true full flat grind

jlubas

jlubas

Joined
Jan 22, 2008
Messages
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Excuse me if I'm just splitting hairs but i always hear people talking about full flat grinds like on a spyderco military for example. These knives still have a secondary bevel though. Now i work as a butcher and the first thing i learned about sharpening knives while apprenticing was that the best meat slicer had to have the secondary bevel worked out on a stone. My butchers knives now have a very fine full flat grind. I am talking about from the spine of the blade all the way down to the edge is one plane. The edge is very thin and may chip if used for anything other than slicing but it will slice like nothing you have ever seen. It may not be important but isnt this a true full flat grind? I know it is a very specific use knife but just curious on people's idea s on the use of this terminology.
 
I have no idea, but I like my military a lot:). Hopefully someone else has the answer.
 
jlubas said:
Now i work as a butcher and the first thing i learned about sharpening knives while apprenticing was that the best meat slicer had to have the secondary bevel worked out on a stone. .
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If you are touching the edge with a stone, then you do not have a single plain. Are there hairs in the meat? :D
 
it is still a single plain... by touching the edge with the stone i mean the entire side of the knife will rest flat on the stone.
 
What you describe sounds like a full flat. When you refer to what others call a full flat grind, maybe they mean a full flat primary grind.
 
afaik, that's a zero grind. scandi doesn't go all the way up. Another difference that I suspect is that zero grinds are usually less than ten degrees per side, like most tall primary grinds, while scandis are closer to typical secondary edge bevel angles. But this is personal, anecdotal observation.

Convex seems to go either way
 
That's right. Full flat grind refers to the primary grind, and we specify there is no secondary bevel for strength by saying it has a zero grind or zero secondary bevel.

Scandinavian grind is a sabre grind with a zero secondary bevel, that is, the primary grind only goes about 1/3 the way up the flats.

I wonder if butchers' knives wouldn't be better off with a full convex grind for a bit more strength at the edge, with little if any effective loss of acuteness.
 
The main knife i use is a 14 inch forschner cimeter breaking knife. I use a stone to get the zero grind on the tip and curved belly of the knife. I leave a bevel at the base of the knife by the handle for getting through pesky little bones( a god send for your edge when cutting pork chops of a loin). Anyway this transition of edge types results in a slight convex edge in the middle. Takes a long time and a lot of patience on a stone but once you get it down its a meat cutters best friend.
 
It looks to me like you've got a real professional's understanding of a good working edge! :D
I use a stone to get the zero grind on the tip and curved belly of the knife. I leave a bevel at the base of the knife by the handle for getting through pesky little bones (a god send for your edge when cutting pork chops of a loin). Anyway this transition of edge types results in a slight convex edge in the middle.
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That's an interesting combination. I may try that on a couple of my longer knives.
 
I would call that a full flat to zero edge.

Ed Schempp sharpens his knife in a similar manner. A bit thicker edge on tip and heel and a very finely ground out edge at the belly.
 
I'm sorry, but it's "plane". Otherwise, great discussion.


I've got a cold and I guess it's making me grouchy
 
The closest to a true full flat grind that I have is a custom by Ray Laconico. It has a full flat primary grind that goes down to a very thin convexed secondary.
 
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