The "novelty" caliber .. .500 magnum

Doc_Savage

Doc_Savage

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Looking at the poll for favorite Beckerhead caliber.. which rightly selects the .45 ACP, one of the comments made was very much in favor of the venerable .44 magnum. The poster even referenced the highly respected Elmer Keith, as a source of expertise. You just can't get any better than Mr. Keith as a reference, and I mean no disrespect to the other great writers of the time... and please, no one bring up Massad Ayoob... I remember when he started writing full time... nice guy, experienced to be sure, but I just don't put as much faith in him as others of the time.... Oh, he is a great resource now, but then again, age tends to do that... but I digress...

I won't mention the posters name, but his initials were "paperairplane" ... he was extolling the value of the .44 magnum, listing his reasons... And I mostly agree... the .44 mag is a great caliber, and has the advantage of being presented in a wheel gun.... (as an FYI, paperairplane, the .44 automag is a "novelty" caliber)... In a purely "what works best" scenario, a wheel gun is always more dependable than automatic. However, reality is that the semi automatics have made a sustainable impression in the world of reliable defense.. the 1911 can hardly be classified as "undependable".. or "unreliable".. many have, and will trust their lives to this action.... I think it has proven its worth time and again.... but it comes back to mechanics.... the failure of any machine... the semi auto failing before the wheel gun, which fails before the single shot... the same applies to rifles, only includes a greater number of mechanisms...

I am not trying to disparage anyone, nor start a "mine is better than yours war", but wanted to offer an opinion. Unfortunately the opinion is mine, and is the only one I have to offer. It is based in my humble experience, which is no better, nor any worse, than your own. I do have some experience, but in no way hold myself out as better or smarter than anyone else. I will however, make a joke or two, albeit maybe in poor taste to some, once in a while. (see above reference to paperairplane)..

On to the issue...

Paperairplane indicated that the .500 magnum is a novelty caliber, and I wanted to address that. I can see why he might make such a statement, due to the greatness that is the .44 magnum..... but as an owner of handguns in both calibers, let me assure you, the .500 magnum is no novelty. That caliber is the real deal....it is a man, or any other adjective(s) delineating power that you feel comfortable with... It is all of that and more.

The gun is a 5 shot. It does not need to be more, and, in fact, when shooting, you will be happy it is not. It approximately 2-3 times more powerful than the .44 mag depending on loads... I can one hand shoot my .44 all day... the .500 .. not so much....

The .44 magnum is said to have taken down every animal on the North American continent, and I have no reason to doubt this... But then again, the .22 long rifle has probably taken most, if not all, down too.... not that I would try it...

A lot of folks will give you reasons why you don't need a .500, or is too powerful, or too brutal.... and a lot of them are valid, or at least have merit..

But you know what?? You don't answer to them.. if you want one, get it... if you don't like it... you can always sell it....When I bought mine, the guy at the gun shop asked if I knew dinosaurs were already extinct.... I said, yeah... but I wasn't going to hunt dinosaurs... He asked what I was going to hunt... I said, any damn thing I wanted to ....

Yes, is more expensive to to shoot... ridiculously so... it is also more brutal on you than everything else... to the point you are glad it is a 5 shot.... As a matter of fact, if you think the .45 ACP has bad recoil, go back to your 9mm and forget about it...

My only point after this long diatribe is this... The .500 mag is for real, and Elmer Keith would have shit his pants if he could have shot one, and loved every minute of it... It probably would have snapped his wrists... (just kidding)...

Here are some photos... (with Becker content)... for your perusal...

Comment away...

A BK 9, The S&W .500 mag (9" bbl), a Ruger Redhawk .44 mag (7.5" bbl), and a Ruger Security Six .357 mag (6" bbl)... the squares in the linoleum are 4.5" (for scale)

PA010077.jpg


The BK9 and the S&W .500 mag (9"bbl)

PA010078.jpg


The BK9 and the Ruger Redhawk . 44 mag (7.5" bbl) Pachmayr Presentation grips

PA010079.jpg


The BK9 and the Ruger Redhawk .357 magnum (6" bbl)

PA010080.jpg


Doc
 
Assuming you are talking about the 500 S&W Magnum, since there are other 500 calibers that came before it such as the 50AE, 500 Linebaugh and a newer one that I think is called the 500 Wyoming. (Some of these use a period in the official name, some don't, and I don try to keep straight which ones do and don't.)

I'm not sure about the word "novelty", but I would consider them to be "specialty" calibers. We already have a lot of specialty calibers, nothing wrong with a few more. A caliber such as the .44mag is widely available, chambered in firearms from a lot of different manufacturers, the ammunition is widely available from a number of manufacturers and in a wide variety of loadings. The .44mag is widely used for hunting, target shooting and even defense. Only some of these things apply to the 500's. Not that they aren't good and worthy calibers, and useful for certain things, in fact I consider them useful for special purposes, hence my use of the word "specialty".
 
I love my .500 - it is a lot of fun to shoot, and it is very accurate.

My model is the Performance Center version, and I am just now starting to get over flinching with it.

I have been reloading to make it a little cheaper to shoot. My most recent loads are using a 380gr bullet.

Here is a picture with the .460 Magnum.

DSC_9085.JPG


And here is a picture showing the cartridges for comparison -

.500, .460, .45 long colt, and .45acp.
DSC_9089.JPG



best

mqqn
 
bdmicarta said:
Assuming you are talking about the 500 S&W Magnum, since there are other 500 calibers that came before it such as the 50AE, 500 Linebaugh and a newer one that I think is called the 500 Wyoming. (Some of these use a period in the official name, some don't, and I don try to keep straight which ones do and don't.)

I'm not sure about the word "novelty", but I would consider them to be "specialty" calibers. We already have a lot of specialty calibers, nothing wrong with a few more. A caliber such as the .44mag is widely available, chambered in firearms from a lot of different manufacturers, the ammunition is widely available from a number of manufacturers and in a wide variety of loadings. The .44mag is widely used for hunting, target shooting and even defense. Only some of these things apply to the 500's. Not that they aren't good and worthy calibers, and useful for certain things, in fact I consider them useful for special purposes, hence my use of the word "specialty".
Click to expand...

yeah.... since I didn't state .500 S&W mag.... much like you didn't state the .44 Remington mag.... i guess you can make that assumption... although the other calibers you mentioned don't have the word "magnum" in them though... there was a day when the .44 mag was thought of as novelty as well....

not sure what your point is really...but to each his own..

Doc
 
mqqn said:
I love my .500 - it is a lot of fun to shoot, and it is very accurate.

My model is the Performance Center version, and I am just now starting to get over flinching with it.

I have been reloading to make it a little cheaper to shoot. My most recent loads are using a 380gr bullet.

Here is a picture with the .460 Magnum.

DSC_9085.JPG


And here is a picture showing the cartridges for comparison -

.500, .460, .45 long colt, and .45acp.
DSC_9089.JPG



best

mqqn
Click to expand...

thanks for showing the cartridges.... I didn't have any .44 mags, or .357's readily available....

I love the .500 mag and the .45 acp...

haven't picked up any dies yet... gonna have to reload to keep the cost down....

thanks for the reply

Doc
 
The .460 would be my choice over the .500, just for sheer versatility.
 
HOLY CRAP GUYS THESE GUNS ARE FREAKING MASSIVE.

I'M DROPPING LOADS INTO MY PANTS I SHOCK

Seriously, I didn't know they got that big.
 
The .460 can fire the .460, the 45 long colt and the .454 casul rounds.

If you reload, this means you can reload the .45 long colt and then have something along the line of a .357/.38 special on steroids.

You can effectively hunt with either the .500 mag or the .460 mag, but the point is there, you have more options with the .460

best

mqqn
 
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I consider the .500 S&W is a novelty caliber in most of the lower 48 states of the US.
That doesn't mean it's useless or not fun, but seriously folks, it's the extreme. That puts it on the fringe, which makes it mostly a novelty.

The guns are ridiculously large - 73% of the weight of my .30-30 by spec, and requiring a lot more effort to shoot well, more tolerance to blast and noise, etc.

You like it? awesome! have at it.
 
daizee said:
I consider the .500 S&W is a novelty caliber in most of the lower 48 states of the US.
That doesn't mean it's useless or not fun, but seriously folks, it's the extreme. That puts it on the fringe, which makes it mostly a novelty.

The guns are ridiculously large - 73% of the weight of my .30-30 by spec, and requiring a lot more effort to shoot well, more tolerance to blast and noise, etc.

You like it? awesome! have at it.
Click to expand...

What he said.
(Saves me from saying the same thing) :D

That said, I DO shoot a .460 -- but in a Thompson Center rifle, not a wheelgun. I reload and I love that I have the option to shoot mild .45 Colt (it's not LONG Colt, BTW) to rhino-stopping cartridges in the same firearm.

But, Doc -- you surprise me! In going with a large caliber handgun, I thought for sure our friends to the North would all go for a .455 Webley Manstopper! :D
 
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mqqn said:
The .460 can fire the .460, the 45 long colt and the .454 casul rounds.

If you reload, this means you can reload the .45 long colt and then have something along the line of a .357/.38 special on steroids.

You can effectively hunt with either the .500 mag or the .460 mag, but the point is there, you have more options with the .460

best

mqqn
Click to expand...

True... the guy at the shop tried to talk me into the .460.... for all of those reasons....

I wanted the .500, so I bought it....I may pick up a .460 one day... but its more fun to hear the cries of "novelty", "extreme", "specialty" from the "others".... makes me chortle...

ain't got no friends... and all the others, they hate me....

an old sig line... need to go back to it

I shoot the .45 long colt in a SAA

Doc
 
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First off, to the 1911. I really like them and carried one on duty for many years. But, they OFTEN suffer from reliability issues. I mean often. To illustrate the point, a good friend is the range master at a local law enforcement agency range and see tons of experienced shooters. He is a practical guy and not a "hater" by any means. He was telling me that he has yet to see a 1911 finish a 50 round qualification course without a malfunction. One of my shooters brought out a recently purchased 1911 that day. It malfunctioned within a few rounds. I know there are many great 1911's and I might anger some by speaking such evil:), but from the factory it is much less reliable than many other designs. This comes from first hand experience and observation. The lowly Glock will function 100% from cradle to grave if kept even reasonably clean. It's just not as pretty or fun to play with. History alone is enough reason to keep a 1911 around, but I would no longer choose one over other designs to protect my life. Caliber is another issue. I used to be a died in the wool .45 ACP guy. After the .40 S&W came out, I changed my mind. Enough on that.

On to the fun stuff. I love handguns and handgun hunting. I also consider the .500, all of them, a specialty caliber, as has been said. "Specialty" is a perfect term IMHO. Novelty kind of implies it's only neat, but not useful. These extra large revolvers are very useful, but not for everything, just as my TC Contender in .35 Remington is limited in it's usefulness. The S&W .500 in a hunting length barrel weighs 71 oz. That's not far from my .308 carbine in weight and almost as darned big! That's my main issue, aside from recoil. The .44 magnum is more "shootable" and comes in packable handguns. To me it's just much more useful for a wide variety of things from defense to hunting. Again, the biguns are great and perfectly useful, but are more specialized. I'm not a BH, so I didn't take part in the poll;). Take care.
 
I used to collect cartridges, and if I remember correctly, I think the reasoning for the term ".45 Long Colt" came from the late 1800's when there was also a (shorter) .45 Schofield cartridge used by the U.S. Army. The Schofield cartridge could be used in the Colt 1873 revolver, but the Colt cartridge could not be used in the Smith & Wesson Schofield revolver.

According to Barne's Cartridges of the World, there were potential situations where soldiers during the Indian Wars had S&W Schofield revolvers issues to them, but their supply wienies issued .45 Colt ammo for the pistols. Oopsie. :eek:

~Chris

ps: .44 mag. Ruger SBH here. :thumbup:
 
jdk1 said:
First off, to the 1911. I really like them and carried one on duty for many years. But, they OFTEN suffer from reliability issues. I mean often. To illustrate the point, a good friend is the range master at a local law enforcement agency range and see tons of experienced shooters.
Click to expand...

Indeed, the design isn't made for mass-manufactured reliability.
However it is the only handgun design I can think of offhand, with the exception of S&W revolvers, that is made by literally DOZENS of manufacturers. So comparing "the 1911" in general to "the Glock", for instance, isn't apples and oranges.

It's apples and cherries and pears and watermelons and lemons (haha) vs. oranges.

for instance, S&W revolvers vs. Taurus knock-offs....
 
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