Titanium? ATS-34? M2?

M

MICKEY77

Joined
Nov 27, 1999
Messages
760
I dont get it so many different types of blade are out there and I was wondering which would be best. Is titaniumt better than ATS-34. Would M2 really be worth buying. Can titanium be boughten in BLACK TI COATING i just dont know the difference(call me stupid) but I really need help with this. PLEASE IF YOU CAN HELP ME E MAIL ME AT
Hero47@juni.com
 
Yea, it's pretty confusing. As much as I like to play the know-it-all, I could use just a LIIIIIIIITTLE bit of tutoring as well. If the responses could be posted in addition to be emailed or, I would appreciate it.

Howie
 
Each material is good for different uses. ATS 34 probably has the most uses of the ones you mentioned. It has good edge retention, finishes well,has good resistance to corrosian, and is pretty tough over all even when its hardened between 57-60 Rc. I've seen it used for folders, bowie knives, kitchen knives, and alot of other things.Its a high alloy steel.Which was designed specifically for cutlery. It has just a high enough percentage of chrome to make it considered stainless but not much more. Chrome gives good corrosian resistance but it also takes away edge retention and makes the steel kind of gummy.So ATS 34 only has as much as necessary to make it stainless.
Titanium is good for handles. It has a much higher resistance to corrosian than steel, and weighs less.It has limited capabilities for actual cutting because it can't be hardened enough. Any thing you've seen that has a titanium blade probably actually has a titanium alloy. It may have carbide, or tungsten added to make it harder. I wouldn't get a knife with a blade like that though. They stil aren't as good as ATS34 and they would be hard to sharpen.
I don't really know anything about M2.My guess is that it another alloy type of steel that has its own good and bad qualities. Hope this helps answer your question.

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Fix it right the first time, use Baling Wire !
 
Any answers you get to a question like "what is best" will leave you so short of information that it'll be really misleading. There's a lot of variables in "what is best". I can probably think of a scenario that favors almost anything. It's always nice when you can just come to a conclusion like "X is best", and go away happy -- in fact, many people do come to that conclusion, and do go away happy. The accuracy of their conclusion is always highly in doubt, though.

One good way to learn about steels is to postulate a very specific use. Be as specific as you can about what you'll be doing with the knife. You will *still* hear a number of answers, depending on people's experience, preferences, etc. Which will tip you off quickly to the fact that given any particular job, there are almost always a number of steels that belong on a "best" list, though they have myriad different strengths and weaknesses versus each other.

Besides what you're going to use the knife for, choice of steel also depends highly on heat treat, choice of steel manufacturer, edge geometry, etc.


As a short answer to your specific question: Titanium is extraordinarily corrosion resistant, lightweight, and has no magnetic signature (useful if around magnetic-detonated mines, or just puttering about the garage playing SEAL. Not that I do that
smile.gif
) On the other hand, it doesn't take an edge well, and loses whatever edge it has quickly. ATS-34 is considered "stainless" but is one of the least corrosion-resistant of stainless steels. It holds an edge okay, takes an okay edge, and is moderately tough. To make things more complicated, though, there's a different heat treat for ATS-34 which results in a tougher and more stain-resistant product, possibly at the cost of wear resistance. Lastly, we have M-2, an alloy (non-stainless) high-speed steel. It is tougher than ATS-34, holds an edge better than ATS-34. It does rust pretty fast.

Which one is "best" totally depends on what you're using it for, how much maintenance you're willing to put up with, what kind of performance you're expecting, etc.

Joe
 
For a general purpose blade, stay away from Titanium. It has no magnetic signature, and does not corrode; but as a blade it does not hold an edge very well. It is also expensive.

ATS-34 and M2 are both good for general purpose blade. M2 would probably perform better than the ATS-34, but you would have to put up with the black coating. If you like the black coating then by all means go with the M2.

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Johnny
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Mickey,
Lots of good advice here and will add my 2 cents worth. Properly heat and cryo treated ATS34 is excellent blade steel. M2 seems to take a better edge and is tougher but will rust if not coated. My favorite blade steels are the CPM steels by Crucible like CPM440V or CPM420V. Read about them at their website, think it is www.crucible.com or something like that. They take the sharpest edge and hold them longer than anything else I have used. BG42 is also superior to ATS34 but few companies use it or the CPM steels. Chris Reeves uses BG42 in his Sebenzas and and his customer service is unsurpassed--you can't buy a better knife for their price, $325 for a large plain one. Spyderco uses CPM440V in their Military and Starmate models and they are very sweet, the best $100 knives made in my opinion. Of course if you are going custom, you can probably specify whatever you want, for me it would be either BG42 or CPM420V. Paul Bos of Buck knives is the guru of heat treating.
 
THANX AGAIN EVERYBODY
I think I am going to stick with the M2 steel when I buy my benchmade stryker.....


 
Good choice Mick, you'll be impressed with
sharpness and edge retention. And you might
pick up a marine Tuff-Cloth. I wipe mine
down once a week while in storage, and soon
following any heavy usage.
 
A bit of trivia. High speed steel was invented by Henry W. Taylor in the early 1900's. He pioneered 'scientific management,' basically a efficiency study of how workmen performed their jobs, and eliminating unnecessary motion. You can read about his study here: http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/mod/1911taylor.html

One of the things Taylor was trying to do was increase the rate at which naval cannon bbls. could be machined. Existing steel tools would reach a speed (of the bbl. relative to the tool) beyond which they got soft. He was experimenting with some alloys, and went to lunch leaving the tools in the forge. He figured that they were ruined, but decided to quench and test them anyway. It turned out that this steel was able to maintain its' strength even when red hot, enabling them to run the bbls. at a faster speed, thus, 'high speed' tool steel was born.
Walt
 
Have to add my 2cents also. Regarding ATS34 steel. I use a Cold Steel Voyager every day at work and have found it to be a great working knife. It has ATS34 and I am a house painter by trade so it gets USED! For everthing you can think of incuding the day I had to cut open a paint can. It was still sharp enough to use the rest of the week without resharpening. Anyway I really like it and ATS34 is also a good choice in my opinion.
 
Phezzer, isn't it that the Cold Steel Voyager uses AUS-8 steel? I don't think it's ATS-34.
smile.gif


Dan
 
This is another example of somebody cutting into a tin can once in his life and being so surprised his knife could do it, now he thinks that knife is wonderful.... Practically any knife made can cut a tin can, including $5 folders.

AUS-8 is not too bad for a low-buck stainless, better than 420, but far from wonderful. Performance is similar to 440B.

-Cougar Allen :{)
 
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