up at Sears a few days ago, for about $2.50. It finishes a little finer than the EZE-LAP diamond rod; I'd guess it approximates something like 800 grit or so.

After testing both of these sharpeners on a cheap Japanese-made paring knife of unknown stainless (it may emulate something like AUS-6), I stropped the edge lightly & for just a handful of passes (< 5 per side) on a 'hard' strop of artist's canvas over basswood (another experiment ), with some Sears #2 grey compound ('Regular Cleaning' for hard metals; I'm sure it's AlOx, but grit size is unknown). This compound is very aggressive, but if used sparingly, really leaves some nice tooth on the edges produced as described above. Both of the sharpeners leave some fairly obvious burrs on the knife tested; this is primarily why I used the strop & compound, as it cleans up burrs very efficiently, and also refines the edge nicely.

In a nutshell, in answering the OP's question, I can definitely see value in stropping a relatively coarse-grit edge, so long as the strop & compound are wisely chosen to truly enhance it with that much more 'sticky bite', instead of just polishing it. It's easy to quickly erase an effective-cutting, nice & toothy edge in pursuit of a pretty & shiny one, if the stropping setup isn't chosen thoughtfully and used sparingly.


David

 

[bgentry]

I've found some pretty amazing performance from combining a coarse stone and a strop loaded with either white or green compound. I had a real "Ah Ha!" moment a while back after I sharpened on DMT XXC, then DMT C. I tested sharpness on phonebook paper and hair. It just caught a few hairs. It cut phonebook paper, but was loud and caught in several places.

Then I stropped on green compound (leather paddle strop by StropMan). I think I did something like 5 - 7 passes per side. The I retested. Holy Wow! It then shaved a clean patch of hair, though roughly. Phonebook paper was nice and clean, though still loud. I was amazed! I don't really do this as a normal part of my sharpening, but thinking about it, I really should experiment with this technique of a relatively course edge, refined with just a bit of stropping.

Brian.

 

[Sadden]

If I stop that low for some strange reason then typically i just make a couple quick passes on naked roo. I always deburr completely on stones before i go to a strop of any kind.

If i wanted to get a little more out of things i could go to a slightly finer CBN on roo strop , i have them as coarse as 80u ,(160 grit). Strop slightly finer than the finishing stone. But i rarely stop that low.

 

[Bob6794]

Yeah I strop when I finish at low grits and in general just strop. Then again the highest grit stone I have is a DMT EF which I don't use often. My general method now is to wrap a paper around a stone with some flexcut gold on it and strop, than I might strop on plain paper if I feel like it.

 

[kniferbro]

This afternoon, I've been tinkering with a couple of new sharpeners I picked up recently. One, an EZE-LAP 10" diamond 'steel' (oval) in what they spec as 600 grit diamond (feels a little coarser than DMT's '600' mesh). The other sharpener is a simple little AlOx pocket stone I picked up at Sears a few days ago, for about $2.50. It finishes a little finer than the EZE-LAP diamond rod; I'd guess it approximates something like 800 grit or so.

After testing both of these sharpeners on a cheap Japanese-made paring knife of unknown stainless (it may emulate something like AUS-6), I stropped the edge lightly & for just a handful of passes (< 5 per side) on a 'hard' strop of artist's canvas over basswood (another experiment ), with some Sears #2 grey compound ('Regular Cleaning' for hard metals; I'm sure it's AlOx, but grit size is unknown). This compound is very aggressive, but if used sparingly, really leaves some nice tooth on the edges produced as described above. Both of the sharpeners leave some fairly obvious burrs on the knife tested; this is primarily why I used the strop & compound, as it cleans up burrs very efficiently, and also refines the edge nicely.

In a nutshell, in answering the OP's question, I can definitely see value in stropping a relatively coarse-grit edge, so long as the strop & compound are wisely chosen to truly enhance it with that much more 'sticky bite', instead of just polishing it. It's easy to quickly erase an effective-cutting, nice & toothy edge in pursuit of a pretty & shiny one, if the stropping setup isn't chosen thoughtfully and used sparingly.


David

So for removing the burr but still maintaining that "sticky bite" with a strop I should try to look for a coarser compound?

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

So for removing the burr but still maintaining that "sticky bite" with a strop I should try to look for a coarser compound?

That's the tricky part, and it's where some time spent trying things out will be more useful. Depending on the steel, the strop, compound and technique/skill, results can vary all over the place. A finer compound that's still relatively aggressive for the steel (such as AlOx, SiC or diamond compound used with 1095) could still strip a burr quickly, and retain that 'bite' if not taken too far (that's the technique/skill part, knowing when to stop). On the other hand, if the compound is very coarse (large grit), but not as effective for the steel (such as a coarse AlOx compound used on something like S30V), you may blunt or round off the edge more than anything else.

Generally, the best way to figure it out, is to keep checking & testing your edges frequently as you work. Make only 3 light passes or so, then see how the edge has changed (more bite, less bite, more polished or less, etc.). Test cutting in paper can show a lot, in terms of how effectively the burr has been cleaned up, and also in how aggressively the edge bites into the paper with minimal pressure or force. Can also feel the edge with your fingertips (the so-called 'three finger sticky' test), to correlate how the edge feels vs how it's performing.

With most middle-of-the-road steels, anywhere from simple stainless (420HC, etc.) up through something like D2, I've really started to like AlOx compounds for this. This includes some of the black emery compounds, as well as 'grey' or 'white' compounds. At some medium or relatively coarse grits, they can do quite a lot, if used thoughtfully. But it does take some experimentation to find which will work best for your preferences. And I'll strongly emphasize using a harder strop, in general. Most strops with any noticeable 'give' to them, like leather or other 'soft' materials, will tend to polish more than anything, even when used with relatively coarse compounds. A hard strop of wood, or paper-over-wood (or over stone/glass), will give a compound a firmer footing from which to work, and that'll make a given compound work more aggressively (closer to it's rated grit size), while still avoiding the possible rounding issues seen with softer backing.


David

 

[awestib]

on a 'hard' strop of artist's canvas over basswood (another experiment ), with some Sears #2 grey compound

Very interesting, I did the same thing the other day, artist's canvas over hardwood with BRKNT black compound (hell, what is that grit? Likely 1000-1500? Course, anyway) compared to thin cardboard over wood and same compound on my O1 convex bushcrafter. I dulled the edge however on medium ceramic rod, so quite dull. Wanted to resemble a significant dull edge and see how hard that compound can work. So I think a reasonable combination of backing, compound and steel. Anyway, I did not like the canvas at all although it took the compound easily. The thin cardboard outperformed the canvas by far in restoring that dull edge. My impression was that the compound was imbedded into the canvas to "deeply"?! The cardboard and compound produced a new edge and burr and with a fine touch, I was able to get a clean edge with some aggressivity left.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Very interesting, I did the same thing the other day, artist's canvas over hardwood with BRKNT black compound (hell, what is that grit? Likely 1000-1500? Course, anyway) compared to thin cardboard over wood and same compound on my O1 convex bushcrafter. I dulled the edge however on medium ceramic rod, so quite dull. Wanted to resemble a significant dull edge and see how hard that compound can work. So I think a reasonable combination of backing, compound and steel. Anyway, I did not like the canvas at all although it took the compound easily. The thin cardboard outperformed the canvas by far in restoring that dull edge. My impression was that the compound was imbedded into the canvas to "deeply"?! The cardboard and compound produced a new edge and burr and with a fine touch, I was able to get a clean edge with some aggressivity left.

The 'experimental' nature of my own project implies I'm still deciding whether I like this method best, or not. I found it worked well this time around; but it's still sort of up in the air, for me. The reason I tried it is because I'd liked doing similar things with both linen (scrap of an old shirt) and denim (old jeans) used the same way. Part of the experiment is in figuring out how much compound needs applying, before the results either get more consistent (therefore implying the compound's not embedding too deeply), or before results start to degrade (this has usually happened for me, if the application gets too 'muddy' or loose on the surface of the media).

As for cardboard, I've tinkered with that a bit too; it produced the first big, noticeable jump in sharpness over and above what I'd previously seen in leather strops. I'm sure most of that was due to the much harder backing I used under the cardboard (I used glass). As with fabric or any other paper or similar substrate, results with cardboard can vary all over the place. My 'linen' strop (over a scrap of hard plywood) is still my best performer so far, even long after it's become so black and dirty-looking, that I can't believe it would still work. But it still just keeps workin'...


David