Sword Identification and Authentication

S

scotta98

Joined
Dec 16, 2014
Messages
10
Hi All,

A friend of mine just brought me a couple of swords to buy and while he is a friend, I think he may be misinformed on what they are and their age so let me get to the story;

This sword measures 40" and the tag on the first sword came with a handwritten note that said that "Research Shows" that it was Spanish in origin and brought to modern day Texas in 1541 by Coronado's expedition to Palo Duro Canyon and that it was made in Toledo Spain but I just can't see it... Besides the condition being too good for a sword of nearly 500 years old. The description of it being a Rapier doesn't look right to me either and that's why I'm here. I'm going to attach some photo's of the first one and then move on to the second;

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The next one was described as a Spanish Rapier made in the New World about 1540 and nearly identical to the above with the exception that there is no engraving on the blade and that it is shorter. This one measures approximately 38" in overall length.

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So what do you think guys? I'm not asking for a hell yea, that's a real original antique but more of a it could possibly be and you ought to have it checked out. Or yet again, are you smoking something funny, these are tourist gimmicks... :) Anyway, anything that you can give me would be very much appreciated!

Thanks very much in advance. Cheers.
 
Both of those look really modern to me. Lots of machine marks on the contours that any halfway competent smith would have smoothed out on even nicer modern made swords. The grind lines look like they're just bevels put on bar stock. Definitely tourist gimmicks.
 
Thanks Eric. That's what I was thinking but he was adamant that they were legit. I think I can even see lathe marks on the top part.
 
These are variations of the Colada sword of El Cid. A pattern that is still sold today. Popularized in the 20th century, both the Colada and Tizona swords of El Cid are the two most manufactured decorative swords since the 1950s. They used to appear in magazine and comic books for about $15. The Colada is said to have been an older swotrd bladew remounted in the 16th century and the Tizona sword a style of the 15th century.. If one searches the net for originals of those two, discussions would fill a small library.

They are wonderful decorators but not meant as functional. Originally sold with a rusty patina, the modern editions are usually bright stainless steel blades with painted/enameled decoration.

Other variations such as yours sometimes decorated for other Spanish heros. You seem to be showing just one sword, or two nearly identical.

Cheers

GC

In addendum

I knew soeone in the 1980s that was convinced his was a common historical pattern and that although he new of the magazine swords, his was the real thing. One of those "OK" moments and we went back to drinking. ;)
 
Hey GC, the pictures do show two different swords. They are nearly identical in form but the second is slightly smaller by 2" as well as not having any engraving. I'll have to tell my mate he's not going to be retiring?
 
Modern replica made in Spain. I had one like the top pic when I was a teen some 50 years ago. They are still being made.
Rich
 
The wire wrap is nicer than anything I've ever been able to do and I've ruined lots of wire trying haha.
 
EricV said:
The wire wrap is nicer than anything I've ever been able to do and I've ruined lots of wire trying haha.
Click to expand...

Haha! You see, that's that quality craftsmanship in Toledo! :eek: I'll tell him I'll give him a hundred bucks for them.
 
A lot of Spanish decorative swords are actually quite well done visually. Some are even worth harvesting bits off them.

The Colada and Tizona El Cid swords the most prolific, with current offerings having gold plate and other bling. Some of the Marto and Art Gladius swords are priced in the hundreds of dollars. It was back in the 1990s my own interests went back to early productions of the Mikado and Japanese films. That was enough to look past the sterling dragon Art Gladius dragon hilt katana swords and then finding Rich's Japanese site, Michael Bell, Bugei, Howard Clark etc and realizing there was a lot to consider with the Medieval and early modern military swords to research. From there, collecting antique dealer links and continuing to learn before buying that first reproduction (a Windlass espada ropera) in 1999, three years after beginning the quest on the internet.

Concentrating on early American swords, I have still managed to read a great deal regarding other swords. The El Cid swords are kind of a standard many become familiar with as mentioned they were selling at less than $20 during the 1960s. The first decorators of Excalibur and the Tizona sword were on a neighbors wall circa 1958. Even then, my childhood friend explaining they were not old.

These are both Colada El Cid examples.

Cheers

GC
 
yup. these are exactly like the ones Pier One sold in the 1980's. they had everything from these here to big two handers.
 
Thanks again Gentlemen for all of your comments. It's so nice to be able to ask a question and get great answers from knowledgeable people. You guys rock! Much appreciated.
 
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