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Survival School Information Needed
- Thread starter Trekker
- Start date
- Joined
- Feb 25, 2003
- Messages
- 63
Depends on your location too. 
Joe
Joe
I will travel anywhere is the US. I already checked out Jeff Randell' School. but the trip were in Peru and I think he has stopped running his survival trips. Equipped to survive is a great sight, but Doug does not run trips, Simply Surival stopped there courses also, and I know Ron Hood doesnt have any more courses either. I was hoping some one here might of has some experince with and course and could give me some ideas. I was thinking maybe BOSS, Jack Mountain Bushcraft, Global Principals, or any other you might suggest.
- Joined
- Sep 27, 2001
- Messages
- 328
Not sure what you are looking for but you might want to check out Tom Brown, www.trackerschool.com I know some people don't really care for Tom but for primitive living/survival skills he is top notch, he knows his stuff and the instruction is ahead of the pack. I've been to some of his classes and I can say, if you can get past Tom's gruff exterior and just learn then you can't beat the Tracker School. BOSS sounds like a good school as well but the price is up there so I couldn't justify it when Tom's classes were so much less. Hope this helps.
Ric
P.S.
You might also try Earthwalk Northwest. www.earthwalknorthwest.com
Ric
P.S.
You might also try Earthwalk Northwest. www.earthwalknorthwest.com
- Joined
- Aug 24, 2003
- Messages
- 1,461
I second Ric's comment. The training of physical skills is top notch at the Tracker School. For the standard class, the very small intergration of philosophy will also be a benefit as you learn to live with, not against. I would be nervous the other survival schools may give the wrong attitude which is just as much a component as everything else in a survival situation. Just my two cents.
- Joined
- Sep 27, 2001
- Messages
- 328
Well said Quiet Bear. The main focus at the Tracker School is to get you to Live in nature, live in harmony if you will. Tom said at one point that if you have the proper skills and the proper attitude then living in the wild is not surviving, you are living. To me that says a lot. If you are in a "Survival" situation it sounds like a struggle you might not live through. So it seems at the Tracker School they want to turn your "Survival" situation into an everyday run of the mill situation where it's no big deal that you might be stuck in the woods. They want you to be so comfortable in the woods that it's like being stuck at the movies or the store.
Just what I took from it. Hope it helps.
Ric
Just what I took from it. Hope it helps.
Ric
Two that Ron Hood recommends on his site:
http://www.self-reliance.net/ (Chris Nyerges)
WSI ( http://www.wildernesssurvival.com/ ) also used to run classes but apparently doesn't any more--Hood also used to recommend them.
http://www.self-reliance.net/ (Chris Nyerges)
WSI ( http://www.wildernesssurvival.com/ ) also used to run classes but apparently doesn't any more--Hood also used to recommend them.
- Joined
- Nov 4, 2000
- Messages
- 22
Gents, I don't want to be controversial but I believe that it is very important to make a distinction between what we might call "primitive camping" and "in extremis survival." While cross-pollination between these skillsets exist, they are distinct IMHO. I apologize in advance for the lengthy post.
Here is what I mean. Primitive camping-type schools often feature training in subjects like natural shelter construction and fire-by-friction methods. Do these things require skill? Hell, yes. But I do not believe that they can be relied upon in a serious survival situation with attendant risks to life and limb. To me, a survival situation is one that combines extreme time sensitivity with geometric consequences---you have to make a decision and act quickly and that decision will decide whether you live or die. I no longer believe that it is possible to build a firebow or debris hut quickly enough for it to save your life in a true survival situation, and I am very uneasy about how much these skills depend on you having the use of both arms and legs.
This is not meant to criticize anyone out there doing good training (these topics are deeply personal and I recognize that)and I am very willing to be proven wrong, but a survival school must help you to: A) construct a pre-event checklist and make high-quality decisions about what to bring, how to use it, who to tell where you are going, etc.; B) utilize a simple decision tree with a logical sequence of basic, quickly answered questions regarding medical status, immediate shelter needs, etc. If land nav, signal, and first aid considerations are not included in a given program's POI, I suspect that these needs have been "assumed away" and primitive camping skills are going to be covered.
Let's be very honest here: to end up in a wilderness survival situation, you pretty much have to volunteer yourself for some level of risk in the outdoors. The sole exception to this might be a commercial plane crash in a remote area, but such an event will be followed by costs-are-not-an-issue SAR efforts. In my own experience as a hunter, the general progression of a survival scenario goes something like this:
Pre-Trip
1. You develop and cultivate fieldcraft and contingency skills (or don't).
2. You get in good physical condition (or don't).
3. You do some research on the wilderness area that you will be visiting and the extremes of the weather conditions, terrain, SAR facilities nearby, etc. there (or don't).
4. You make an intelligent, primary- and contingency-based packing list informed by both a desire to have fun and a knowledge that Nature is not there for your entertainment/safety (or don't).
5. You tell people where you are going and what to do if you miss some kind of important deadline (or don't).
These five things probably account for 70%-80% of survivability, the rest being a combination of luck, randomness, and the ability to just control your more self-destructive emotions under conditions of great stress. I would submit that there is probably a high degree of correlation between the person who is well-prepared and the personality type that can avoid hurting himself/herself in a crazed "amygdala-hijacking" during a survival situation in the woods.
During The Trip
1. (For hunters, at least) You establish a base camp from which to conduct intraday stalks. In remote areas, this may be a tent, tipi, or even a primitive camp of some kind. In less remote, it may be your truck. In even less remote, it may be an established hunting lodge. Regardless, this camp will generally provide good shelter and comfort, be stocked with food and water, and have readily-available means of fire-starting available. The key thing to remember here is that this camp IS NORMALLY CONSTRUCTED UNDER RELATIVELY PLEASANT CONDITIONS, BY PEOPLE OPERATING WITH THEIR FULL PHYSICAL AND MENTAL FACULTIES AND WITHOUT EXTREME, HIGH-STAKES, TIME-SENSITIVE DECISION-MAKING FORCED ON THEM.
2. You go out on your daytrip, bringing minimal gear and your scoped rifle or bow. You plan on getting back to camp before nightfall. Something goes wrong. This usually takes at least one of three forms: you injure yourself, you get lost, or sudden inclement weather sets in and you cannot travel. This is where "survival" sets in---the rest is camping. Often, the worst situations occur when you are caught out in an exposed position above the treeline or in a marsh/moor area with no protection from the wind. Nature is not going to help you out a lot in these situations---that's why they are "survival" scenarios in the first place!
Primitive camping has an incredible amount to recommend it and it requires a host of highly developed skills and patience, but you still need a small battery of pure survival skills and contingency equipment to make your trip a safe one.
Just my two-cents. Please note that I refrain from trying to persuade you towards any particular school or instructor---that was not the point of this whole, lengthy post.
Here is what I mean. Primitive camping-type schools often feature training in subjects like natural shelter construction and fire-by-friction methods. Do these things require skill? Hell, yes. But I do not believe that they can be relied upon in a serious survival situation with attendant risks to life and limb. To me, a survival situation is one that combines extreme time sensitivity with geometric consequences---you have to make a decision and act quickly and that decision will decide whether you live or die. I no longer believe that it is possible to build a firebow or debris hut quickly enough for it to save your life in a true survival situation, and I am very uneasy about how much these skills depend on you having the use of both arms and legs.
This is not meant to criticize anyone out there doing good training (these topics are deeply personal and I recognize that)and I am very willing to be proven wrong, but a survival school must help you to: A) construct a pre-event checklist and make high-quality decisions about what to bring, how to use it, who to tell where you are going, etc.; B) utilize a simple decision tree with a logical sequence of basic, quickly answered questions regarding medical status, immediate shelter needs, etc. If land nav, signal, and first aid considerations are not included in a given program's POI, I suspect that these needs have been "assumed away" and primitive camping skills are going to be covered.
Let's be very honest here: to end up in a wilderness survival situation, you pretty much have to volunteer yourself for some level of risk in the outdoors. The sole exception to this might be a commercial plane crash in a remote area, but such an event will be followed by costs-are-not-an-issue SAR efforts. In my own experience as a hunter, the general progression of a survival scenario goes something like this:
Pre-Trip
1. You develop and cultivate fieldcraft and contingency skills (or don't).
2. You get in good physical condition (or don't).
3. You do some research on the wilderness area that you will be visiting and the extremes of the weather conditions, terrain, SAR facilities nearby, etc. there (or don't).
4. You make an intelligent, primary- and contingency-based packing list informed by both a desire to have fun and a knowledge that Nature is not there for your entertainment/safety (or don't).
5. You tell people where you are going and what to do if you miss some kind of important deadline (or don't).
These five things probably account for 70%-80% of survivability, the rest being a combination of luck, randomness, and the ability to just control your more self-destructive emotions under conditions of great stress. I would submit that there is probably a high degree of correlation between the person who is well-prepared and the personality type that can avoid hurting himself/herself in a crazed "amygdala-hijacking" during a survival situation in the woods.
During The Trip
1. (For hunters, at least) You establish a base camp from which to conduct intraday stalks. In remote areas, this may be a tent, tipi, or even a primitive camp of some kind. In less remote, it may be your truck. In even less remote, it may be an established hunting lodge. Regardless, this camp will generally provide good shelter and comfort, be stocked with food and water, and have readily-available means of fire-starting available. The key thing to remember here is that this camp IS NORMALLY CONSTRUCTED UNDER RELATIVELY PLEASANT CONDITIONS, BY PEOPLE OPERATING WITH THEIR FULL PHYSICAL AND MENTAL FACULTIES AND WITHOUT EXTREME, HIGH-STAKES, TIME-SENSITIVE DECISION-MAKING FORCED ON THEM.
2. You go out on your daytrip, bringing minimal gear and your scoped rifle or bow. You plan on getting back to camp before nightfall. Something goes wrong. This usually takes at least one of three forms: you injure yourself, you get lost, or sudden inclement weather sets in and you cannot travel. This is where "survival" sets in---the rest is camping. Often, the worst situations occur when you are caught out in an exposed position above the treeline or in a marsh/moor area with no protection from the wind. Nature is not going to help you out a lot in these situations---that's why they are "survival" scenarios in the first place!
Primitive camping has an incredible amount to recommend it and it requires a host of highly developed skills and patience, but you still need a small battery of pure survival skills and contingency equipment to make your trip a safe one.
Just my two-cents. Please note that I refrain from trying to persuade you towards any particular school or instructor---that was not the point of this whole, lengthy post.
- Joined
- Aug 24, 2003
- Messages
- 1,461
Great post Beli. I agree 100%, typically a survival scenario as you stated will probably be the case. And having the fore mentioned primitive skills gives me confidence and keeps me in touch with my instincts to make the right decisions should that situation arise. At least that is what I feel works for me.
However, it will not work for everyone and some may feel more comfortable with training for the higher percentage situations. I guess what I am saying is that both points of view are correct depending on the individual. To each thier own. QB
However, it will not work for everyone and some may feel more comfortable with training for the higher percentage situations. I guess what I am saying is that both points of view are correct depending on the individual. To each thier own. QB