the ORIGINAL BOWIES, purpose and history

Cobalt

Cobalt

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It's obvious from reading in here that bowies have come in all shapes and no single design can claim to be "THE" bowie. There are the traditional looking ones like the Western or Case bowies, some look more like the Marbles Bowies, some look like the Trailmaster blade shape, some look like an overgrown kitchen knife.

The one commonality is that they were all fairly substantial in size. According to a friend/part time knife maker/forger/part time mountain man the bowie was a tool first for survival and a defensive weapon second.

So two questions follow for bowie knife fans:

1. What do you feel is the purpose of the old bowies always talked about (Pre- 1900's)?

2. What do most of the bowie knife fans consider the most versatile size in a bowie? Ie, blade thickness, OAL.

Blade design has already been discussed to death and the result is no different than 100 years ago, all the different designs have their purpose. so I though I would go into the size
 
The heyday of the Bowie pattern was between 1840 and 1870. After 1880 the knives tend to get smaller and evolve into modern hunting knives. As with so many other knives the Bowies were designed to "sell". They were billed as fighter/utility patterns but you got to wonder how many were actually used that way.

Its interesting that the knives are initially very popular with troops on both sides of the Civil War. But, its this same generation that eventually drives the development of more practical hunting knives after the war.

 
I agree with your friend. The first purpose was for survival and with the bowies heft it could be used for a lot of tasks.

Secondly it was used for defense. Although defense could be considered a form of survival. An old adage states, "Defensively you use your knife to fight your way to your gun."

As for overall length, probably in the range of 12 to 13 inches with some heft to it. Large enough to get the job done, but not so large as to be a burden to carry.
Rs
Don
Medicine Man of the Extinct Fugowee Tribe.
 
Cobalt:
Purpose, whatever had to be done. It's akward to do some things with a LARGE knife but impossible to do many things with a small knife.
Size, in an era that had single shot firearms for the most part, a LARGE knife allowed the user to inflict injury from a greater distance. The intimidation factor had to be worth the extra size also.
These are only my opinions and opinions are like armpits, some are less offensive than others.

------------------
P.J.
P.J. Turner Knife Mfg, Inc.
Uluchet, What's an Uluchet? Find out at...
www.silverstar.com/turnermfg


 
Expanding (if I may) on not2sharp,s reply that the hayday was 1840 to 1870. The interesting thing here is weapons development. Most firearms during this period were of the single shot muzzle loading varity. Which ment the prudent individual would carry a secondary of some type such as a Hawk (not the bird) or a Bowie knife. This would been carried in addition to their patch knife and maybe a green river skinning knife or two.

The observation here is that during the 1870s and later the knives started to shrink in size to the hunting varity we know now, is that because of the advent of cartridge firearms with higher capacities and faster reloading hard to say but maybe.

Certainly it could be argued that the need for a secondary weapon of large size in the presance of Cartridge firearms might not be as great. There is also the small matter of Laws many states enacted Laws spacificaly targeting large Bowie type knives.

I think the purpose was many fold, that is to say survival and day to day living first followed buy combat second.

The blade length I think should be around 10 to 13 inches and thickness 5/16 or thicker.

 
Makes sense to carry one big knife in those days versus carrying several more usefull sizes that are available today.
 
Most real 19th century bowies were small, 6" blade is typical, with most in the range of 4" to 8". The much bigger ones are most popular with collectors NOW, but they were highly atypical at the time, being awkward to carry, and nearly impossible to conceal.

And a bowie knife was and is a weapon. Using it for cutting brush was like using your pistol butt to pound in tent stakes. A greenhorn or a real yahoo might do that, but not someone with any sense. Other knives were carried as tools (butcher knives, pocketknives, dinner knives, lancets, machetes, etc., along with axes, hatchets, saws, shovels, and other tools).

The very first bowie knife was Rezin Bowie's hunting knife (a large knife for killing big game) that was pressed into service for self-defense in 1827, but after that the whole point of the 'bowie knife' concept was knife-as-weapon.
Ever since then, everybody has had his own opinion on what a 'bowie knife' OUGHT to be, which is what accounts for their vast diversity.

If you want to read more, see pages 318-345 of Levine's Guide 4th edition (in which I corrected several errors I made in previous editions); also pages 224-227 on folding bowies.

BRL...
http://pweb.netcom.com/~brlevine/books-k.htm
 
Thanks, for the info, but if they were primarily fighting weapons wouldn't a larger blade been more usefull than a 6 to 8 inch blade. The more reach the better usually, right? I don't think I would want to take my 6 inch SOG and take on a Hells Bells with it, I think I would be on the loosing side of that one.
 
"A long-bladed knife has been found to be less maneuverable than one with seven or eight-inch blade, which is generally long enough for the slash and thrust type of strokes found most effective in close combat knife fighting; a longer knife is apt to be unwieldy." _The Fighting Knife_, W.D.Randall Jr. and Col. Rex Applegate
 
Thanks, Bernard for the mention of large HUNTING knives as early precedent for Bowie knife. Look at English and German "hunting" knives used for killing of game caught and held by hunting dogs. A La the "London Hunting Knife" Did you do the article in Blade a couple of years about same?
 
Did I? I don't remember
biggrin.gif

I did a long piece on Samuel White Baker in the National Knife Magazine, and I did the piece on London Hunting Knives in Knives 98.
I need to check my bibliography, and you can too, at
http://pweb.netcom.com/~brlevine/1bib1016.txt

although I guess I should update it, as it is almost 4 years out of date now...

But I don't find one for Blade. Either it was somebody else, or you are thinking of the piece in K98.

BRL...

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http://pweb.netcom.com/~brlevine/links.htm
 
i wont pretend to know nearly as much as mr levine...but bors is right...the primary weapon was a single shot rifle...after that you went for your knife....and the most common "bowie" knife was like the mediterranean bowie....basically a big chefs knife....

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http://www.mayoknives.com


 
So, does this mean that you should never date the cheating wife of a chef or butcher? Tom?
 
Mr. Levine has an excellent article in Knives 2000 titled, "Great Bowies I Have Known". About the original Bowie, and other Bowies of the 19th Century. I highly recommend the article.
We are indeed lucky to have this site and all these experts at our disposal.

Dave
 
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