Ti-Lite in California?

[THG]

Hey, I'm interested in getting a Ti-Lite by Cold Steel.

However, I am worried about the legality of carrying one in my pocket in public. I'm interested in the 6-inch model, if not, the 4-inch.

These are my concerns:

1. I have read this page (although dated 2002) http://www.equalccw.com/knifelaw.html, and it says that I can carry a FOLDING knife of any size. However, the 12020 code says:

(24) As used in this section, a "dirk" or "dagger" means a knife
or other instrument with or without a handguard that is capable of
ready use as a stabbing weapon that may inflict great bodily injury
or death. A nonlocking folding knife, a folding knife that is not
prohibited by Section 653k, or a pocketknife is capable of ready use
as a stabbing weapon that may inflict great bodily injury or death
only if the blade of the knife is exposed and locked into position.

Would the 6-inch version be considered able to "inflict great bodily injury or death?" BUT, does the fact that this knife folds make it an exception?

2. The knife has one of those "Wave-like" mechanisms that allow the knife to be readied as it is drawn from the pocket. Is this legal in California?

So overall, will the Ti-Lite 6-inch model be legal for carry in California? If not, will the 4-inch model?

Thanks.

Edit: And how do you define "capable of being fixed?" Does this include any locking knife (liner-lock, lock back, etc.)?

 

[Anaxes]

From reading that it basically appears to give the interpretation of legality over to the Police, and I doubt a 6" stiletto will be looked on favourably.
Overall I would say it was a poor idea but I cannot give a definate legal answer.

 

[MORIMOTOM]

it is legal to carry in california, but may be prohibited by various cities or counties.

so long as it is carried in the closed position, per california law it may be carried concealed or in plain view.

 

[MORIMOTOM]

Edit: And how do you define "capable of being fixed?" Does this include any locking knife (liner-lock, lock back, etc.)?

where do you see this verbage?

 

[THG]

where do you see this verbage?

Err... I kinda wrote that wrong. This snippet is from the quote I posted above, starting from the middle of the 3rd line from the bottom.

or a pocketknife is capable of ready use
as a stabbing weapon that may inflict great bodily injury or death
only if the blade of the knife is exposed and locked into position.

What does that part mean? Is it illegal if it's "deadly" and "capable of being locked into position?" But that seems contradictory to the first part of that, which says "capable of ready use," ie fixed blade (the Ti-Lite is not).

Would the 6-incher be considered something "that may inflict great bodily injury or death?" I mean, I'm sure it could, but then again any knife could...

I would really prefer to get the 6-inch model, but if I'm going to have legal problems, then I'll just get the 4-inch.

 

[TOM1960]

For practical reasons, I would choose the 4" model for concealed carry. It just rides in the pocket better than a longer knife. I EDC a 4" Cold Steel Voyager with a plain edge clip point blade. The Voyager series has blade length choices of 3" to 6", with the 4" being the best compromise for concealment and adequate cutting power. The Recon 1 knives are also 4" blades but a bit heavier due to some metal in the handle. Yes, the Cold Steel "Proof" DVDs show a technique for opening the Ti Lite while drawing it by snagging the quillion on the corner of a pocket. I would suggest removing the pocket clip and carrying the knife completely concealed, pivot-down, in your front trouser pocket (left or right, depending what your strong side is). Make a habit of carrying only your knife in that pocket so if you have to draw it quickly, it will not get caught on anything. Keep it out of plain view and you will not attract the attention of law enforcement and others who can make trouble for you.

 

[THG]

For practical reasons, I would choose the 4" model for concealed carry. It just rides in the pocket better than a longer knife. I EDC a 4" Cold Steel Voyager with a plain edge clip point blade. The Voyager series has blade length choices of 3" to 6", with the 4" being the best compromise for concealment and adequate cutting power. The Recon 1 knives are also 4" blades but a bit heavier due to some metal in the handle. Yes, the Cold Steel "Proof" DVDs show a technique for opening the Ti Lite while drawing it by snagging the quillion on the corner of a pocket. I would suggest removing the pocket clip and carrying the knife completely concealed, pivot-down, in your front trouser pocket (left or right, depending what your strong side is). Make a habit of carrying only your knife in that pocket so if you have to draw it quickly, it will not get caught on anything. Keep it out of plain view and you will not attract the attention of law enforcement and others who can make trouble for you.

Sounds like good advice... Do you know about the legality of the 6-inch, though? I'm actually considering getting both lol

The Recon 1 looks very nice as well. I checked out all 3 of these at a shop today. I like the way the "ultra lock" (similar to Benchmade's Axis Lock) works on the Recon 1. Is it generally a good type of lock? I'm really new to knives and don't know that much. Speaking of not knowing very much, what's EDC mean? I'm assuming <something> defensive carry? Gotta get used to the acronyms around here...

I'm still confused by the legal issue, though. I went to 2 shops. One guy told me the 6-inch had to be open carry, and the other guy told me that a folder of any size can be legally concealed (as Jim March stated in his summary of PC653k and 12020 back in 2002: http://www.equalccw.com/knifelaw.html). I don't know who is correct...

 

[joe-bob]

I have both in the Zytel versions.

For an EDC knife, I would go with the smaller model. The 6" knife is HUGE! Both knives definitely look very aggressive, so I'm not sure what the local cops are gonna thik of it.

 

[MORIMOTOM]

Err... I kinda wrote that wrong. This snippet is from the quote I posted above, starting from the middle of the 3rd line from the bottom.



What does that part mean? Is it illegal if it's "deadly" and "capable of being locked into position?" But that seems contradictory to the first part of that, which says "capable of ready use," ie fixed blade (the Ti-Lite is not).

Would the 6-incher be considered something "that may inflict great bodily injury or death?" I mean, I'm sure it could, but then again any knife could...

I would really prefer to get the 6-inch model, but if I'm going to have legal problems, then I'll just get the 4-inch.

if a folder is carried locked in the open position, in say, a pocket, it is considered a deadly weapon. also, a dagger is NOT defined as a double edged blade.

try and ignore the "scary" sounding words, and focus on the modes of carry allowed.

per the ca penal code, there is no restriction on blade length, so the size is irrelevant.

what is generally being prohibited are fixed blade knives carried concealed.

 

[THG]

I have both in the Zytel versions.

For an EDC knife, I would go with the smaller model. The 6" knife is HUGE! Both knives definitely look very aggressive, so I'm not sure what the local cops are gonna thik of it.

Could you list some advantages and disadvantages of the bigger one, since you have both? I demoed the 6-inch, and I really like the feel

I am planning on getting the Zytel version; I don't know why I put a pic of the aluminum handled one...

if a folder is carried locked in the open position, in say, a pocket, it is considered a deadly weapon. also, a dagger is NOT defined as a double edged blade.

try and ignore the "scary" sounding words, and focus on the modes of carry allowed.

per the ca penal code, there is no restriction on blade length, so the size is irrelevant.

what is generally being prohibited are fixed blade knives carried concealed.

I see. Thanks.

 

[R.W.Clark]

Second everything Morimotom said.

Legal by CA Penal Code (so long as it is not carried locked open and concealed). Be sure and check your local laws though.

As an example, it would be illegal in LA County.

Also, the wave feature is legal in CA. Just try not to make a show of it.

 

[TOM1960]

Sounds like good advice... Do you know about the legality of the 6-inch, though? I'm actually considering getting both lol

The Recon 1 looks very nice as well. I checked out all 3 of these at a shop today. I like the way the "ultra lock" (similar to Benchmade's Axis Lock) works on the Recon 1. Is it generally a good type of lock? I'm really new to knives and don't know that much. Speaking of not knowing very much, what's EDC mean? I'm assuming <something> defensive carry? Gotta get used to the acronyms around here...

I'm still confused by the legal issue, though. I went to 2 shops. One guy told me the 6-inch had to be open carry, and the other guy told me that a folder of any size can be legally concealed (as Jim March stated in his summary of PC653k and 12020 back in 2002: http://www.equalccw.com/knifelaw.html). I don't know who is correct...

Just because a huge knife may be legal to carry concealed doesn't make it practical to do so. If you have a CCW permit, you could theoretically carry a concealed 12" barreled Thompson Contender single-shot pistol, chambered in .30/30 or .308, but wouldn't it be a major PITA? Of course it would, since that "hogleg" was designed and built primarily as a hunting firearm. Any cutting job that a 4" blade cannot handle is probably better addressed with a hatchet. A 4" knife is much more comfortable to EDC (Every Day Carry) and much less likely to "print" through clothing than a larger blade. Remember, the less the LEOs see, the better for you. Use your head and be careful out there!

 

[THG]

Second everything Morimotom said.

Legal by CA Penal Code (so long as it is not carried locked open and concealed). Be sure and check your local laws though.

As an example, it would be illegal in LA County.

Also, the wave feature is legal in CA. Just try not to make a show of it.

Thanks.

Just because a huge knife may be legal to carry concealed doesn't make it practical to do so. If you have a CCW permit, you could theoretically carry a concealed 12" barreled Thompson Contender single-shot pistol, chambered in .30/30 or .308, but wouldn't it be a major PITA? Of course it would, since that "hogleg" was designed and built primarily as a hunting firearm. Any cutting job that a 4" blade cannot handle is probably better addressed with a hatchet. A 4" knife is much more comfortable to EDC (Every Day Carry) and much less likely to "print" through clothing than a larger blade. Remember, the less the LEOs see, the better for you. Use your head and be careful out there!

Haha, good point. Alright, thanks guys.

 

[joe-bob]

Could you list some advantages and disadvantages of the bigger one, since you have both? I demoed the 6-inch, and I really like the feel

The disadvantage would be getting arrested for carrying a weapon. Nobody is gonna think it's a "pocket knife".

 

[medusaoblongata]

The disadvantage would be getting arrested for carrying a weapon.

I don't know how likely it is that he would get arrested for obeying the law, but I guess anything's possible.

The 6" model would make a more effective weapon, the 4" model would be a more convenient tool.

 

[THG]

I don't know how likely it is that he would get arrested for obeying the law, but I guess anything's possible.

The 6" model would make a more effective weapon, the 4" model would be a more convenient tool.

Well I suppose if I was somehow for some reason searched by a cop, it would be more likely that they would take it and possibly arrest me because it is obviously not just a "cutting tool." If you've ever seen it... It's like having a little sword in your pocket lol

 

[MORIMOTOM]

Well I suppose if I was somehow for some reason searched by a cop, it would be more likely that they would take it and possibly arrest me because it is obviously not just a "cutting tool." If you've ever seen it... It's like having a little sword in your pocket lol

as i mentioned earlier, the size is irrelevant.

what is important is the method of carry. so long as your folder is concealed and closed, you are in compliance with the state law. the knife, in and of itself, is not an arrestable offense.

it is possible that the knife is in violation of a city/county code, and the onus is on you to be aware of local weapons laws where you live.

 

[BoxANT]

I have the 4" Ti-Lite, fun knife to use. But even the 4" model scares people Be careful who you take this guy out around. And if you open it using the quillion ...

 

[stolas223]

that law makes a pen or stick illegal.Or even you finger. Don't live in cali. or If lived in cali the only knife I'd cary would be a mini CQC-7 or Boker subcom

 

[Buckaholic]

I have both. A 4" Titanium and the 6" Zytel. EDC both. If you are in a situation where a LEO is going to know you have that knife on you, odds are you're already in some kind of trouble.
That being said, both are legal in California to carry concealed (as others have stated...local laws vary greatly).