Survivalist's love of "batoning" with a knife seems abusive & impractical

M

monkapotamus

Joined
Jan 3, 2015
Messages
38
I'm a newbie to this site and it looks like a font of wisdom on all things knife related. With that in mind I wanted to ask a question about a lot of the videos I see on youtube where a person testing a fixed blade (or even a folding blade!) knife that is purported to be a tactical/survival model looks at "batoning" as a valid and useful test of the knife's hardcore capabilities.

I'm a life long tinkerer and I'm pretty familiar with the stress limits of materials and what abuse can do to them. I've camped quite a bit, but I'm not a prepper or survivalist. Using a decent, high quality, sharp knife as a wood splitting maul is going to rapidly beat the crap out of the edge and quite possibly snap it at some point if the leverage is wrong. If your life really depended on the utility of your knife it's going to be a lot more useful shaving pieces of wood for fires or killing and dressing game than being abused as a wood splitter.

I get that batoning looks cool and seems hardcore, but if you are REALLY stuck in the middle of nowhere hammering on your only survival blade to split wood seems kind of risky, and not the best way to make use of the knife as a tool. Getting smaller pieces of wood would seem to be a more practical approach.

What am I missing here? Why is batoning a great way to use a survival knife?
 
In my non-expert opinion it's something a good knife can do in a pinch, in the absence of tools created for wood processing... but that's about as far as I would take it, personally.

I think the batoning thing really developed into a sort of craze only in the last decade or so... but my info might be incorrect. Don't remember hearing much about it until the last few years.

Edit: I don't watch a ton of those videos, but it seems that usually, the desire to baton comes from "if a knife is all you had."

But what if all you had was a hatchet, or an axe? ;) It's equally possible, I guess.
 
It's not a great way to use a knife, even less so with a folder. Of course, you'll get 10,000 opinions, all different, and even discussing batoning on a certain bushcraft forum will get you banned...that's how contentious this topic can and has been. That said, a fixed blade should handle all your batonong needs if that's an activity you like to indulge in while camping; me, a small axe fits that purpose, fixed blades for field dressing the kill, and camper style folders with tools for general light duty.

Just for your info, here's what a SAK Farmer is capable of....

[video=youtube;F-9LihiP_sA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-9LihiP_sA[/video]
 
What I don't understand about the baton test is why folding knives are tested with the lock engaged. If I remember correctly, the proper way of batoning with a folder is with the lock disengaged.
 
Common sense doesn't come into play with the current fad.

It will change as time goes on like most things seem to.

That survival fantasy that some seem to love to talk about isn't realistic, but it does sell knives like the current Zombie stuff and assorted end of the world stuff.

Each to their own and people like different things.


In a real survival situation most wouldn't have a knife on them in the 1st place and even if they did it sure wouldn't likely be anything that they would be chopping wood with or battening etc.

That's like say a plane crash or getting marooned on an island after having to swim for it.

A satellite phone would be the best survival tool one could have above all others so the signal could be tracked etc, that's just being realistic.

I doubt most people would get into a survival situation sitting in their apartments, condos, or in the middle of a development.

But as I said before it sells knives.
 
It's nice to know what your knife is capable of, in an emergency situation. If you never test it, you'll never know.
I've broken a few...
It helps me decide what ONE knife I'll always have on me, 100% of the time.
 
If you don't want to baton.....don't. Simple. Other people like to and find it a technique that suits their needs and does not endanger their knives .
 
Last edited:
Using a knife and a wooden club to make kindling pre dates youtube, internet forums, and survival tv by many, many years.

Don't think its a good idea? Then don't do it.

What others choose to do or not do with their property is no concern of mine.
 
You are not missing anything. Batoning is more or less a test of the overall toughness of a knife under "what if" scenarios. This makes for good youtube videos and marketing, and also the selling of some knives which after being made absurdly thick and heavy and can do anything, but none of them as well as tools specifically designed for the purpose. I own some (too many) of these knives, but if one were planning a trip into the back country would a $25 Mora combined with a $25 Opinel saw be more practical, and useful for most situations? Absolutely.
 
I think that a lot of 'survivalists' don't have the patience to learn some of the advanced skills. So easier things like batoning are more popular than time consuming activities like building a complete shelter or setting traps and actually taking the time to catch animals. Honestly if that was my only knife I would take the time to carve a wedge. Still batoning is useful beyond kindling. It does have applications in carving and is a great way to get dry wood for a fire set.
 
If you are car camping or don’t mind packing an axe then there is no reason to baton. If you are backpacking and weight is a factor then it is a practical and reasonable way to get kindling. Nothing “survival” about it.
 
I dunno about "survival" but I usually take a large fixed blade (and 1 or 2 small fixed blades) with me when I backpack into the woods.
A quality "chopper" blade in a quality steel should have no trouble batoning through some sierra pine. I wouldn't consider it abuse at all.

Sure, I could bring a small / medium hatchet or axe in addition to my small fixed blades, but what difference does it make?

Since I've joined the forums, I've seen many, many more posts about how "batoning is dumb / abuse" than I have about it's virtues, so I'd say it's pretty much become a meme at this point.
Usually with the tone of "I'm an old-school guy, I don't understand this batoning business. Seems stupid to me." >_>
 
Tuco23 said:
If you are car camping or don’t mind packing an axe then there is no reason to baton. If you are backpacking and weight is a factor then it is a practical and reasonable way to get kindling. Nothing “survival” about it.
Click to expand...

It's almost like certain people see it as a "badge of pride" to distance themselves from the practice. Like they are looking for a way to confirm that they really are better than these noobs they see online.
 
Outdoors Expert Mors Kochanski uses a baton with his knives, but not in the way most "survival" folks do to split wood in place of an axe or wedge. He does it to expedite the making of notches and hooks, usually never deeper than the width of the blade.

Batoning advocates will invoke the froe, a knife-like tool used to make wood shingles. I'm okay with batoning; lots of folks like it, and it's here to stay. I'll use an axe or hatchet to split wood, and if I have a small knife, I'll make a couple of wedges first. You start the split with the blade, finish with the wedges. If I was really in a survival situation, I'd try to protect my knife.

Most of the time, you probably don't need to split wood to make a fire, but if everything was wet, it may be necessary.
 
To add one more thought, the use of a baton compensates for the lack of weight in an edged tool. A knife has an edge, but not as much weight behind it as an axe. Hit the knife with a baton, and it can accomplish heavier duty jobs. If all you have is a knife, batoning is a way to increase it's capabilities.
 
[video=youtube;HfXiFjGVmG4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfXiFjGVmG4[/video]

I think people who say "Knives are not meant for batoning" are like people who would say "bicycles aren't meant for jumping" or something like that. Hey, guess what, some people DO use them that way. What do you care??

Here's a quality knife in quality steel broken from batoning:
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1091639-Cold-Steel-SRK-but-better

And if you think an axe is so much more reliable, they can break too...
http://bushcraftusa.com/forum/showthread.php/121275-Baton-Knife-Failure-Pictures/page3
 
Racing vehicles is abusive and impractical! It's good fun and people love to do it, but the poor little things can get hurt!
 
Some knives handle it fine...some are designed for it.
Some are not.

Use your brain, and for the love of all that is holy, don't use a hammer or steel pipe as a baton. :eek:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top