Thoughts concerning the ZT 0560 --- Elmax steel any good?

Joined
Jun 4, 2012
Messages
193
I ordered one a bit on impulse (was considering the contego and adamas --- still might get one and they are cheaper). I just have a feeling this is the knife for me --- size, looks, weight, Hinderer, unassisted, strong lock, nice blade shape, cool factor.

The steel is a bit concerning as so few blades have it and a few that do/did are fairly cheap. (Also, I'm sure there is no comparison but the Cryo is so much cheaper and has won at least one award.) Is this steel better than S35V (ZT 0550)? And is the heat treat performed by the European manufacturer or Kai? I assume it's stainless with good edge retention and maybe 62 Rockwell or so. (Bear with me, I'm still learning.)

If I really like it I'll keep it, if not the adamas might be the one for me (or the bedlam if I just want looks). If I like it, I'll probably consider calling/emailing Dan at Kryptoglow (anyone have his email?; blue sounds good).

Anything I should know about the 560? (I'm surprised that it seems a bit cheaper than the ZT 300). (I'm left handed but a lefty at Kai assured me it's no issue.)

Thanks!
 
I love the 560. In my opinions Elmax is superior S35V. It has very good edge retention and great corrosion resistance. I think you will love the 560, and I far prefer it over the Adamas which is a great knife in its own right.
 
Hi:

I looked Elmax up on Google and found the manufacturer and some other info. One is a Kershaw --- possibly discontinued. Another I didn't look at was selling at Sears for $90 or something.

P.S. You can probably call Kai.
 
If I really like it I'll keep it, if not the adamas might be the one for me (or the bedlam if I just want looks). If I like it, I'll probably consider calling/emailing Dan at Kryptoglow (anyone have his email?; blue sounds good).

Adamas is a great knife and excellent value at $130 , extremely tough beefy knife , overall it's probably the toughest production folder you can buy today at any price range .
Bedlam has flimsy thin blade , but other then that , the knife is a beast , extremely rigid and tough handle construction with zero flex , the steel pommel is very cool and while there is some vertical blade play , the AXIS lock engage on this knife is the deepest I ever saw on any Benchmade by far , so the lockup itself is extremely secure
 
I'm really liking my 560, I just put a Toxic Green/glow scale on it, Elmax is a very tough stainless steel with good edge retention (above S35VN, S30V, D2 probably around M4 Level) and very good corrosion resistance, its a little better than S30V/S35VN in just about every category. Here's a couple other threads on it, though I'm sure you could find more with a quick search.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/711640-elmax-steel-(how-does-it-compare-to-others-)

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/printthread.php?t=969814&pp=20
 
While I don't think Elmax is at M4 level in edge retention, I do agree it's probably better than S30V, S35VN, and D2. Definitely a very good steel and it's corrosion resistance is very, very good. Don't worry about the steel, it's very good and you're not going to find a lot of knives with better steel. You have to get in to S90V, M390, M4, etc to do better, it seems to me.

The 560 is a great, great knife. It's the perfect balance of toughness/size/weight/etc. Actually, it's not even a balance because it's just as tough as knives like the 0300 and maybe even as tough as my Striders (at least close), but it's very light and yet big. It's a very good uncompromising design.

Personally, I think there are plenty of production knives tougher than the Adamas and many of them with better fit and finish, better steels, lower weight, etc. The 560 and 550 are both included and the Spyderco Gayle Bradley is also a good example of a hard use knife that has better steel, better fit and finish, tougher, lighter weight (I think), and overall much better value.
 
The 560 is a great, great knife. It's the perfect balance of toughness/size/weight/etc. Actually, it's not even a balance because it's just as tough as knives like the 0300 and maybe even as tough as my Striders

.

The 0560 is not "just as tough as knives like the 0300 " , I would go as far as saying they are not even close , the 0300 is much beefier and sturdier all around
Your $500 "high speed low drag operator" Striders are a toy comparing to the 0300 or the 0200 in terms of toughness and durability.

Personally, I think there are plenty of production knives tougher than the Adamas and many of them with better fit and finish, better steels, lower weight, etc. The 560 and 550 are both included and the Spyderco Gayle Bradley is also a good example of a hard use knife that has better steel, better fit and finish, tougher, lighter weight (I think), and overall much better value.

That's some seriously funny stuff right there , I would say borderline trolling
Your Gayle Bradley sure have a better fit and finish , is lighter and have a better steel , but in the strength department the Gayle Bradley is a gas station toy knife comparing to Adamas
And no , as much as I love the ZT 0560 and 0550 , and I love them a lot , they are not even close to the Adamas strength , and value ? you gotta be kidding me , the Adamas is exactly half the price of the 0560 , there isn't even a question what knife have the better value
There is probably nothing short of some Demko tri-ad custom that can beat the Adamas strength.
 
The 0560 is not "just as tough as knives like the 0300 " , I would go as far as saying they are not even close , the 0300 is much beefier and sturdier all around
Your $500 "high speed low drag operator" Striders are a toy comparing to the 0300 or the 0200 in terms of toughness and durability.



That's some seriously funny stuff right there , I would say borderline trolling
Your Gayle Bradley sure have a better fit and finish , is lighter and have a better steel , but in the strength department the Gayle Bradley is a gas station toy knife comparing to Adamas
And no , as much as I love the ZT 0560 and 0550 , and I love them a lot , they are not even close to the Adamas strength , and value ? you gotta be kidding me , the Adamas is exactly half the price of the 0560 , there isn't even a question what knife have the better value
There is probably nothing short of some Demko tri-ad custom that can beat the Adamas strength.

The GB is tough. Calling it a gas station toy knife is "borderline trolling".
 
The GB is tough. Calling it a gas station toy knife is "borderline trolling".

First - "tough" is all relative .
Second - I said "in the strength department the Gayle Bradley is a gas station toy knife comparing to Adamas" , and yeah , the GB is a toy comparing to the Adamas .
 
The 0560 is not "just as tough as knives like the 0300 " , I would go as far as saying they are not even close , the 0300 is much beefier and sturdier all around
Your $500 "high speed low drag operator" Striders are a toy comparing to the 0300 or the 0200 in terms of toughness and durability.



That's some seriously funny stuff right there , I would say borderline trolling
Your Gayle Bradley sure have a better fit and finish , is lighter and have a better steel , but in the strength department the Gayle Bradley is a gas station toy knife comparing to Adamas
And no , as much as I love the ZT 0560 and 0550 , and I love them a lot , they are not even close to the Adamas strength , and value ? you gotta be kidding me , the Adamas is exactly half the price of the 0560 , there isn't even a question what knife have the better value
There is probably nothing short of some Demko tri-ad custom that can beat the Adamas strength.

That's fine, man. That's your opinion. I feel like you haven't handled a 560, a Strider, or a GB, but maybe you have and you feel like the heavier knife equals the tougher knife. That's not always the case. If you're literally trying to destroy the knives by trying to chop through the handles with an axe or run them over until one fails to perform, the 0300 would probably last longer than the 560. They are extremely similar in construction, though, and in ways that matter in real-world use of the knife and how they will hold up to hard use, they will probably function about the same. They are both 3D machined titanium frame locks with steel liners and G10 scales. I believe the blade thickness is the same on both. Who knows if the Elmax of the 560 would be less likely to break at the tip, or something, but probably not. They're probably about the same in that aspect with strong tips on both (BTW, I just compared my SNG and it definitely has a thicker blade and even the full flat ground one has about the same tip thickness. The 3/4 ground and tanto SNG/SMF's will easily have stronger blades overall than both, IMO). The frame and liner on the 560 is milled out but I don't think there's anything you'd really ever use the knife for, even abusing it, that would make the skeletonizing and milling matter. It's strong where it needs to be and you're not going to break the frame of that knife. That's why they milled it out even on a knife that is intended to be a lower priced version of quite possibly the toughest of all, the Hinderer XM's. Because the rest is extra weight. BTW, if we include the 550, that one has thicker Ti than both which is not radiused or milled out at all. Time will tell if the KVT bearing system of the 560 is as strong as phosphor bronze washers, but my money is on the hardened steel ball-bearings, which are much harder and could very well stand up to prying and other forms of hard use that would bring on blade-play better than the 0300. I don't really feel the need to keep going on to each part of the knives, but these are just my impressions and opinions. I just feel like you could put the 560 through any actual knife duties (including actually abusing the knife, using it for things that Servicemen might actually have to put it through) that you could put the 300 through and the fact that it's milled out to save weight wouldn't really matter AND there are some things about the 560 that could even stand up better. I will say the pivot is definitely stronger on the 0300, but I've never heard of breaking a pivot on any knife as tough as these and while a bigger pivot might be useful for keeping the blade from getting play, I still think the 560 would hold up better to blade play. Just my speculation.

Saying Striders are a toy compared to the 0300 in terms of durability is just ridiculous, IMO. You do realize the 0300 is a Strider collaboration, right? While the design was probably mostly from Ken Onion, it definitely at least borrows a lot of the same features and ideas for making a hard use knife. I'm not a huge Strider fanboy at all. I like mine, but they're really not my favorite knives. I also probably wouldn't own any if they hadn't stepped up their fit and finish and fixed their lock geometry lately. However, I have to admit that they're probably the closest to feeling as sturdy as a fixed blade than any other knife I've owned. Almost none of my knives have blade play, but the Striders honestly just feel like you could repeatedly put lots of pressure on the blade, trying to detect a hint of blade play and get nothing. I honestly don't know what would stand up to more abuse, an SNG or a 0300, but I'd probably bet on the Strider. Hard to say, they're both very tough. The Strider is definitely better to be in the sense that it has a thicker blade, a bigger pivot, feels like a tank, and yet is a LOT lighter. That's just laughable to say it's a toy compared to the 0300, though. Wow. What about an SNG or SMF makes it a toy compared to the 0300??

Maybe you've never held a Gayle Bradley, but it's is an extremely tough knife. It has a blade that's made to cut a lot better the 0300, so it's not extremely thick and I will certainly admit it's blade isn't nearly as tough, but it's an extremely robust and durable knife. The thick steel and G10 (I know it's carbon fiber, but that's just a veneer. It's actually a G10 handle) frame would definitely hold up to a lot more abuse and destruction than any of these knives, and as much as I love Titanium frame locks, more-so than liner locks, the super thick steel liner lock of the GB (which ha almost no relief cut at all, by the way) is also tougher than any of these knives. I don't have any fear of any of these Ti frame locks failing on me because I don't use the blade that way, but I would trust the Gayle Bradley's lock not to fail more than any of these knives as well. Easily.

I don't care to get into the Adamas and I didn't own one for long because I didn't care for it too much, so I don't have a ton of experience with it. But just because the frame is extremely heavy doesn't make it the hardest use knife on the market. The Axis lock might be very strong but it's just not the lock I'd choose for a hard use knife that I wanted to resist wear, blade play, failing, etc. I'm not saying it's bad, I just don't trust it as much for hard use (if I really used folding knives that hard anyway...). The Adamas just didn't seem all that robust or well built to me. I still consider the Gayle a better value. It's just quality all the way around. It's a hard use knife that is still very classy and has a blade that will perform very well for any cutting with better steel than any of the knives we're talking about and may even have the best fit and finish of all of them. Definitely better than the Adamas and even the 0300 if you ask me, and it's half the price of the 0300.

I'm not saying the 0300 isn't a very tough knife but it's very, very heavy and I do believe these knives that are much lighter can still be just as tough and durable over time.
 
First - "tough" is all relative .
Second - I said "in the strength department the Gayle Bradley is a gas station toy knife comparing to Adamas" , and yeah , the GB is a toy comparing to the Adamas .

Lol. Have you ever owned a GB? The GB isn't a tactical knife and it probably wouldn't be the only knife I brought with me into the field if I was a Soldier. It's more of an extremely durable and robust EDC with some other potential. But the only thing about the Adamas that I can think of that's tougher than the GB is the blade. And I don't mean the toughness of the edge (as in edge retention), I mean the fact that the blade is thicker. Soooo... better for prying. Which is something I'd almost never do with a knife blade anyway. But granted, we are talking about hard use knives and the abuse they can take and some people need to use a knife for things like that in emergency situations and such.
 
Adamas is a great knife and excellent value at $130 , extremely tough beefy knife , overall it's probably the toughest production folder you can buy today at any price range .
Bedlam has flimsy thin blade , but other then that , the knife is a beast , extremely rigid and tough handle construction with zero flex , the steel pommel is very cool and while there is some vertical blade play , the AXIS lock engage on this knife is the deepest I ever saw on any Benchmade by far , so the lockup itself is extremely secure

the toughest production folder you can buy today at any price range? Yikes, I bet you work for BenchMade.
You accept blade-play on a new knife? No, thank you. The Adamas blade-steel is 0.160 thick of D2 which likely trumps the GB's 3mm of CPM-M4. Given that the Adamas blade is 33% thicker blade-stock than the GB, which do you figure is tougher? And my ZT 0550 with blade-steel of 0.156" of S35VN is right there alongside your Adamas for toughness...all day long. There's a lot of Adamas fanboys around; I'm NOT one of them. Good knife? Yes. Great knife? No.
Of course, you should throw in the DPX HEST 2.0 to be fair...a D2 blade that's 0.187 thick, titanium framelock, Lion Steel Rotoblock. Tough little honey.
How would you think the HEST 2.0 compares with your Adamas?
Sonny
 
Last edited:
I use my ZT0551, and even abuse it. The steel is excellent.

Try it and you will find the same results.
 
I meant to post on this earlier. I like the Adams, but the 0561 IMHO is a better knife. Its more expensive, but I have really beat on mine quite a lot, and it has taken the abuse in stride. I even hammered it through some steel reinforced, hydraulic line. ELMAX has proven to be plenty tough for a high wear stainless steel, and is extremely corrosion resistant.

I like the Adamas, but for my money, I'll pay a bit more for a knife I LOVE.

The 0560/1 is one of the most hyped knives in recent history. Its also one of the most scrutinized. IMO it has passed the tests with flying colors. There aren't many overall better knives for less than $300 for me.

Now, if you are looking to save some coin, the Adamas or even the Contego are some great BM choices. The M4 steel in the contego is UNREAL at 62-64Hrc and puts D2 OR ELMAX to shame.
 
Honestly, I was pretty let down by the ZT 0560 when I received mine. I literally could only open it with the flipper and couldn't budge the damn thing using the thumb stud... for me this was a deal-breaker. However, back to your question, Elmax is an excellent steel.
 
ELMAX

C - 1.7%
Cr - 18%
Mo - 1%
Si - .8%
V - 3%


It's a good steel, I have tested it in blades ranging from 58.5 to 62 HRC and found it to be very stable, holds an edge well, very clean, fine grained and tough.

Great all around general use steel, with better edge retention than steels in the S30V/S35VN range due to the alloy content.
 
With in the last 2 mounts I've gotten big in to ZTs. It started with a 550 and Has not stopped. I just picked up the 0350 in the S30v stonewashed blade to add to my collection of ZTs. So far I've amassed a 0200, 0300, 0301, 0550, and the 0560. And over all of those the 560 finds its way in to my pocket the most. I have great experiences with the ELMAX steel of the 560. When I first got the 560 I put a polished edge on it with my EP. Now all I do it strop it Sunday nights so its ready for the next work week. I'm a Carpenter that works mostly in new house construction and remodeling, and ive used my 0560 to open bags of ready mix concrete to final fitting of wood moldings and wood trim. The ELMAX seem to just work and work well. Also I got to say that the pocket clip on the 0560 is spot on. I want that pocket clip on all of my knives.
 
Honestly, I was pretty let down by the ZT 0560 when I received mine. I literally could only open it with the flipper and couldn't budge the damn thing using the thumb stud... for me this was a deal-breaker. However, back to your question, Elmax is an excellent steel.

Those aren't thumb studs they are the blade stop. They were never designed to be used to open the blade. The 056x was made as a flipper only knife. A little research will show ZT/Kershaw has said this openly.
 
Back
Top