the lowdown on steel

The reason there are so many different steels in the first place is that they are all the best at something. We'll need more information about what you want a knife to do before helping with a steel to do it.

Examples include using A2 (an air hardening steel) for complex shapes to avoid quenching and cracking, 5160 (a low alloy spring steel) for cheap yet strong and durable springs, A-36 (structural steel) for low cost and adequate strength for buildings and bridges and such.
 
is it true that 440A is the best for water conditions?

cause the SOG seal 2000, the knife that navy seals use, is made out of 440A
 
There is no best steel if there is one thing i learned from all the steel threads is that people's opinions vary. Each steel has different advantages and disadvantages; D2 for example holds an edge well but is difficult to sharpen and can rust. Everybody has different favorites, but s30v is my current favorite because it takes an excelent edge, holds it, and is very corrosion resistant, but like d2 it is difficult to sharpen; the sharpmaker helps with that though.

PS. I am not sure what constitutes trolling but from what i have seen people will propably interpret this and some of your other posts as trolling.
 
parachutecord said:
is it true that 440A is the best for water conditions?

cause the SOG seal 2000, the knife that navy seals use, is made out of 440A
Click to expand...

H1 is better because it is not physically possible for it to rust, to my knoweldge, because it is made with Nitrogen (correct me if i am wrong) instead of carbon.

oops sorry for two posts in a row
 
There is no 'best' overall steel. It depends on purpose of he knife.

Examples:
ZDP-189 holds and edge well but you wouldn't want to make a chopper out of it.
High wear resistance steels like S30V, D2, 154CM, ATS-34 are loved by many but
many still love simple steels like 1095 and 12c27 since they both can take a fine edge,
and although may not be as wear resistant as the 'high end' steels they are
easier to sharpen. Also, heat treat and blade geometry plays a big part.
If you have 2 knives made in 1095 and one has an RC of 50 and another of 62 they
will perform very differently. If a knife in S30V has an extremely thick edge it can be outperformed by an inexpensive Vic SAK.

Personally, I care more about the overall package and blade geometry firstly and
then steel secondly. You could have the best steel ever but if the handle
of the knife hurts your hand after a few cuts, who cares what the steel is, you
won't ever cut enough material to find out how well it performs.
 
Of the steel that you can get...
Edge retention- ZDP-189.
Why? High hardness and high wear resistance.

Toughness- INFI (Busse Combat Knife Company).
Why? http://www.knifetests.com/BussefFFBMtestpage.html

Rust resistance- H-1 (though not technically steel).
Why? You cannot get this metal to rust unless you chemically induce it (using industrial acids and the like).


Of the steel that you can't get, or is just really expensive and hard to find...
Edge retention- CPM S150V.
Why? High hardness with extreme wear resistance.

Toughness- Doesn't exist yet.
Why? INFI. While it can be a bit pricey, it isn't hard to find. http://www.bussecombat.com/

Rust resistance- Talonite (again, not technically steel. And H-1 makes a better blade anyway).
Why? it is primarily made of Cobalt. I assume it would be harder to induce corrosion than with the iron based H-1.

All this is my opinion, and you may be better off getting something in-between my recommendations anyway. Like 440A, or D-2.
VG-10 is my favorite all around steel.
 
Puma20-20Cougar-07258020RAW.jpg


I have a feeling he has returned.
 
parachutecord said:
which is the best steel?

D2, 440A, etc.

and why?
Click to expand...

This is like asking "Who is the best looking woman in the world'. Everyone has their own opinion, and there is no right answer.;)

What to you plan on using the knife for? Where do you plan on using it most often? How much do you want to spend on a knife?

I
 
parachutecord said:
is it true that 440A is the best for water conditions?

cause the SOG seal 2000, the knife that navy seals use, is made out of 440A
Click to expand...

That depends on what you want the knife to do in water. If corrosion resistance is the major concern, then 440A is an economical option. If price is not a limiting factor, there are much better options. However, I think that 440A is a pretty good choice, as would be H1, 420HC, and a couple of others. The other "better" options may not even be steel, and can have different properties, such as being easier to bend (weaker) or more flexible, such as titanium. FYI, bending implies a permanent kink, while flexibility means that the knife returns to straight when released from pressure. Just be aware than one of the things knife steels are required to do is be as cheap as possible while accomplishing the other goals.

Also, FWIW, I'm not sure about the assertion than H1 simply cannot rust. With respect to corrosion resistance in stainless steels, the less carbon the better, but I'm not convinced that its complete absence eliminates rust. Of course, its not as though there are lots of threads about rusty H1 either. I'm sure there are environments that will rust/corrode H1 as fast as anything else, you just wont find a person in there poking around with a knife.
 
no d2 for me. got 2 knives in d2, nib, safe queens, humidifier, oiled. one has surface rust spots, the other none. (both are seki-cut bob lum encounters, d2) :eek:

on the other hand, 440c, ou31, 1085, vg-10, s30v, 5160, hitatchi blue, aus-8, and infi have been good to me. my favorite is infi. lots to like about all of them. :thumbup:
 
My personal favorite is a kabar. Im not sure what steel they use but I do know they are darn nice knives. Hope this helped.
 
I like 1095 for hard use knives. You can spend a lot more money without getting any significant improvement in product.
 
H1 is steel, it has carbon, and yes, it does not rust. It's carbon content is low ( .15), but it makes it steel. The corrosion resistance comes from other factors such as nitrogen, nickel, etc. I believe the way it's processed has a part also. Joe
 
Steel in any form is highly overrated. I remember as a kid when blades were made of obsidian (volcanic glass). Man, they took and held a wicked edge, could be bent 180 degrees out of true and spring right back, and were able to cut a wooly mammoth in half with a single swipe. Steel was a big step backwards (IMHO).

Nice try, Sprite. :rolleyes:
 
If there were one best steel for every application then everyone would use it and all knives would have the same steel. But reality is that every steel alloy is a collection of compromises. Some steels do some things better than others. No steel does everything better than every other. More to the point, what is the best steel for a particular application?
 
The Mastiff said:
H1 is steel, it has carbon, and yes, it does not rust. It's carbon content is low ( .15), but it makes it steel. The corrosion resistance comes from other factors such as nitrogen, nickel, etc. I believe the way it's processed has a part also. Joe
Click to expand...

This is straight out of the Spyderco 2008 catalog.
Page 85, under the heading "EXOTIC STEELS".

Exotic Steels are generally accepted as steel, but
by definition are not steel. Examples of Exotic Steels
include H1, ZDP-189, Talonite and Titanium.
There is an old proverb, “There was never a good
knife made of bad steel.” This statement, just like
steel itself, is completely subjective as it relates to
knives and knife knuts. We hope this information
provides you with a foundation to make your own
determinations where steel is concerned.
Click to expand...

I have no idea why H-1 and ZDP-189 are not technically steel (I guess going by this I should have put a note behind ZDP-189 as well), but Sal says it's not, and by putting them in the same category as Titanium and Talonite I think it's pretty clear that this stuff is something other than your classic definition of "steel". Even though they contain iron and carbon.

I can make assumptions, like that carbon is not the primary hardening agent, and therefore you don't get the same structure with these alloys as you would if they were primarily hardened with carbon, and therefore they are not technically "steel".
But that's just an assumption, I think we need a higher power to clarify.

Mete, where are you?
 
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