Tip Options / Serrations On A FSH

[Andros]

From what I know there are three tip formations with regards to BUSSE knives, namely:

1) the Standard Tip
2) the Penetrator Tip (P.T.)
3) the Busse Armored Tip (B.A.T.)

Given this, I took into account the following parameters:

PARAMETERS
Tip Strength
Penetration ability
Performing delicate tasks
Ease of sharpening / maintenance

If the level of performance for each of the above-mentioned parameters were 100 for the Standard Tip, then how would you grade the P.T. and the B.A.T. ?

Further to that what is your opinion about adding serrations to a FSH?
Do you see serrations as expanding the abilities / utility of the FSH or, impeding them?
If you feel positive about serrations on the FSH, where would you rather have them: in the front or at the rear of the blade?

I am looking forward to your comments. I know that some of you already own BUSSES with serrations and tips other than the Standard Tip so, your opinion is highly anticipated; and of course all of us here love these knives so, everyone’s point of view is truly appreciated!

Greetings from a lone BUSSE rider in Greece :thumbup: ,

George

 

[leatherman]

Drooool!! A Flying FSH with BAT Oh my aching pocketbook!!!!! Thank goodness I'm broke!

 

[Fan of Steel]

Hmmm.... A flying Steel Heart with a Bat tip? Sounds like something I ordered two years and 10 months ago.....

 

[Andros]

Drooool!! A Flying FSH with BAT Oh my aching pocketbook!!!!! Thank goodness I'm broke!

Hi Dwayne

I hope things are going well for you and yours. Thank God you don't live towards Rita's path ! My prayers are with all those people who live towards that part of the US.

I am looking forward to hearing from you about the sheaths we talked a while ago.

Take care,

George :thumbup:

 

[Andros]

Hmmm.... A flying Steel Heart with a Bat tip? Sounds like something I ordered two years and 10 months ago.....

...and what are your impressions about it ?

George

 

[Fan of Steel]

...and what are your impressions about it ?

George

I'll tell you in "two weeks" when I get it

 

[Andros]

I'll tell you in "two weeks" when I get it

Great!

I am looking forward to it :thumbup: !

Just a minute here; you said "two weeks" ? "Two weeks" by whose standard of time measuring :

By GMT standards
By Star Treck standards or,
By BUSSE standards ???

Then again there is this theory of relativity so, I guess that figures

Take care,

George

 

[yoda4561]

For serrations I say nay, unless it was a dive knife or something. For tip options I'd pick the penetrator over the standard any day, it gives up almost nothing in tip durability and I'm thinking may even increase it slightly in terms of impactation when stabbed into a hard object. BAT is a super-heavy duty tip, and I wouldn't get it unless there was a job for which the standard tip might prove too fragile. As for actually assigning a numerical value to penetration performance I can't, while I've put a penetrator on quite a few of my old knives it's because the tips were a bit dull and rounded to begin with, and it was a really easy and effective way to bring them back up to needle sharpeness. I've never used a BAT equipped knife either, and the standard tip has proven quite unphased in normal use.

 

[Andros]

For serrations I say nay, unless it was a dive knife or something. For tip options I'd pick the penetrator over the standard any day, it gives up almost nothing in tip durability and I'm thinking may even increase it slightly in terms of impactation when stabbed into a hard object. BAT is a super-heavy duty tip, and I wouldn't get it unless there was a job for which the standard tip might prove too fragile. As for actually assigning a numerical value to penetration performance I can't, while I've put a penetrator on quite a few of my old knives it's because the tips were a bit dull and rounded to begin with, and it was a really easy and effective way to bring them back up to needle sharpeness. I've never used a BAT equipped knife either, and the standard tip has proven quite unphased in normal use.

Thank you Yoda for taking the time to reply.

I appreciate your opinion :thumbup: . As a matter of fact I have been thinking about serrations in the case of rope and other fibrous material cutting (no underwater activity though) and also because serrations offer a more aggressive and longer lasting edge.

Take care,

George

 

[yoda4561]

Yeah, serrations are handy, but I've always been of the opinion that for most rope cutting a coarse plain edge that's been stropped is more effective.

 

[Fan of Steel]

Great!

I am looking forward to it :thumbup: !

Just a minute here; you said "two weeks" ? "Two weeks" by whose standard of time measuring :

By GMT standards
By Star Treck standards or,
By BUSSE standards ???

Then again there is this theory of relativity so, I guess that figures

Take care,

George

While I am hoping it's two weeks EST, I am prepared for "Two weeks" BST (Busse standard Time)

 

[gk4ever]

George,

The penetrator tip is just a slight variation of the standard tip. I do not recall seeing the BAT tip on any knife except the Stealth Hawk. There have been other tip profiles, like the clip point which was used on the early SHBM's, and on a much more limited basis on the BA3, NO-E and some customs. One of these customs was a FSH, as seen in this thread CP FSH - very cool! I wish the clip point was available more often; I would probably choose it every time over the standard type unless I planned on needing the absolute strongest tip possible. There was also the tip profile as seen on the Zero Tolerance series.

Regarding serrations, I would only choose them if I really needed them for a specialized application; they are just too hard to sharpen (some more than others). If I chose serrations, I would want them at the rear of the blade and a style that could be easily sharpened. While serrations offer a more aggressive edge, I'm not sure the edge lasts any longer.

Gene

 

[Andros]

Yeah, serrations are handy, but I've always been of the opinion that for most rope cutting a coarse plain edge that's been stropped is more effective.

Hi Yoda4561

Always concise and polite in your comments! You got me thinking with this one... Having seen how easily other knives have gone blunt if used for cutting fibrous material and having seen serrated edges been better at it, I brought up this point.

Thank you once again,

George

 

[yoda4561]

If you're cutting ALOT of rope and don't have an opportunity to sharpen or touch the edge up then serrations really do shine, it's just not something that comes up much for me. A course hone can give you a shaving sharp edge, and for the first 10 or 20 cuts(estimated, like 1 inch manilla on a draw cut) will cut through fabric and rope better than even fresh spyderco serrations. After that though the plainedge will tend to lose its bite and the serrations will keep on cutting. Most of the stuff I cut just makes serrations hang when they aren't perfectly sharp. This means the scallops will shave but the tips are semi-dull, which is the state of almost all my serrated knives right now, just can't seem to get them properly sharpened myself. Instead of cutting they just rip and tear, which is fine for some but I like my edges to just glide through whatever it is I'm cutting.

 

[Andros]

George,

The penetrator tip is just a slight variation of the standard tip. I do not recall seeing the BAT tip on any knife except the Stealth Hawk. There have been other tip profiles, like the clip point which was used on the early SHBM's, and on a much more limited basis on the BA3, NO-E and some customs. One of these customs was a FSH, as seen in this thread CP FSH - very cool! I wish the clip point was available more often; I would probably choose it every time over the standard type unless I planned on needing the absolute strongest tip possible. There was also the tip profile as seen on the Zero Tolerance series.

Regarding serrations, I would only choose them if I really needed them for a specialized application; they are just too hard to sharpen (some more than others). If I chose serrations, I would want them at the rear of the blade and a style that could be easily sharpened. While serrations offer a more aggressive edge, I'm not sure the edge lasts any longer.

Gene

Hello Gene

Thank you for taking the time to reply . You raised some very interesting issues here :thumbup: . By the way, the Pepper Shaker has also implemented the B.A.T. Why do you think the B.A.T. has seen such a limited application?

You are right about the Zero Tolerance; the only think is that they were implemented on blades not as thick as the FSH.

As for the serrations, every half-serrated knife I have has the serration at the rear part, leaving the front plain for more delicate tasks. However, I strongly think that unless we are talking about a LEFT-hander, serrations are placed on wrong side (i.e. left, edge down, tip facing forward) of the blade! They should have been on the RIGHT side of the blade instead (same blade orientation as mentioned before). Then again, that depends on another factor: when someone cuts, in what direction does he or she perform the cut? If the cut is performed originating from the right side of the knife wielder’s body to the left (and in any orientation thereof including diagonal and / or circular cuts), then serrations are fine there i.e. on the left side of the blade (for the RIGHT-hander). Reverse the cutting vectors and you need to reverse the placement of the serrations (for the RIGHT-hander again). Also, for the RIGHT-hander it is more suitable to have the serrations on the right side of the blade if he is to perform any cut which stays I his right side with his knuckles facing outwards and / or downwards.

In trying to simplify the above, imagine that we have a mirror and that we have used a marker to draw a vertical line in the center of the mirror. Therefore, someone stands in front of this mirror in a way that the vertical line on the mirror cuts his or her idol in half, holding a knife in either hand. In case, the cut has a direction that TENDS to keep the knife in the side of the knife hand, then you need the serrations on that side of the knife.

I hope this makes sense, if not then please forgive my ignorance .

Take care,

George

 

[Andros]

If you're cutting ALOT of rope and don't have an opportunity to sharpen or touch the edge up then serrations really do shine, it's just not something that comes up much for me. A course hone can give you a shaving sharp edge, and for the first 10 or 20 cuts(estimated, like 1 inch manilla on a draw cut) will cut through fabric and rope better than even fresh spyderco serrations. After that though the plainedge will tend to lose its bite and the serrations will keep on cutting. Most of the stuff I cut just makes serrations hang when they aren't perfectly sharp. This means the scallops will shave but the tips are semi-dull, which is the state of almost all my serrated knives right now, just can't seem to get them properly sharpened myself. Instead of cutting they just rip and tear, which is fine for some but I like my edges to just glide through whatever it is I'm cutting.

Yoda4561

Apparently you have a technical erudition as far as knives go. You are accurate about describing the behavior of the serrations in the cutting / dulling process. In fact, I am a big fan of Spyderco knives myself. Through the years of ownership, I have managed to keep their serrated blade exceptionally sharp – not only the scallops, the tips of the serrations too. To this, I have found the Spyderco Sharpmaker being a great aid. I am not saying it’s easy but, if you get it right then these knives fly! By the way, if you were to buy a FSH how would you like it to be in terms of options (from blade coating to handle configuration)?

You stay awake until late don’t you? What time is there now? Oooops, I just realized that you live in Florida! Are you and your family all O.K.? I am asking this because of the storms that have hit your homeland. I hope you are all well and safe.

Take care,

George

 

[Andros]

While I am hoping it's two weeks EST, I am prepared for "Two weeks" BST (Busse standard Time)

I understand that, regardless of the time measuring system that may be used , you are looking forward to the arrival of your knife and I am sure many people here (icluding myself) are looking forward to seeing pictures of it .

Take care,

George

 

[yoda4561]

Yeah, no bad storms here in FL this year, it's Texas and Louisianna that are getting hammered. If I were to get a fusion steel heart with my pick of options, it'd be double cut, with tiger stripe scales, probably the standard instead of magnum. I dunno if I would get a heavy ordinance sized one or not, but I might be inclined to. On a knife that size it wouldn't be something I carry every day, only when I had something in particular for it to do or before a hurricane is supposed to hit here, so the extra weight wouldn't be a big deal.

Ermm... I haven't really answered the question here have I Given the standard options and all that, and the possible necessity of using it for heavy prying during post-hurricane cleanup I'd get the Heavy Ordinace LE with tiger stripe scales, no serrations, penetrator tip, and a nice kydex aftermarket sheath. I might get it ceramic bead blasted, but probably not as there's no reason to mess with the satin once you have it. The tiger stripe scales are just a cosmetic thing though, I really think they're pretty with the fusion steel heart's blade in particular, it just looks right.

Right now I'm saving up for the Fusion Battle Mistress, I'm gonna skip over the Steel Heart, I figure if I'm gonna have a huge emergency chopper/prybar I might as well make it that sexy lookin piece of steel. For the Mistress I think the black linen/doublecut looks best, though the tan blade with black scales is quite the looker too. The larger chopping knives were the one things missing from my collection of knives after Charley hit, and I really wish I had at least one because it would have made yard cleanup way easier. My becker Magnum camp saw the most use as the largest knife I had, but the blade was a little too light and a bit short for extended limbing of trees for
disposal.

Been having some trouble sleeping this past week, so I check on the forums for a bit before trying to get back to bed.