Tougher: CPM 154 or D2?

flatgrinder

flatgrinder

Joined
Dec 20, 2005
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I'll be making a tactical knife (3/16" thick stock) and was wondering which one of these steels is tougher? Or is the difference barely noticeable? :confused:

Thanks!
 
I couldn't pull up a comparison chart, but I think they are pretty equal. I would use the CMP 154.
Stacy
 
According to Crucible, CPM154 is superior to D2 by a wide margin in the categories of wear resistance, toughness and grindability. No contest.

I really can't see why D2 is still in use. It's about equal to 440C in the above categories - and it isn't stainless - one might argue not even almost stainless. (Is this because all the Chromium is tied up in carbides?)

My opinion is based on a small amount of use of both and also on the data sheet at the link below. I'm interested in hearing reasoned dissenting opinions.

www.rangeroriginal.com/CPM154.pdf

Rob!
 
CPM154 will be easier to finish and probably easier to heat-treat than D2. It'll likely be tougher than regular D2 at similar hardnesses as well. If you want tough, why not go straight to S5 or S7 and not beat around the bush?
 
D2 is still in use, because it cuts, plain and simple. It cuts and keeps on cutting. Some people don't like the edge D2 takes, and some do. All I know is, it cuts.
 
Rob! said:
According to Crucible, CPM154 is superior to D2 by a wide margin in the categories of wear resistance, toughness and grindability. No contest.

I really can't see why D2 is still in use. It's about equal to 440C in the above categories - and it isn't stainless - one might argue not even almost stainless. (Is this because all the Chromium is tied up in carbides?)

My opinion is based on a small amount of use of both and also on the data sheet at the link below. I'm interested in hearing reasoned dissenting opinions.

www.rangeroriginal.com/CPM154.pdf

Rob!
Click to expand...

yeah but rember heat treat is what sets it apart,
not everyone follows "the book" for d2

most people follow the book for 154cm though and have it preset on the oven and just throw it in and let it microwave so to speak

I have learned this in life most things cant be explained because everyone does everything there own way and has there own opinion
 
Thanks for all the input! Thanks also for the .pdf.

I'm a little skeptical in terms of the accuracy of the chart... it shows that 440C has the same wear resistance as D2 -I know that for a fact D2 will outcut 440C if both steels are heat treated to their optimum hardness. D2 will also outcut 154CM and ATS-34.

Since Crucible makes 154CM and CPM 154, could there be some spin-doctoring going on? Anyone have any charpy notch numbers for D2, 154CM and CPM 154 @ HRC 61?
 
Rob! said:
According to Crucible, CPM154 is superior to D2 by a wide margin in the categories of wear resistance, toughness and grindability. No contest.

I really can't see why D2 is still in use. It's about equal to 440C in the above categories - and it isn't stainless - one might argue not even almost stainless. (Is this because all the Chromium is tied up in carbides?)

My opinion is based on a small amount of use of both and also on the data sheet at the link below. I'm interested in hearing reasoned dissenting opinions.

www.rangeroriginal.com/CPM154.pdf

Rob!
Click to expand...

If you read the information carefully, you will see that 440C has a lower toughness at 57 HRC than D2 has at 60. If you don't see a difference, you have not been heat treating D2 right. 440C is not in the same ballpark. D2 is not fully stainless with 12% Cr because it has 1.45 to 1.55% Carbon as compared to 440C at 1-1.05%.

I have shaved with a D2 straight edged blade, so don't listen to those who say it doesn't take a good edge. I have found it to be comparable in the field as a hunter to S30V and to outperform any 440C I have seen.
 
D2 is kind of like the 30-06. People show up at elk camp with all kinds of the latest greatest caliber guns. Good hunters keep killing elk with their 06 and they always will. Proven performers never go out of style
 
flatgrinder said:
I'm a little skeptical in terms of the accuracy of the chart... it shows that 440C has the same wear resistance as D2 -I know that for a fact D2 will outcut 440C if both steels are heat treated to their optimum hardness. D2 will also outcut 154CM and ATS-34.
Click to expand...

:rolleyes: :D Oh boy - here we go... :D

flatgrinder said:
Since Crucible makes 154CM and CPM 154, could there be some spin-doctoring going on?
Click to expand...

Crucible also makes D2

Rob!
 
Shaman

D2 is way cheaper - Just checked out 1/8 x 2" as an example, and the 154CM is 70% higher price.

Neither one is precision ground, so it's a pretty fair comparison.

Rob!
 
CPM D2 is about the same cost as equal sized CPM 154. The CPM D@ is much tougher than the CPM 154. Grind it. You'll see it eat your belts right up. So be sure you have plenty of 400 grit belts for finishing. The CPM D2 blade I've ground were some of the sharpest I've ever made. It is hard to grind, but I love it. Try it. Pop's knife supplies has some last I checked.
-John
 
Flatgrinder

I'm sorry. I thought you were asking about CPM154 compared to regular D2. If you were asking about CPMD2, I can't answer. It should be tougher than regular D2, but Crucible has not even done a preliminary datasheet, so any information at this time would be anecdotal.

Rob!
 
Rob! said:
Flatgrinder

I'm sorry. I thought you were asking about CPM154 compared to regular D2. If you were asking about CPMD2, I can't answer. It should be tougher than regular D2, but Crucible has not even done a preliminary datasheet, so any information at this time would be anecdotal.

Rob!
Click to expand...

I was comparing CPM 154 to regular D2 (from Bohler). Anyone done any charpy testing? :confused:
 
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