thinking about getting a straight razor. what more do i need for it?

M

M Wadel

Joined
Sep 11, 2005
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this will probably be my primary shaver so it have to be just as good (sharp) or better than a gillette mach3.

the stones

what stones do i need really? ive been reading about the norton 4/8k it seems to be popular, what is it made of? does it wear down fast?

what about a spyderco ultrafine stone, are those fine enough for this application? are these 4-5000ish grit? comparable to the norton 4/8k?

strops and pastes

do i need 2 strops for different grit pastes?


i was thinking 1 spyderco ultrafine stone and 1 strop with 1/2µ paste, is this enough? or do i need the more expensive norton 4/8k, 1µ paste and 1/2 to get a good shave?



please post your sharpening kit for razors and tell me how it works
 
Wadel,
You may get some advice here, but you should also check out the Razors site. Scroll down to the bottom of the page and use the "Forum Jump" box to get over to the BladeForum : Razors, Scissors, Trimmers & Personal Grooming Accessories page. There are several discussion there now about this topic.
 
Nice reference link. I just gave it a read.

My dad had a straight razor and a strop. I was mostly aquainted with the strop. :eek:
 
Other than nostalgia, for the life of me I see no reason to use a straight razor. It is very time consuming, inherently unsafe and you'll never convince me that you get a closer shave. It may feel that way initially, but that is probably due to irritation of the skin causing minor inflammation. Hence, the skin envelopes the stubble for awhile.

Are you going to throw out the color TV's next, and go back to a 1950 B&W Magnavox with a 12 inch screen and a 300 pound case?

There are times when technological advancements move mankind forward...and I think that Gillette is one of those innovators.
 
tim,
I doubt I will ever use a straight razor either, but I would like to. In the hectic, modern life that we endure, the power of ritual and ceremony should not be short-changed. It has all the elements. The authenticity and refinement of the tools, the skill of the practitioner, the tranquil setting, and the element of danger. :cool:
 
Well, you won't need the stones for quite a while. I don't know how often to plan on shaving with it, but even with a daily shave you should probably get along for 6 months till you need to hone. The Norton stones aren't all that expensive. Straight razors are extremely soft (steel) so I would avoid a ceramic hone, even though it does work. A fine waterstone is ideal and not overly expensive.

You really, really need a strop, hanging, good leather (fine grained) preferably with a canvas side. Without you might as well forget about buying the razor, and some compound to maintain the strop....this is NOT abrasive compound you would use on your other knives!

Finally, you need a brush and some real soap. Again without you might as well stick to your Mach (insert number). A real shaving soap is NOT PH neutral. It must be highly basic and you need to give it time to penetrate in to skin and beard. That raises the hair and give a much easier and closer shave. The soap is cheap, the brush is not. You don't need to buy the ultra expensive ones, they are nice, but a basic badge brush will serve you well for many years.

And no, you don't need bandaids, shaving with a straight razor is not very difficult. It best, you slowly step it up, try to shave the entire face but keep a saftyrazor handy. If you notice some spots that didn't come out as clean as you would like use the safty razor, DON'T TRY TOO HARD. Use the straight razor the next time and try to pay attention to the spots you missed the last time. After 5 or 10 time you should not need the safty razor anymore.

DO NOT judge the shave directly after shaving. You need to rinse the face and wait for the skin to calm again. It takes (for me) about 30 minutes for the pores to close again and the hair to retract. Only then you will be able to really judge how close a shave you managed to give yourself.

Hope this helps a little bit.

Good luck!
 
Tim,
You will get a closer shave. Even though I will not succeed to convince you, I will still try. The reason is very simple. The safty razor has an inherent problem that the angle of the blade is not controlled. At different parts of the face you need to keep a different angle, if you go across the grain you need a different angle and if you go against the grain yet another. The hand adjusts for that automatically with just a little bit of practice. Because of that, you NEVER have to go against the grain with a straight razor other on those places that you have trouble reaching otherwise. Like under the chin it is often easier to go towards the curvature than away from it, even if it means that you go against the grain. The safty razor is always a bad compromise. To shallow an angle to cut with the grain, to high to go against the grain. If they would raise the angle so that it would be appropriate to cut with the grain, your face would be a bloody mess if you'd decide to go against the grain. If the drop the angle more you might as well forget shaving with the grain.

Of course the other problem with a safty razor is the culture that it cultivated. If you would use the same procedure (preparing the skin with two applications of a good lather from a real shaving soap and a brush instead of foam from a can, you would get much better results from a safty razor as well, and you wouldn't need the ridiculus 5, 6 or 7 blades. But of course many people expect to get a shave in under 5 minutes and preferably while taking a shower. Again an example that you get out what you put in. It takes me about 15 min to shave, half of that time is the actually shaving. The other 7 min are lathing up, giving the lather time to work in and to strop the blade. The fact that they come out with more and more blades shows how inadequate safty razors actually are. If the first blade would actually cut the hair properly, you wouldn't need a second, third etc. blade. With a straight razor you can ensure that the hair is cut the first time, once its gone its gone, a second blade achieves precisely nothing.

Why are straight razors inherently unsafe? I have cut myself with safty razors (one that was called "Protector"....ironic isn't it?), and I have cut myself with a straight razors as well. I have never taken my head off either way. As a matter of fact the cuts with the safty razor are much more bothersome. Usually you take of an entire patch (small of course) of skin, you don't just cut into the skin. With the straight razor you might get a small nick but they usually heal much quicker.
 
oh yeah now its on its way :D dovo stainless w polished stainless handle. i also ordered a spyderco UF stone even tho its not the best for this application, but i hope it will do, it was convenient to buy both from the same place (they didnt have nortons).

anyway tomorrow i will go leatherhunting in the stores downtown (for a couple of diy strops). exactly what kind of leather am i looking for? from what animal, and which part?
 
HoB, you may convince me afterall. It's interesting the points that you bring up about the soap. Years ago, I did use a badger brush and I think that Old Spice made a soap for shaving. I still used a safety razor though.

Any recommendations on soap or will any "shaving mug" soap work. I know that if you look, you can still find them in the drugstore.

I suppose that this will kick off yet another obsession with me as I end up with 22 razors; 12 strops; 8 mugs and a lifetime supply of soaps.:D
 
Razors are not soft. The steel in a razor blade will readily chip.
Bill
 
Bill DeShivs said:
Razors are not soft. The steel in a razor blade will readily chip.
Bill
Click to expand...
Actually, I am pretty sure that it will dent, not chip, but the dents are so large that they may feel like a chip. I posted a microscope image of such a dent that developed while thread cutting tests (this is the thread if you are interested: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=399057). When asked about what steel Sal would be using if they ever were to make a straight razor, Sal said: Something soft similar to what Dovo is using (Sal himself uses a Dovo if I recall correctly).

Tim: I have read many times that "Musgo" is simply the best (used to be apparently very common and available anywhere but it's hard to find now). I have never tried it. You can buy it here: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=399057). Personally, I have been using the shaving mug soap also from Classicshaving.com and have been quite happy with it (ordered a 5 pack after I used up the first I had purchased. I'd imagine that any old fashioned shaving mug soap will work. Important is that it contains a lot of fat and that it is not neutral like many modern shaving soaps.

M Wadel: Any smooth and fine split cowhide will work. Its not too important but Razors a more fragile than pocket knives and like a finer strop with no compound best, it seems. It should be a hanging strop though. Since you lay the razor flat on the strop it has a bit more give and "wraps around the edge" a bit more. Something you would want to avoid for a regular knife, but I find it works better on razor.

I guess I bring in my camera tomorrow and post some pages from an old American Barber Manual.
 
I have seen large pieces fly out of the edge when one was used to cut the covering off of a golf ball. I have done no hardness tests on razors, but have sharpened them and reground them. There is no reason whatsoever for the steel to be soft, and every reason for it to be much harder than the average pocketknife.
Bill
 
AEB-L is a razor blade steel, optomized for high push cutting sharpness + corrosion resistance.

-Cliff
 
Supposedly the edge has to retain some elasticity for a shave. Kyocera tried to develope a ceramic straight razor but apparently ceramic is waaay to hard yield a good razor. Apparently some researchers at Kyocera made that discovery the hard way in self tests :).

Mmmh, aren't golf balls wire wrapped? What would make someone cut the cover off of a golf ball :eek:? Ok, I don't ask :). The blade of a razor is so thin that I could easily see breakouts occuring in such a use without the steel having to be overly hard.

Cliff: Do you know what hardness a common razor is run at? I don't know, I have only seen common references to their softness in comparison with pocket knives.
 
Ceramic has way too low an edge stability to make a good razor. Sandvik stainless razor blade steels are designed to be ran very hard. I'll see if I can't find out how they are hardened specifically in razor blades.

-Cliff
 
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