Two Questions about a United Boker.

[sceva]

I have a half congress on the way. It's a United Boker so made between 1984 - 1994? UC126G, green jigged bone. I am hoping it has carbon steel blades as I prefer them but will be ok with stainless. The shield on this one is read instead of silver, does that mean anything? I believe these were German made. Tried to find out on line but nothing mentioned steel type. I did see that red bone ones I saw had the silver shield while all the green bone ones seemed to have the red shield. ????

Asking this in the Boker section also but it appears that they don't consider the United Boker's to be a true Boker and only refer you to United Cutlery. at least that's what a search showed.

My understanding is that United Boker was a collaboration between United Cutlery and Boker 1984 - 1994 after Boker USA closed and before it re-opened. And, that the knives were German made Bokers of mostly standard patterns but gussied up some with blade etchings. Is this True or not??? Is mine a "real" Boker?

These are bad photos but all I have at the moment.

 

[r8shell]

Made by Boker in Solingen. I don't know if the red painted shield means anything in particular, or if someone just thought it looked neat. Please let us know when you get it.

Red bone and carbon steel:

 

[sceva]

I e-mailed United Cutlery as was suggested in the Boker USA forum. Unfortunately they are a different UC having bought it from previous owners. NO Info.

Running out of places to look. Does anyone have an old United Cutlery catalog from 1984 - 1990 era?

 

[afishhunter]

A "real" Böker, in my opinion. It was made by Böker in Solingen, same place the TREE BRAND knives are made, likely in the same factory, by the same cutlers as the Böker TREE BRAND knives.

 

[sceva]

A "real" Böker, in my opinion. It was made by Böker in Solingen, same place the TREE BRAND knives are made, likely in the same factory, by the same cutlers as the Böker TREE BRAND knives.

Well, the United Boker knives were made in Solingen by Boker so I guess they're real Bokers. From what I understand these were pretty much the only Bokers sold in the US between 1940 and 1990.

 

[dsutton24]

This is an approximation... There aren't a lot of absolutes when it comes to United.

United was a collaboration between one of the Parkers (I don't remember which) and Smokey Mountain Knife works. They bought the Boker name, along with many other names you'd probably recognize. United was everywhere during the time period referenced in the OP, a lot of their knives came from Japan, some came from Italy, Spain and Germany. I'm not sure Boker was actually manufacturing anything at this time, they may have been produced by Hoffritz, Klaas, or any of a number of firms.

Generally speaking, if it's stamped Solingen, and is from that time period, the knife was made in Germany. This was true of most knives we think of as German. These days, who knows?

Don't worry if it's a 'real' Boker. There's always somebody around who will tell you what's wrong with your stuff. Even among knife manufacturers who have well documented histories you'll find that they made knives for each other, came and went out of business, and just generally wandered all over the place.

If you like it, don't worry about what anyone else would call it.

 

[Will Power]

dsutton24 Wise words indeed.

As Levine used to say, " Read the Knife" (not other peoples' received opinions or ego....) The knife was probably made during the 'arrangements' after the demise of Boker USA, shipped in from Germany/Solingen and given its special shield. Is it quality? Does it function well? Are the aesthetics there ? Pay no attention to other people telling you it's not 'real' if it pleases you- you could argue that Bokers made in the USA are not 'real' anyway because they're not Solingen made (and maybe didn't use the umlaut Ü in their spelling?) Such a thing would be absurd but it could be said and if enough group-think sinks in the concept gains traction.

Let us know what you think about the knife as a quality user or collectible, that's the main thing.

 

[sceva]

I Found that Boker website timeline says "1984: United BOKER formed with Smoky Mountain Knife and Blue Ridge Knife to create a financial sales partnership ." It appears that United Cutlery may have been created by SMKW and Blue Ridge as a way to combine purchases to larger quantities and get better prices.

I asked SMKW about it

 

[herder]

I have a half congress on the way. It's a United Boker so made between 1984 - 1994? UC126G, green jigged bone. I am hoping it has carbon steel blades as I prefer them but will be ok with stainless. The shield on this one is read instead of silver, does that mean anything? I believe these were German made. Tried to find out on line but nothing mentioned steel type. I did see that red bone ones I saw had the silver shield while all the green bone ones seemed to have the red shield. ????

Asking this in the Boker section also but it appears that they don't consider the United Boker's to be a true Boker and only refer you to United Cutlery. at least that's what a search showed.

My understanding is that United Boker was a collaboration between United Cutlery and Boker 1984 - 1994 after Boker USA closed and before it re-opened. And, that the knives were German made Bokers of mostly standard patterns but gussied up some with blade etchings. Is this True or not??? Is mine a "real" Boker?

These are bad photos but all I have at the moment.

View attachment 2793845View attachment 2793846View attachment 2793847

You can read a detailed history of United Boker along with a history of all things Boker in the "Boker" book which is easily found online.

 

[sceva]

You can read a detailed history of United Boker along with a history of all things Boker in the "Boker" book which is easily found online.


View attachment 2795156

39.00 for the book; I think I'll keep an eye out for a used copy to show up. Any chance you could post the next page or to so I can see the rest of the United Boker section?

 

[herder]

39.00 for the book; I think I'll keep an eye out for a used copy to show up. Any chance you could post the next page or to so I can see the rest of the United Boker section?

When you add up the amount of hours that went into producing that book compared to the financial gain, it wouldn't come close to a minimum wage job.
Books such as this one are created through a labor of love to help support the hobby.
So, authors are always a bit confused and frustrated when someone complains about the relatively low cost of a good education in the form of a book.

 

[dsutton24]

When you add up the amount of hours that went into producing that book compared to the financial gain, it wouldn't come close to a minimum wage job.
Books such as this one are created through a labor of love to help support the hobby.
So, authors are always a bit confused and frustrated when someone complains about the relatively low cost of a good education in the form of a book.

I have the Boker book and the Henckels book, both are excellent. I wouldn't be inclined to post someone else's work on the web either. Consistent information of good quality is so hard to find. Someone who chooses to write books like these puts in more work than most people can imagine.

Someone once told me that there's nothing that can't be learned from a book. I can think of a few possible exceptions to that idea, but the basic idea has still stuck with me for many years. To this day I'd much rather read than watch a video.

 

[sceva]

Thanks Herder and dsutton24; You made me ashamed that I asked. I shouldn't have. I sincerely apologize.

As for the cost, yes it is very reasonable. It is just that I am not really a Boker collector; I only have the one So it is not a must have item at the moment.

 

[herder]

I have the Boker book and the Henckels book, both are excellent. I wouldn't be inclined to post someone else's work on the web either. Consistent information of good quality is so hard to find. Someone who chooses to write books like these puts in more work than most people can imagine.

Someone once told me that there's nothing that can't be learned from a book. I can think of a few possible exceptions to that idea, but the basic idea has still stuck with me for many years. To this day I'd much rather read than watch a video.

Thanks for acquiring those books, I do appreciate it.

 

[herder]

Thanks Herder and dsutton24; You made me ashamed that I asked. I shouldn't have. I sincerely apologize.

As for the cost, yes it is very reasonable. It is just that I am not really a Boker collector; I only have the one So it is not a must have item at the moment.

No problem and I assumed you were a collector of multiple Boker knives. I hope this first one leads to more for you.
I will send you the rest of the information on United Boker through a private message.

 

[dsutton24]

Thanks Herder and dsutton24; You made me ashamed that I asked. I shouldn't have. I sincerely apologize.

As for the cost, yes it is very reasonable. It is just that I am not really a Boker collector; I only have the one So it is not a must have item at the moment.

There's no need for that. As far as I'm concerned curiosity is a good thing.

 

[sceva]

Thank all of you for the info. I have the knife in hand and it is a nicely made knife and I am liking it very much. The bolsters were a little square cornered for my use ( I carry and use my knives )so I did my usual rounding the corners a little.

I also note that when opened the blade back is not flush with the back spring with the sheep foot a little proud and the pen blade low and angled down some. I see this in Boker photos at times where the secondary blade is angled down a little instead of straight out. Is this how Boker normally fits them or is this a United Boker thing?

No matter, a little judicious filing on the spring at the pen end made it better, not perfectly straight but decent now. The Green bone is a nice dark olive to almost black, The blades are carbon steel, YAY, as proved by touching an out of the was area with some gun blue. The spring is too.
















I just did a lot of looking and it appears that this is pretty much the norm for Boker, I guess it allows them to sell them for a nice reasonable price and I have no problem with it since there are no sharp edges to get you.