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Understanding steel??

S

Stephan

Joined
Jan 5, 2006
Messages
329
I had recently bnought a kershaw bump and was told over the phone that it was the cmp154 steel which I was told was better.

When Shipped I recieved the S30v blade. I was curious as to what these numbers mean and which blade types are better. Dose anyone know where I can learn about these different steel types and how to choose what is best for my needs? Thanks for the help.:confused:
 
There is 154M, the newer similar CPM 154 , and S30V .All are made by www.crucibleservice.com . All are amongst the finest stainless knife steels and you would be very happy with any of them....Look up the tutorial about knife steels on this forum by Joe Talmadge to learn lots about knife steels !
 
Thanks for the help guys, I am in the process of learning about the steels right now . . .i was just curious if I should keep my bump and happy with it, or request a refund for not recieving the one with 154 cm. As it seems, the difference in these two medals are trivial and depend on the person's use but seen to offer the same advantages and properties . .so i will probable just keep my knife unless anyone has an opinion about what I should do.

I know they do not produce the 154 cm bump anymore but at any rate I am a little miffed about it my transaction. Thanks for the help and any opinions they are appreciated.

NEW! Kudos to Mete and your link . .here I have found that the s30v is a superior metal to the 154 cm . . it has higher wear/corrosion resistance and is slightly tougher so I am now content with keeping my bump. Thanks for the help mete and deathshead . . .oh and funny quote deaths head!
 
mete said:
There is 154M, the newer similar CPM 154 , and S30V .All are made by www.crucibleservice.com . All are amongst the finest stainless knife steels and you would be very happy with any of them....
Click to expand...

There is quite a number of people not happy with the performance of S30V and literally dozens of threads on the subject on the forums, in fact there are several running right now where people are giving feedback on multiple problems with multiple blades from different manufacturers.

-Cliff
 
Ahhh crap . . .oh well I guess I'll do some more research on it . .thanks for the heads up cliff . .for now at least I know I didn't get a cheap metal.
 
Steel FAQ is here, I haven't added CPM-154 yet, since I haven't hada chance to play with it yet (seems few people have). http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=368828

S30V is, among the general knife-buying populace, considered the best stainless steel going for a general purpose folder. As Cliff points out, there is a vanguard worried that the steel is way over-rated, and are seeing problems with it. I think we're going through a classic technology hype-cycle: peak of inflated expectations (we're past that), trough of disillusionment (some of us are there already, some of us may end up there soon), slope of enlightenment (coming soon!). It's reallly good stuff when well heat-treated, but isn't a miracle steel, especially when subject to standard industrial heat treat.

I would recommend keeping the knife if the rest of the knife works for you. A knife is more than its steel, and the bump is pretty cool. And even at its worst, S30V is a fine steel for an EDC knife, especially if you are not going to drop the edge under 15 degrees per side.

Joe
 
Just go over to the tool shed and look at the current thread about S30V. That should give you a good summary. I fear, anybody thinking that CPM154 will be vastly superior to S30V is doing the same mistake that was done with S30V: Overhype. They are both highly alloyed stainless steels which have both limited toughness. CPM154 is a powder metal version of 154CM, which is well established and has a loyal following. The powder technology and the added Vanadium should increase the performance of CPM154 in comparison with 154CM, but currently the steel is still so new that there are practically no real world reports out there. IF done right, I would imagine that S30V had the potential to outperform CPM154 in the categories that both do well (good slicing ability and edgeholding in such). However, the question remains whether CPM154 might not be easier to get right and hence in the knife you are holding in you hand might not be the better choice.

One thing I am sure about though. You will have to thin out the edge of the Spec Bump A LOT before you even start to be able to tell any significant difference between those two steels.
 
Here is a rather techy link designed for knife makers. It has some great information and comparisons.

I think the most important things when buying a knife are:

1. Buy it from a company with a good reputations for making good knives. They will use good knife steel, have good locking mechanisms, and have handle material suitable for the knife.

2. Buy one that feels good in your hand. Could you sit and peel a fifty pound sack of potatoes with it without you hand cramping up.

3. Do your homework and learn a few basic knife specifications. It is very simple and easy to do. Don't let your eyes deceive you. All the knives look good in the magazine or on the display shelf.

4. Do whatever Mr. Joe Talmadge says to do. He is a knife wizard, jedi-knight, guru, master with over 500 years of experience (I think).

http://www.ajh-knives.com/metals.html
 
S30V from a reputable company (which Kershaw deffinately is) is pretty hard to beat. Assumeing a proper heat treat, I think it would be nearly impossible for anyone to tell the difference between CPM154 and S30V in everyday use.
 
HoB said:
I fear, anybody thinking that CPM154 will be vastly superior to S30V is doing the same mistake that was done with S30V: Overhype.
Click to expand...

This is all marketing, S30V originally had basically the same promotion over S90V, it wasn't as good a steel but was easier to make knives from and the performance was still high. Eventually this was changed to "it is the best stainless steel" and S90V was forgotton. CPM154CM has been available for a long time under other names (RWL34) so pushing it as a replacment to S30V when S30V was chosen instead of it a few years ago is kind of an odd arguement.

-Cliff
 
I didn't know that RWL34 was around for such a long time. I though that was a pretty new steels as well. Oh well, after 3 years still a nOObie :).
 
It has been discussed on Bladeforums since 1999, the data sheet :

http://www.damasteel.biz/pdf/rwl34-datasheet.pdf

It never got much development here as the market is mainly dominated by Crucible and the high vanadium S60/S90/S30V series. Similar with the Japanese high Cr steels, which some have argued are also superior to the Crucible high vanadium grades, but they as well get little discussion here.

-Cliff
 
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