Tomahawk eye drifting

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Jan 13, 2015
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Hello, earlier today I started to drift a tomahawk eye using my hardy hole to go through on my anvil. But eventually my drift wouldn't go no more because the hardy hole is too small, the drift was only half way through. It's a standard tear dropped shape drift. Does anyone have any suggestions on where else to drift it. I'm trying to make a friction fitted eye.Answers will be greatly appreciated.
 
Maybe drift over a steel pipe ? You could put it in a vice or stand it on the ground.

Yeah I tried the vise but I guess I need a post vise because the the thing keeps bouncing all over the place and the drift is going nowhere. And yes a steel pipe would probably work,I don't have one on hand but I guess I can pick one up
 
A piece of railroad track connector held in your post vise makes a great place to drift.

railroad_spike_connector_0321.jpg


angle_bars_assembly_1.jpg
 
Also does it matter what kind of steel I'm using because I'm using o1 tool steel if there's any difference
 
O-series steels are typically considered cold work steel. S7 is great for slitters and drifters. The H-series steels are great for hot work. This isn't to say that O1 won't suit your purpose to drift a couple hawks. But it may not hold up as well as some other steel.
 
O-series steels are typically considered cold work steel. S7 is great for slitters and drifters. The H-series steels are great for hot work. This isn't to say that O1 won't suit your purpose to drift a couple hawks. But it may not hold up as well as some other steel.

Thank you for both your replies. Will o1 make a decent hawk, because that's all I have on hand right now, or will I need to swing for something else,thanks bud.
 
O1 will make a good hawk. I thought you were talking about using is as your drift. Sorry for the confusion.

5160 is also a decent drift material. Old automotive coil springs and leaf springs are often made of 5160. H13 is a premier hot work steel for drifts.
 
you will need a good vise or if you can find a piece of plate steel thick enough(1"+) you can get a hole drilled or torched in it to drift over..Way back before we had a big post vise and swage blocks we made a drifting post out of 1/4" thick walled 5" square tubing with a piece of 2" plate welded to the top.The foot was a piece of 3/8" plate Cut drift sized hole in top and it worked great.
An easy way would be to make a hardy with heavy walled pipe to drift over..Needs to be heavy,thick walled stuff or the pipe wall will cut the bottom of your hawk head all to crap.
 
you will need a good vise or if you can find a piece of plate steel thick enough(1"+) you can get a hole drilled or torched in it to drift over..Way back before we had a big post vise and swage blocks we made a drifting post out of 1/4" thick walled 5" square tubing with a piece of 2" plate welded to the top.The foot was a piece of 3/8" plate Cut drift sized hole in top and it worked great.
An easy way would be to make a hardy with heavy walled pipe to drift over..Needs to be heavy,thick walled stuff or the pipe wall will cut the bottom of your hawk head all to crap.

Thank you for the reply. I will most definitely do what you recommend
 
O1 will make a good hawk. I thought you were talking about using is as your drift. Sorry for the confusion.

5160 is also a decent drift material. Old automotive coil springs and leaf springs are often made of 5160. H13 is a premier hot work steel for drifts.

Haha I thought you were confused,anyway bud thanks for the reply you have all been of great help
 
Marjanp145,greetings,

Drifting,in general,is often somewhat misunderstood/misinterpreted...Tool-eye in particular...I'm not sure just how well i can express this,and in any case,take it with a large grain of salt...

The support(the Bottom Tooling) is,of course,important.Normally,3-4 different sized drifts are used in forming an eye,EACH with it's corresponding bottom-tool.

However,that's not the whole story...An eye has a great Depth,as compared to a common rivet-hole,say,or other,simpler,orifice.
So just the simple force,pounding,applied to the drift soon(very)begins to work Against the process-as the friction increases,your blows are more and more becoming directed at Upsetting the sides of an eye vertically(hope that it makes sense,tough to explain in words...).They're trying to drag the material down with them,which in turn makes the orifice tighter,pressure to overcome increases,and so on...
(In the classical tradition a lubricant is always used even with the small/shallow holes,a mix of oil/charcoal dust/and such...to overcome that very effect).

In order to address these dynamics one has to continuously forge the Sides of the eye,making sure that the material is displaced in a desirable direction.Forging on the drift,of course,stretches the eye,allowing(vs forcing)the drift to do it's job(on the next heat).

This logic/technique is so effective that it actually supercedes(energy-wise)the pounding of the drift down.Sometimes,it's enough to,on a fresh heat:Insert the drift,invert it on the anvil,drift head down/forging up,and slam it pretty good,to get the drift to seat.Then forge the sides as much as possiblebefore drift loosens too much(one can be actually "air-forging" it just on the drift,with the end of drift resting on anvil/other end held in left hand/pressing the edge of forging against the anvil,to keep the drift advancing into the eye.
THEN you can go onto the bottom-tool/vice/whatever,to straighten out the newly-widened eye,vs stretching it with the drift.

Of course,one NEVER uses a machinist's vice for the make-shift bottom-tooling(or any other percussive action).Post-vice,being WI for the very purpose,does work somewhat...But only in combination,as described above....(i know it sounds obscure,sorry if it should prove to be too obscure/convoluted...)

A thick plate over tubing,with the correct orifice(-es) in it,as suggested above,would be a great asset for your shop.But even with that,don't forget that much shaping of any eye is done from the outside...Otherwise,you run the risk of setting down the locality of the eye so much,that the resulting tool will look(and haft)wrong...

O-1 is a pretty rough choice for these excercises...Naturally,"everything" is possible,but...

Personally,i've tangled with issues that confused and physically punished me to a surprising extent(in attempting to reproduce old tools,often-handled ones with an eye),and eventually i'd discover just how much difference the very material alone makes...

O-1 is an excellent alloy for the edge,and in my humble opinion,your energy would be better spent in forgewelding an inserted bit of that great alloy,into a WI or mild steel body,vs slitting and drifting an eye in it...

Once again,hope that it's all not totally confusing....The VERY best of luck with your project,
 
Marjanp145,greetings,

Drifting,in general,is often somewhat misunderstood/misinterpreted...Tool-eye in particular...I'm not sure just how well i can express this,and in any case,take it with a large grain of salt...

The support(the Bottom Tooling) is,of course,important.Normally,3-4 different sized drifts are used in forming an eye,EACH with it's corresponding bottom-tool.

However,that's not the whole story...An eye has a great Depth,as compared to a common rivet-hole,say,or other,simpler,orifice.
So just the simple force,pounding,applied to the drift soon(very)begins to work Against the process-as the friction increases,your blows are more and more becoming directed at Upsetting the sides of an eye vertically(hope that it makes sense,tough to explain in words...).They're trying to drag the material down with them,which in turn makes the orifice tighter,pressure to overcome increases,and so on...
(In the classical tradition a lubricant is always used even with the small/shallow holes,a mix of oil/charcoal dust/and such...to overcome that very effect).

In order to address these dynamics one has to continuously forge the Sides of the eye,making sure that the material is displaced in a desirable direction.Forging on the drift,of course,stretches the eye,allowing(vs forcing)the drift to do it's job(on the next heat).

This logic/technique is so effective that it actually supercedes(energy-wise)the pounding of the drift down.Sometimes,it's enough to,on a fresh heat:Insert the drift,invert it on the anvil,drift head down/forging up,and slam it pretty good,to get the drift to seat.Then forge the sides as much as possiblebefore drift loosens too much(one can be actually "air-forging" it just on the drift,with the end of drift resting on anvil/other end held in left hand/pressing the edge of forging against the anvil,to keep the drift advancing into the eye.
THEN you can go onto the bottom-tool/vice/whatever,to straighten out the newly-widened eye,vs stretching it with the drift.

Of course,one NEVER uses a machinist's vice for the make-shift bottom-tooling(or any other percussive action).Post-vice,being WI for the very purpose,does work somewhat...But only in combination,as described above....(i know it sounds obscure,sorry if it should prove to be too obscure/convoluted...)

A thick plate over tubing,with the correct orifice(-es) in it,as suggested above,would be a great asset for your shop.But even with that,don't forget that much shaping of any eye is done from the outside...Otherwise,you run the risk of setting down the locality of the eye so much,that the resulting tool will look(and haft)wrong...

O-1 is a pretty rough choice for these excercises...Naturally,"everything" is possible,but...

Personally,i've tangled with issues that confused and physically punished me to a surprising extent(in attempting to reproduce old tools,often-handled ones with an eye),and eventually i'd discover just how much difference the very material alone makes...

O-1 is an excellent alloy for the edge,and in my humble opinion,your energy would be better spent in forgewelding an inserted bit of that great alloy,into a WI or mild steel body,vs slitting and drifting an eye in it...

Once again,hope that it's all not totally confusing....The VERY best of luck with your project,

Thank you for your reply I'm sure it will help me. O1 is the only steel I have on hand right now, and I would forge weld but my forge welding is pretty rough, if you know what I mean.
 
"....but my forge welding is pretty rough, if you know what I mean".

Oh yes,i Do indeed know what you mean...:)....(i forgeweld a Lot,and it always finds a way to challenge the daylights out of my process...).
But,it WILL get easier for you,one day,and you'll do it confidently,as difficult as it may be to imagine it at this juncture....

Well,then...Cool your slitter often(an old Swedish trick,use a slitter narrower than the slit,go back and forth with it,much less friction and sticking).
Don't be shy to drill both extremeties of your slit,to guide the process.It's always been a common practice(since the beginning of the Industrial Age,when the post-drills were becoming widespread).

And again-the best of luck!Happy forging!
 
"....but my forge welding is pretty rough, if you know what I mean".

Oh yes,i Do indeed know what you mean...:)....(i forgeweld a Lot,and it always finds a way to challenge the daylights out of my process...).
But,it WILL get easier for you,one day,and you'll do it confidently,as difficult as it may be to imagine it at this juncture....

Well,then...Cool your slitter often(an old Swedish trick,use a slitter narrower than the slit,go back and forth with it,much less friction and sticking).
Don't be shy to drill both extremeties of your slit,to guide the process.It's always been a common practice(since the beginning of the Industrial Age,when the post-drills were becoming widespread).

And again-the best of luck!Happy forging!

Thank you very much for all your advice, I really appreciate the help I get here
 
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