Survival knife requirements?

CoyotePhysics

CoyotePhysics

Joined
Jul 14, 2010
Messages
330
I was in a sporting goods store when I spotted a Condor Bushlore in the knife cabinet. I’ve been lurking on this forum on and off for months/years absorbing your opinions about survival knives. My old-standby (a Buck Vanguard) just didn’t seem to pass muster compared to the knives that many of you all carry. So I had to inspect the Bushlore. From the profile it seemed like my kind of knife, then I picked it up and thought, “Woah, this thing could be used for a splitting wedge!”:eek: Now that got me thinking about the last knife I picked up as a potential Vanguard replacement, a Ka-Bar short. I must say that it is a well made knife, but I never favored it because it was too light to be a chopper, and the blade was too thick to be an outstanding cutter.

So I began to question why I wanted something besides my Vanguard at my side, and I drew a blank. For how I use a knife the thing is perfect. First of all it has cut through everything I’ve ever put in front of it with minimal resistance, and I think the balance between edge retention and ease of sharpening is good. Additionally, it feels perfect in my hand; its length, weight and balance are just right in my book. Finally, I feel confident that it won’t break on me (assuming that I don’t abuse it.) I’ve never chopped or batoned with it, or any other cutting/slicing knife for that matter.

My knife is just one tool that I carry. I would never go far without a folding saw, and if I’m getting very far afield I top things off with a dedicated chopper, (my new favorite is a Condor Golok.)

So here is my question. Is there in a flaw in my thinking?:confused: Is there a reason why a blade has to be strong enough to hack, pry, and be driven through chunks of wood? I’m not criticizing those of you who baton your short blades, but is “batonablity” a necessary quality for a good wilderness knife? I’d love to hear your thoughts, (I hope that not too many of you are thinking, “Who let this guy on the forum?”)
 
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You found your "One Knife"! Just relax and enjoy. For uses outside of its design, you have other options. You are a lucky man.
 
Your "perfect knife" needs to be able to do all you want it to do in the situations you expect to find yourself. Only you can decide what you expect your "perfect knife" to do and how you will use it. There is nothing wrong with wanting several knives for different situations, or having a knife that can do everything in a worse-case-scenario, just like there is nothing wrong with your choice. This are very individual and personal choices, so there is no "one perfect approach" to it.
 
You CAN have a thick blade and a performance slicer packed into one knife. Scandinavian grinds help-check out the Hatchula by Dylan Fletcher, great example. The HEST is another example-you'd think a 3 inch long saber ground 3/16ths blade would be a mini tank, and it is, but the belly shape also makes it a superior slicing knife. It really all depends on your needs... these makers have thought of just about everything these days, so if you like a beefy blade from thin stock, you can get it. If you like a slicing blade from thick stock, you can get it. If you want a happy medium, well there are plenty of those as well. I'd start with a 12 inch Tramontina machete though, and work from there.
 
Thanks for the reply Bumppo, I really think my Vanguard will be a lifelong favorite. (Of course I still fantasize about an ESEE-4, along with many of the fine handmade knives the blade smiths of this forum produce.)

As I posted this a couple more replies showed up, thanks for all of the comments. I'm here to learn.
 
Vanguard is perfect. Be happy with it. Try to have sympathy for the rest of us who can't ever find that one knife.
 
All a knife has to do is what you need it to do. If it does everything YOU need for the way you operate in the bush.... enough said. :)
 
I baton 3/32 blades. I really hate going over 1/8 in a blade under ... oh, 7 inches.

I think your "feel" is dead on.
 
Kismet said:
Stop reading knife forums. :)
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Listen to this, it's good advice. If I wasn't a member of any internet forums(knife or otherwise), I'd have a hell of a lot more money in my pockets. But, I'd have a hell of a lot less knowledge in my brain.


As others have said, if you've found a knife that does what you need it to, use it and love it. No reason to mess with success.
 
Your Knife, Your Choice. Most of our problems lie in the fact that we are crazy. I love knives, all shapes and sizes. I have MANY good knives. I have MY knife, and I have favorites. There are many favorites, but only 1 "My Knife". You have found yours. Congratulations. Can you own more than 1? Of course, but do you NEED to? Well, we all here have been trying to sort it out for a long, long time. Carry your Vanguard until it no longer serves your needs. Then, look for a new one. Good luck. Moose
 
The only reason some people feel that a knife has to be able to be beaten through a log, or do heavy prying is that they don't carry a chopper (like an axe, machete, kukri, etc), so the knife has to do it.

If you're going to carry a chopper like you said, then your knife doesn't have to do that duty.

BTW, there's nothing wrong with the Vanguard, they are very nice knives, IMO, especially the ones with the rosewood grips.
 
Nothing at all "wrong" with the Vanguard, it's a nice well made knife.

Just be happy you found the one you're happy with and enjoy buying other things. I just happen to like knives and am going to try as many of the ones that appeal to me as I can. I know that there really is no "one knife" for me just yet, but I do enjoy the search :)
 
6shooter said:
If I wasn't a member of any internet forums(knife or otherwise), I'd have a hell of a lot more money in my pockets. But, I'd have a hell of a lot less knowledge in my brain.
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I think that it's too late for me. I've turned the corner where I realize that I don't need any more knives, but you all have opened my eyes to all the great options that are out there. Ignorance is bliss. Not long ago I would have thought HI was a greeting. Now I see it and think, "Hmmm... for the same price I could get the M43 or the Chiruwa Ang Khola, but I might want to save up for an ESEE knife first, wait... who made that killer camp knife? Is he taking orders... I wonder what the wait time is?..."

I really do appreciate all of your replies. Thanks again.
 
For what it's worth here are my thoughts:

The most important requirement of a survival knife is that it must not break !

If the edge holding ain't great I can always touch it up, if the shape ain't great I'll find a way to work with it but if I'm in a survival situation and it breaks I'm SOL !

Sure ya might not batton, hack, pry etc under normal conditions but in a survival situation you might have to do all those and much worse !
 
pitdog said:
The most important requirement of a survival knife is that it must not break !
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+1:thumbup:

In my opinion, I don't ever want to find myself in a situation where the knife I have can't be trusted to endure whatever extreme circumstance that I need it to. I want my choice to be a knife that will have my complete confidence in being able to withstand whatever I need it to even if beyond the scope of what a knife should be expected to do. If I need to jam it into a crevasse to step on to climb out of danger, Multi-Tool are out. If I need to dig somebody out of wreckage and don't have a crow bar, I have a 1/4 7 or 8"thickness whit me, just to rise to the occasion with a smile.
I want to have a armageddon knife, becouse I know that I will die in any case, but is nice to know that my knife Wouldn't let me down!:D
 
pitdog said:
For what it's worth here are my thoughts:

The most important requirement of a survival knife is that it must not break !

If the edge holding ain't great I can always touch it up, if the shape ain't great I'll find a way to work with it but if I'm in a survival situation and it breaks I'm SOL !

Sure ya might not batton, hack, pry etc under normal conditions but in a survival situation you might have to do all those and much worse !
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Like Pit said...it's got to be a solid/tough built knife that I can trust not to break ;)
 
pitdog said:
For what it's worth here are my thoughts:

The most important requirement of a survival knife is that it must not break !

If the edge holding ain't great I can always touch it up, if the shape ain't great I'll find a way to work with it but if I'm in a survival situation and it breaks I'm SOL !

Sure ya might not batton, hack, pry etc under normal conditions but in a survival situation you might have to do all those and much worse !
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However, I think his point is, he carries something else for the heavy work. In such a case, the knife doesn't have to be that strong.
 
One of the things the Air Force Survival Manual repeatedly mentions is the USING TECHNIQUE of your tool. Using it within the limits of its design, and maintaining it as such, is important when keeping your tools in working condition, which is in turn one of the most important factors of survival. I think as nice as the RC5 and other similar blades are when it comes to "abuse now, ask for forgiveness later", much lighter knives will get you by if manipulated within the limitations of its' design. One thing I'll never forget is watching The Art of Survival, and how the instructors manipulated their obsidian knapped blades to do so many different tasks. Slow is smooth, smooth is fast. Take the time to learn how to use your tool, the limits of your tool, and stay within those boundaries and I think you'll come out the other side. Like I said, get a 6 dollar tramontina and you're set :)
 
Rotte said:
Vanguard is perfect. Be happy with it. Try to have sympathy for the rest of us who can't ever find that one knife.
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OK... I about fell out of my chair laughing at that. What could be more true?

I know from reading here that many have their lives constantly on the line in wilderness situations with total equipment failure. The rely solely on their knives to save them from their peril. Their knives have to live up to the rigorous standards that one faces when failure is not an option.

Me? I have carrying knives I like, traditionals, work knives, hunting knives, camp knives, choppers, a couple of cool showoff knives, super high tech steel knives, knives I inherited, and some beaters.

Yet... I will be buying more. I buy and carrying knives because I love them, and don't go anywhere or do anything (except shower) without a blade in my pocket. It may only be a CASE peanut, but it could be my Kershaw Tyrade, too. Sadly, sometimes it is both.

I do it because I like it. :)

I like to use knives ( in construction I rely on my knives every day for work tasks ). I like to read about new models, new steels, new designs, new makers etc. I like talking to other knife guys I know about knives. I doubt I will ever get over it; this affliction has been with me for almost 50 years, since I got my first Boy Scout knife.

My newest treasure? While moving my Mom and Dad to an independent living facility, my Dad gave me his Dad's barlow. It is a well worn old knife at about 80 - 90 years old, and I love it. Getting grandad's knife will slow down my disease a bit. It doesn't get any better than that.

But back to CoyotePhysics'questions, I think you are fine. I have a couple of friends of mine that carry knives they couldn't live without. And when they wear one out (takes about 10 years they tell me), they simply go out an buy another. They use their knives when we barbecue, go hunting/hiking, to open boxes, pry things, and in their everyday work since they are in construction like me. Their knives?

One carries a CASE Sodbuster Jr. in carbon, and the other a venerable Buck 110. To them, these are the best knives EVER made, and all the rest are simply a waste of money. They admire my hardware, but they love their knives and take them completely for granted as something they will always have in their pockets. Nothing else needed.

Talk about getting out of this knife thing cheap!

Robert
 
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