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Trouble sharpening

M

mrszeontestpilot

Joined
Mar 28, 2012
Messages
382
I use stones. I have a couple carborundum stones, and a buck edge tek washita honing stone. I'm able to keep an edge on sharp knives, and bring one back if they go a bit dull, but I'm having difficulty when it comes to bringing a rather dull edge back to usable. I've watched sharpening videos, including one by forum member jackknife; I've tried the sharpie trick, and I seem to be okay on the angle... I'm not really sure what to do at this point. It frustrates me to no end to not be able to sharpen certain knives. I don't think it's a problem with the steel, as I believe the problem ones are on par with what I normally have no problem sharpening. Maybe I need a coarser stone to start off with? Also, not sure if it makes a lot of difference, but I normally use the stones dry, although I've used water before, but never oil. Any ideas?
 
What steels are you trying to sharpen, and on which stones? How old are your carborundum stones (& what brand, if known)?

Most 'carborundum' stones (a.k.a. 'silicon carbide' or 'SiC') shouldn't have trouble doing some major re-grinding on most steels. The Washita may be difficult with some modern stainless/higher-alloy steels. If your stones are very old or well-worn, there might be other issues like severe loading/clogging, which could slow them down quite a lot.


David
 
Nothing crazy. I'm not completely cure of the steel, but the current one I've been attempting is a bear & bull congress knife made by buck creek. I bought it used, and I'm not sure what it is, but being that it's traditional, I assume it's nothing too modern. I've also had trouble with an older colonial, but I haven't picked that one up in a while. And actually, last summer my husband's grandpa broke the tip off of a buck that he had, reground it, then I attempted to sharpen it up a bit, but it didn't really work out. It was also super dull. But a large portion of my knives are buck, and I don't have much trouble keeping them in shape.
The carborundum stones I have are just something cheap my dad found online, so not really any brand that I know of. Is it possible to get bad silicon carbide stones? Maybe that has something to do with it, I don't know. They're only a couple years old, so I don't think it's an issue with use.
 
I think I saw your post in the Traditional forum, about the Bear & Bull congress knife (nice find there :thumbup: ). I'm assuming that was carbon (non-stainless) steel, so it shouldn't be too much trouble on most stones. If most of your Bucks are 420HC, those shouldn't be much trouble either. Depending on how old your husband's grandfather's Buck is, it may be 440C (last used in early '80s, I believe). Some of those have trouble on Arkansas stones (like your Washita), but a decent SiC stone should handle it easily. Wet/dry sandpaper in SiC or aluminum oxide will also handle it well.

The big question mark in my mind is the 'carborundum' stones found cheaply online. If they were marketed or labelled just as 'carborundum', it's kind of hard to know their origin or quality. I wouldn't be surprised if many cheap stones marketed as 'carborundum' might actually be 'corundum' (aluminum oxide) instead. The two terms often get thrown around pretty loosely by vendors of inexpensive stones; cheap AlOx stones can often be notoriously bad. The SiC stones I've liked and used are from Norton (their 'Economy Knife & Tool' stone) and functionally identical stones from ACE Hardware. If using those, I've yet to be disappointed with any of them (I have 2 of the Norton, and 4 from ACE in various sizes); they've handled carbon steel and 420HC blades beautifully (I've also been using & carrying 420HC blades from Case & Buck, as well as 1095 and CV blades from Schrade USA and Case). I've always used the 'Fine' side of my SiC stones, which is ~320-grit or so; it's been plenty aggressive for rebevelling such blades, as well as leaving great, toothy working edges.

One thing to look out for, especially in sharpening very small blades as with your congress and similar knives: If the stones used for rebevelling are too coarse, that can often make it difficult to create clean edges on such small/thin-edged blades. I've always favored stones in a medium or finer grit for such knives; the 'Fine' side of the SiC stones I mentioned is about as coarse as I'd go, and I often use Fine or EF diamond hones for such jobs (600/1200, respectively). Even at such small grit, a diamond hone will still work very fast, and not leave the edge in a too-rough condition afterwards.


David
 
Thanks for all the input, it's very helpful. I did post about the knife in traditional :) thanks. I'm going to have to look for some better sharpening stones. Hopefully I'll have better luck next time.
 
I'd visually check to see if the blades are apexed or not. Hold the blade, edge up. Stand under a bright light. Angle the blade up and down while looking down at the edge. If you see light reflecting off of the edge, it's still pretty dull and requires more grinding. If you can't see reflected light, it's reached the point that you should be able to make it sharp without a lot of effort.

To be sure you're doing the reflected light test correctly, try it with a butter knife from your kitchen drawer. You should easily see a nice strong reflection from the edge of a butter knife.

Good luck!

Brian.
 
Those narrow bladed Traditional knives I have difficulty with as well. I think the problem lies in getting a good read on the blades angle of grind on the stone. Keep using the magic marker and when grinding use your thumb nail at the spine of the knife to set the angle for the edge (gapping it off the stones face). And keep working it holding it on a consistent angle. Up grading to a Norton SiC or India stone would help. You can use it dry just clean it often to not allow build up. The combination SiC grit on the fine side is like 230 or 240 grit and the fine on the India is 320. These stones will easily put a hair shaving edge on those blades. Just keep working it with lighter pressure as it starts to become sharp. Good luck. DM
 
You may be rounding off the edges when you have to use a lot of strokes to get at the dull ones. So yes, try a coarser stone to get it done quicker and maybe try a finger on the flat of the blade as you draw it across the stone to feel and hold the angle better.
 
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