To pimp or not to pimp....that is the question

[BilboBaggins]

I'm a bit in love with my southard flipper. I do find myself drooling over some nice, shiny, cf scales though and don't know whether I should change them or leave well enough alone. Knife is perfect. Could not be more dead-centered and flips beautifully. I am going to swap out the pocket clip (it is the one real mis-step for this knife imho) but don't know whether changing scales is worth voiding the warranty and/or putting it back together not as nicely as it is now. It's not a safe queen and I will be using it. I get that it comes down to my personal preference/desire for prettier scales/ etc. but wanted to see if you had opinions or experiences to share. Also interested in your thoughts on the feel of cf scales since I don't have any knives with it.

 

[wiredbeans]

The Southard is one of my favorite and you don't have to worry about centering issue as the build tolerance is very precise, I have taken my apart about a handful times and all the parts go back perfectly.

 

[BilboBaggins]

Thanks for the reply wired. Makes me lean towards doing it although I have seen a few youtube videos where the washers that encase the ball bearing rings can get bent fairly easily if you slightly over-tighten the pivot screws. Ever noticed bent washers or any tips on re-assembly? Thanks again.

 

[Nfd538]

The Southard is nice with CF.

 

[BilboBaggins]

The Southard is nice with CF.

That's dead sexy. Mine would be opposite with the regular stonewashed blade and black cf scales. Where did you acquire the scales? The cutouts look great.

 

[Nfd538]

That's dead sexy. Mine would be opposite with the regular stonewashed blade and black cf scales. Where did you acquire the scales? The cutouts look great.

Bought it that way don't know who made the scale. The blade did favor the lock side but I centered it. I sold that knife.

 

[Rare blade]

Scales made by keyman

 

[Yo Mama]

I don't buy knives to resell. They are a part of my collection for the long haul, ones that I will for sure pass to my children, and eventually my grandchildren. When someone mods a knife, it does reduce the number of prospective buyers, if this matters to you then I would not change the scales. If it makes your knife truly perfect, then do it. If you're good with fixing things, then also do it, because your warranty is gone.

 

[wiredbeans]

Thanks for the reply wired. Makes me lean towards doing it although I have seen a few youtube videos where the washers that encase the ball bearing rings can get bent fairly easily if you slightly over-tighten the pivot screws. Ever noticed bent washers or any tips on re-assembly? Thanks again.

The washer is there to protect the scales from bearings eating away the metal, it's a nice touch and added build quality in my opinion. The bearings have high 60s RC and it will put a groove into the scales and eventually dig too deep. So make a note not to over tighten the pivot. The washer doesn't get bent but they do tend to bow with use which is normal and you will see a circle mark made by the bearing. Don't revers them, put them back the same way.

ZT's don't have these washers so are the IKBS system.

Bearing washer or not, it would still take 10s of years of use for the bearing to dig deep enough to fail where eventually the scales touch the blade.

To make your reassemble easier, take pictures every step and you will be just fine, make sure you invest in a good set of star screw bits, the ones that cost $3 per bit. They fit the screw better and you are less likely to round off the screws. You will need #6 for the frame and clip, #8 for pivot,

 

[BilboBaggins]

The washer is there to protect the scales from bearings eating away the metal, it's a nice touch and added build quality in my opinion. The bearings have high 60s RC and it will put a groove into the scales and eventually dig too deep. So make a note not to over tighten the pivot. The washer doesn't get bent but they do tend to bow with use which is normal and you will see a circle mark made by the bearing. Don't revers them, put them back the same way.

ZT's don't have these washers so are the IKBS system.

Bearing washer or not, it would still take 10s of years of use for the bearing to dig deep enough to fail where eventually the scales touch the blade.

To make your reassemble easier, take pictures every step and you will be just fine, make sure you invest in a good set of star screw bits, the ones that cost $3 per bit. They fit the screw better and you are less likely to round off the screws. You will need #6 for the frame and clip, #8 for pivot,

Awesome advice. Thanks beans.

 

[BilboBaggins]

Thanks to wiredbeans encouragement...went ahead and did it up. New CF scale, over-travel stop, and a deep pocket clip to replace the evilness that is the standard clip. Also pulled out the lanyard hole. Back together and flipping beautifully. Have to say it is an improvement in every way. The old pocket clip created a pointy hotspot on my hand while flipping it. Not thrilled with the pseudo-spyder logo on it, but the color is a spot on match. New scale makes opening with the Spydie-hole more doable as the cf scale is a lot thinner and your thumb can get in there better. Finally, I just love the look of it. Took my favorite knife and made it more favorite-er.

 

[Rival1314]

nice scale....looks great!!

 

[BilboBaggins]

nice scale....looks great!!

Thanks!!

 

[VermontEdge]

This has been a SUPER helpful thread as my Southard will arrive tomorrow or Saturday.

On YouTube I saw a guy claiming that he had just removed the washers since they're so thin anyway. Said it worked great. Any one have any insight into this?

 

[BilboBaggins]

This has been a SUPER helpful thread as my Southard will arrive tomorrow or Saturday.

On YouTube I saw a guy claiming that he had just removed the washers since they're so thin anyway. Said it worked great. Any one have any insight into this?

I'll preface this by saying I have no direct experience with this....but...have read up a ton on the southard and watched various breakdowns/reviews of it. In short, I think you could run it without washers. It would eventually run a groove in the TI, but that would take a long time (years?...see wiredbeans comments above). The washers keep that from happening and part of the reason they are so thin (I think) is that they are really just a buffer between the TI and the bearings. If my southard is still my go-to knife 3-4 months from now, I'm ordering another one to keep pristine in the box until I've worn this one out. At the moment, it feels like my long-term EDC.

 

[SpeedHoles]

This has been a SUPER helpful thread as my Southard will arrive tomorrow or Saturday.

On YouTube I saw a guy claiming that he had just removed the washers since they're so thin anyway. Said it worked great. Any one have any insight into this?

Why would you even consider removing those washers?




Scale looks slick, Bilbo, nice work. You're right though, that spider on the clip wouldn't do it for me, not something I'd like on my pocket. Reminds me of the skiing apparel company logo.

 

[BilboBaggins]

Why would you even consider removing those washers?




Scale looks slick, Bilbo, nice work. You're right though, that spider on the clip wouldn't do it for me, not something I'd like on my pocket. Reminds me of the skiing apparel company logo.

Honestly, the spider isn't that noticeable. I don't like it much but it solves my problem with the clip and matches the TI. It's also stonewashed TI.

 

[VermontEdge]

Why would you even consider removing those washers?




Scale looks slick, Bilbo, nice work. You're right though, that spider on the clip wouldn't do it for me, not something I'd like on my pocket. Reminds me of the skiing apparel company logo.

I didn't mean I'd remove them straight away. My concern is this, I'll try to break it down in order to make sense.

1) I've read here and there that those washers can and will, eventually, get worn through.
2) I've also heard that, being a Taichung knife, those parts can be difficult to find
3) I've heard that the washers getting worn in, dented, etc. can effect the flipping action

Therefore

I thought maybe if, down the road, my washers got compromised and Spyderco couldn't hook me up with any (for free or otherwise) it would be an option to keep my Southard going.

I'm not saying it would work or make sense. It was just a question :thumbup:

 

[VermontEdge]

Honestly, the spider isn't that noticeable. I don't like it much but it solves my problem with the clip and matches the TI. It's also stonewashed TI.

Also, I just realized that I totally hijacked this thread with my question! Sorry about that. I should have opened with this:

That thing is gorgeous!

I've been contemplating some pimpage too, and those pics are definitely inspiring :thumbup:

 

[SpeedHoles]

Honestly, the spider isn't that noticeable. I don't like it much but it solves my problem with the clip and matches the TI. It's also stonewashed TI.

Sure, as long as it performs the function that you need!

I didn't mean I'd remove them straight away. My concern is this, I'll try to break it down in order to make sense.

1) I've read here and there that those washers can and will, eventually, get worn through.
2) I've also heard that, being a Taichung knife, those parts can be difficult to find
3) I've heard that the washers getting worn in, dented, etc. can effect the flipping action

Therefore

I thought maybe if, down the road, my washers got compromised and Spyderco couldn't hook me up with any (for free or otherwise) it would be an option to keep my Southard going.

I'm not saying it would work or make sense. It was just a question :thumbup:

Very in depth response, and makes sense, from a quite paranoid stand point.


Don't worry about those washers. I've flipped and used mine countless 10's of thousands of times. No issues or concerns. Still isnt, and never was, as smooth as my Domino nor Dice, for some reason.
Just don't abuse or over tighten the knife.
Also, if you're honestly paranoid about the longevity of your Southard, just don't disassemble it, and proceed to use the heck out of it knowing if you have issues you can always send it in to Spyderco for w&r.


Biggest concern for me personally is using one of these knives in gritty conditions or around debris of very fine particles. It may end up getting into the lube in the unsealed bearing.
I have occasionally blown mine out a bit with my air compressor.
But, just knowing that, I have plenty of other knives that excel and perform better in dirty conditions and I will use the proper tools accordingly.




If you remove those washers, you've hit the point of no return nor repair. You will begin wearing on essentially non replaceable bearing race, just wearing away and removing material from the untreated titanium liners, resulting in a progressively looser and looser knife. There is no point in doing that.