Til Bahadur Bishwakarma? Hanuman? HI CBKC look alike? Bowies of HI Design?

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Jun 3, 1999
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Craig.

In your posting in thread http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum33/HTML/000322.html you mentioned:
... TBs full name is Til Bahadur Bishwakarma (Til is his first name, Bahadur is his second name, and he is a bishwakarma) ...

In your posting in thread http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum33/HTML/000328.html you mentioned:
... the chakmak that was included in the Hanuman Khukuri ...

The pic of White Deer Horn Mini Jungle in thread http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum33/HTML/000323.html is just look like my HI CBKC (Chespeake Bay Knife Club) Khukuri!

In your posting in thread http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum33/HTML/000321.html you mentioned:
... ends that I picked up from TB's store room on (like a very few white deer horn khukuris, two huge bowies of the HI design, and ...

My Qs are:
  1. Who is Til Bahadur Bishwakarma? Is he the same person who previously supplied Khukuris to HI before Uncle Bill open HI 2nd Shop and then followed by Birgorkha?
  2. What Hanuman Khukuri is that? Is it the same 16½“ Hanuman Special Model which is offered by HI?
  3. Is that White Deer Horn Mini Jungle is actually HI CBKC because it just look very similar with my HI 9” Deer Horn Handled CBKC?
  4. You mentioned about Bowies of HI design ... is that the HI Ang Khola Bowie?[/list=a]Craig.

    I ask the above Qs just to clear my curiousity! You may delete this thread if you feel that I have raise a sensitive Qs which in any way might offence you!

    NEPAL HO!
 
Mohd, no, I'm not offended. You've asked very straight forward questions, and I will answer to the best of my ability. First of all, I must say you've done your homework! I didn't mean to stir up any trouble with my posts (those comments were made as part of other posts that really had nothing to do with HI).

Second of all - and EVERYBODY should read this statement - I am NOT stirring up trouble here. Folks, I was asked a few simple questions, and to not answer them as straight forward and as honestly as I can would be insulting to everybody involved. Not answering them would create just as much controversy, I think, as answering them badly would create. As in poetry and drama - silences are usually filled deep meaning, and I wish not to be misunderstood in my treatement of Mohd's very fair questions.

However, here are the questions, answered to the best of my ability, in the order you asked them:

1) Who is Til Bahadur Bishwakarma? Is he the same person who previously supplied Khukuris to HI before Uncle Bill open HI 2nd Shop and then followed by Birgorkha?

Answer: TB is a retired gurkha who is the "director" (for lack of a better term) of most of the "factories" (again, not the best term) in Dharan. 99% of his khukuris go directly to Khukuri House for sale to discriminating tourists, Nepali citizens, various military organizations, and us (we demand "the pick of the litter," slap on a guarantee, and call them Gurkha House khukuris). I do know that TB must have supplied khukuris to HI before Uncle Bill opened HI 2nd Shop. The reason I know this is that I saw documents faxed from the states for the design of the bowie, and that TB told me so. I also bought the remaining HI stock because TB really couldn't do anything with it (it had the HI logo, but TB said he'd try to grind it off). That being said, I cannot speculate as to where HI got ALL of their khukuris - it would be irresponsible and speculative for me to say so. That's a question better answered by Bill. I do know they (HI) got some khukuris from TB (see other answers). That is, Kami Sherpa bought, in the past, many khukuris from TB for export, but stopped suddenly about a year and a half ago. This can be confirmed by the following quotation:

A year ago or perhaps a bit longer circumstances promped us to open our own little factory, BirGorhka, and that's how it will be from here on out.

Source: http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum53/HTML/000158.html


2. What Hanuman Khukuri is that? Is it the same 16½“ Hanuman Special Model which is offered by HI?

ANSWER: TB was the original designer of the modern-day hanuman, and he actually did the wood carving of the handle himself. Although I didn't ask him for whom he did the design, the similarities are so strikingly similar (I'll post pictures of my Hanuman when it comes), and the quality so good, that it seems unlikely that two bishwakarmas, independent of one another, would both come up with such a unique design at approximately the same time.

3. Is that White Deer Horn Mini Jungle is actually HI CBKC because it just look very similar with my HI 9” Deer Horn Handled CBKC?

ANSWER: I have no idea. I found this khukuri hanging on a string in Lalit's Jawalaklel shop, and really fell in love with it. I liked it so much that it's the only khukuri I carried back with me. Although the similarities were striking once I saw the recent post about them on the HI forum, I cannot say if it is "the same knife." Once again, though, in light of the above info, one would bet that they are. Of course, the one I brought back is unmarked and not numbered, so it technically ISN'T the same knife to a discriminating collector.

4. You mentioned about Bowies of HI design ... is that the HI Ang Khola Bowie?

ANSWER: Again, you'll have to wait for the photo and make your own determination. However, TB did tell me that the bowies he gave me were the ones they made for export through HI. And, holding it in my hand, I have to believe that it's true. It will be for sale if someone wants to buy it and compare the two models.

Okay, so I know that I probably have offended some people in some way. Please give me the benefit of the doubt and know that any offense is accidental, and is purely a result of my writing style. I've tried to answer these questions as truthfully and as openly as possible, without making ANY conjecture. I ask those of you who are no doubt angry at this entire topic to wait until I post the photos before passing judgement.

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Craig Gottlieb
Gurkha House
Blade Forums Sponsor
 
Craig, I think the best way to avoid stirring things up is by doing just as you did. Open and honest discussion, even when it involves differences of opinion, is far better than letting things fester in silence, IMHO.

[This message has been edited by Steven F (edited 05-25-2000).]
 
Steven: Thanks for your support. I've learned not to say things that contain conjecture and that are based on assumptions. Often, I find that although an argument is sound, an assumption that the argument is based on is flawed, which brings down the whole argument. Better to say what I know and leave what I don't know to people who know. Ya know?

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Craig Gottlieb
Gurkha House
Blade Forums Sponsor
 
Craig,

I agree whole heartedly, The best approach to this particular situation is to simply answer the questions with the truth as you know it. Speculation, induced by silence, is NOT the way to go.


I've read many of the posts that Mohd has written over the past year. His posts are thoughtful, sincere and intelligent. Not someone who seeks controversy. You, Craig, have expressed your concerns about "stirring up trouble". You replied honestly to an honest inquiry.

Let the facts and pictures speak for themselves.


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Blackdog
ffca0608.gif.orig.gif
 
As I bought the Stag in question, and own a representitive sample of many khuks, I may be able to help with a review.
As I hear it, India raises these deer and gathers the winter sheds.
 
Do you own one of those Chesapeake Knife Club knives? If so, you'd be the perfect person to answer the question about the two models' similarity. If not, someone who owns one (Mohd lives a bit far away) would probably be glad to "loan" you one for comparison. Any volunteers?

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Craig Gottlieb
Gurkha House
Blade Forums Sponsor
 
I sort of stumbled on to that khuk. I tuned in and noticed your post on the site changes at the top, and clicked to your site. It was good EDT for a Marine, so I gave you a call. I didn`t read your post on the knife until today. Thanks for the other info. MOHD beat me to checking it out. I knew that it was familiar after you mentioned it. There is only one other place to look.
The chicken and the egg thing? I don`t know. I had talked with Bill about the one that Yangdu wore on the bus in a long ago thread, but He had nothing like that at hand. Then, I saw that, and knowing you wouldn`t sell me a bad one, just ordered it. Too bad the "companions" are decerative, but I`m sure I`ll like the knife.
I wanted because I didn`t have a small one. I wasn`t thinking of the CBKC.
I reckon I could buy one at a reasonable price, if one is for sale. I thought yours to be reasonable. I don`t know what the CBKC`s went for offhand. Or, MOHD can review his and I mine. That should work out. The standards are just that.
After the deer are killed, I have a feed, setting the table with the likes of a Randall Bird and Trout knife,caping,or sleeve knife. It adds to the feast. A friend once said,"Boy, I`d hate to be a BG, and brek in when you`re eating with all of these combat knives." I have kitchen duty in mind for the Sambar. It should be good for carving a small ham , or chicken. Thick blades don`t bother my slicing. Maybe a different belt knife to wear. This is rural, so belt knives are common parts of the uniform. Cammies are popular also, a lot of hunters.
 
Good to go, FNG (calling you that always brings a smile to my face). Maybe Mohd could post pictures of his version so we can compare.

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Craig Gottlieb
Gurkha House
Blade Forums Sponsor
 
Craig & FNG,
Here is a scan of my CBKC khukuri for your comparison - seem to be more similarities than differences. BTW, IIRC the originals of this model were made several years ago as a special order by Shop 1 for members of the Chesapeake Bay Knife Collectors Club. About a year ago Bill posted a picture of one he kept for his collection on the HI Forum, and in response to the resulting demand a new run was made by Shop 2 based on the original pattern. Mine is from that run, and I paid the preproduction price of $70 in October of '99. HI lost money at that price and most went for $85. (Spotted deer horn is much rarer & more expensive than water buffalo horn).
Here is a Mini-Jungle next to the CBKC for comparison. Although Mohd and I have disagreed about this in the past, IMO the CBKC, while lovely, is too small to be useful for much (though I have sucessfully used it as a draw knife to shave pine, and it probably would be fine for slicing ham if you didn't mind staining the blade). But the khukuri blade shape is primarily designed to chop, and the Mini is at about the lower limit of usefulness as a chopper. For use in a smaller size I prefer a conventional western fixed-blade design like the bird & trout.
Berk


[This message has been edited by Berkley (edited 05-27-2000).]
 
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