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Underwater use
- Thread starter Dutch
- Start date
I havn't tried one out diving, but I wore a Spyderco Endura last summer while surf fishing off of Assateaugue Island.
I just wiped the knife off every night with some Tuff-Cloth. (nothing different than I would have done in fresh water)
No problems at all, still a smooth opener, and no rust or discoloration.
I just wiped the knife off every night with some Tuff-Cloth. (nothing different than I would have done in fresh water)
No problems at all, still a smooth opener, and no rust or discoloration.
Although Spyderco uses premium steels, the carbon in the steel reduces resistance to corrosion.
Rinse the salt water away with fresh water, dry your knife completely and apply a light coat of oil or silicone to all steel parts as soon as possible.
If surface rust appears, buff the steel with a metal-polishing compound (Flitz works great) before the steel becomes pitted.
If you have any other questions, feel free to give me a holler in the Spyderco Warranty and Repair Department.
Angela
Rinse the salt water away with fresh water, dry your knife completely and apply a light coat of oil or silicone to all steel parts as soon as possible.
If surface rust appears, buff the steel with a metal-polishing compound (Flitz works great) before the steel becomes pitted.
If you have any other questions, feel free to give me a holler in the Spyderco Warranty and Repair Department.
Angela
Sal Glesser
Moderator
- Joined
- Dec 27, 1998
- Messages
- 11,666
Hi Dutch. Welcome to the forums. Honored that we would be your first post.
I always carry a Clipit of some type when diving. Always salt water. Angela's recommendation works, but it must be done religiously. When I dive, I usually pack a serrated Delica FRN (light, powerful cutting ability, able to open with a glove, inexpensive if lost). I spray with silicone after rinsing and drying.
We played around quite a bit with diving knives back in the early 80's. We even made ceramic diving knives. We were never satisfied enough with the performance of materials at the time.
Now, other materials are more available, but very expensive and we could hardly compete with custom makers.
In our testing; Cobalt based metals performed the best. Stellite, Talonite, Boye Dendritic. Then low or "no" carbon stainless steels (304) did well but had little cutting ability. We would not want to produce that wasn't an exceptional performer.
Properly heat treated 440C is usually among the best of the stainless "high carbon" steels (our Rench uses 440C). But it will rust if not maintained well (Angela's formula).
We have a coating on some CPM440V that held up very well (up there with the Cobalt stuff), but we haven't had the opportunity to put it in the ocean. I question coatings rubbing against all of the "hard stuff" down there.
We just started playing with some new stuff (two different materials) that seems to have some promise. If it goes well, we might be able to get back into it. We have a design from the mid 80's that would be effective and a few newer concepts. Nothing revolutionary. It's the right material that matters.
I understand that Camillus just signed on for Talonite. You ought to go over to the Camillus forum and tell Phil that Sal suggests he make a Talonite Dive knife.
happy diving.
sal
I always carry a Clipit of some type when diving. Always salt water. Angela's recommendation works, but it must be done religiously. When I dive, I usually pack a serrated Delica FRN (light, powerful cutting ability, able to open with a glove, inexpensive if lost). I spray with silicone after rinsing and drying.
We played around quite a bit with diving knives back in the early 80's. We even made ceramic diving knives. We were never satisfied enough with the performance of materials at the time.
Now, other materials are more available, but very expensive and we could hardly compete with custom makers.
In our testing; Cobalt based metals performed the best. Stellite, Talonite, Boye Dendritic. Then low or "no" carbon stainless steels (304) did well but had little cutting ability. We would not want to produce that wasn't an exceptional performer.
Properly heat treated 440C is usually among the best of the stainless "high carbon" steels (our Rench uses 440C). But it will rust if not maintained well (Angela's formula).
We have a coating on some CPM440V that held up very well (up there with the Cobalt stuff), but we haven't had the opportunity to put it in the ocean. I question coatings rubbing against all of the "hard stuff" down there.
We just started playing with some new stuff (two different materials) that seems to have some promise. If it goes well, we might be able to get back into it. We have a design from the mid 80's that would be effective and a few newer concepts. Nothing revolutionary. It's the right material that matters.
I understand that Camillus just signed on for Talonite. You ought to go over to the Camillus forum and tell Phil that Sal suggests he make a Talonite Dive knife.
happy diving.
sal
What can anyone say after Sal's interesting remarks? Only that I dive with one of my endura's regularly, attached to my vest with a cord so I can extend it and never loose it - no matter what I do underwater...
After the dive I wash it with warm water and oil it - and it goes on forever
Needless to say that the endura is a second knife and the prime cutting tool is my trusted Mad dig ATAK2
After the dive I wash it with warm water and oil it - and it goes on forever
Needless to say that the endura is a second knife and the prime cutting tool is my trusted Mad dig ATAK2
- Joined
- Nov 1, 1999
- Messages
- 223
I've been diving for 7 years with a Spyderco Diver and Diver's Probe. (As well as a Boye Cobalt dive knife, Wenoka 440C dive knife and Gerber Moray) I've found that if I rinse the knives in warm fresh water and spray them with CRC 3-36 I get NO rust at all and smooth function. I don't use any of the 420 stainless blades. They don't cut and don't hold an edge.
If anyone wants more info on the CRC 3-36 spray, let me know and I'll hunt down some info and post it here.
Ben
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"If you're upside down and burning, you probably went too fast."
If anyone wants more info on the CRC 3-36 spray, let me know and I'll hunt down some info and post it here.
Ben
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"If you're upside down and burning, you probably went too fast."
Tanks Ben,
thank you for the response to my question.
You have a few knives.
Are you an active diver?
My job a the Project Officer here in the Experimental Diving Unit (EDU) is to purchase or recommend the diving equipment that all Canadian Forces divers use. EDU is a RDT&E group within DCIEM, located in Toronto, Ontario. DCIEM is a human factors defence lab that also does environmental equipment for the Navy, Army (large clothe the soldier program) and Air Force (G-suits and survival gear). One of my work units (projects) is to standardize the wide variety of CABA (or SCUBA) ensembles that the Navy, Army and SAR divers currently wear.
In regards to knives and safety equipment, it is my opinion that several (minimum three) cutting tools are required on each diver. I am leaning toward: 1) a "good" working knife; 2) a "throwaway" quality emergency or safety knife/cutter; and 3) a dedicated line cutting tool; (such as my Camillus CUDA3). During the Swissair recovery, we also carried metal shears, so one option that I am considering would be to include some sort of shear as well, i.e. paramedic "penny-cutters".
Recently EDU has purchased, then used in routine surface work and during field trials, a variety of Spyderco products:
Delica, Endura, Jess Horn, Military, Native, Rescue, Rescue C14, Wayne Goddard lightweight, as well as other brands, such as the Camillus CUDA3 and a Benchmade knife with BT2 coating.
From your diving experiences, are there any short or long term problems with any of these (used both on the surface in all sorts of weather and underwater in salt water)?
Since you use them, are the Spyderco Diver and Diver's Probe, Boye Cobalt dive knife, Wenoka 440C dive knife and Gerber Moray items I should look at for diving?
Again thank you for the reply.
Safe Diving.
P.S.
I'm lost on the origin of your signature quote???
thank you for the response to my question.
You have a few knives.
Are you an active diver?
My job a the Project Officer here in the Experimental Diving Unit (EDU) is to purchase or recommend the diving equipment that all Canadian Forces divers use. EDU is a RDT&E group within DCIEM, located in Toronto, Ontario. DCIEM is a human factors defence lab that also does environmental equipment for the Navy, Army (large clothe the soldier program) and Air Force (G-suits and survival gear). One of my work units (projects) is to standardize the wide variety of CABA (or SCUBA) ensembles that the Navy, Army and SAR divers currently wear.
In regards to knives and safety equipment, it is my opinion that several (minimum three) cutting tools are required on each diver. I am leaning toward: 1) a "good" working knife; 2) a "throwaway" quality emergency or safety knife/cutter; and 3) a dedicated line cutting tool; (such as my Camillus CUDA3). During the Swissair recovery, we also carried metal shears, so one option that I am considering would be to include some sort of shear as well, i.e. paramedic "penny-cutters".
Recently EDU has purchased, then used in routine surface work and during field trials, a variety of Spyderco products:
Delica, Endura, Jess Horn, Military, Native, Rescue, Rescue C14, Wayne Goddard lightweight, as well as other brands, such as the Camillus CUDA3 and a Benchmade knife with BT2 coating.
From your diving experiences, are there any short or long term problems with any of these (used both on the surface in all sorts of weather and underwater in salt water)?
Since you use them, are the Spyderco Diver and Diver's Probe, Boye Cobalt dive knife, Wenoka 440C dive knife and Gerber Moray items I should look at for diving?
Again thank you for the reply.
Safe Diving.
P.S.
I'm lost on the origin of your signature quote???
- Joined
- Oct 12, 1998
- Messages
- 1,647
I really have nothing to add, but to say that Dutch's job sounds like alot of fun, and that I'm also curious about Ben's sig line.
Sounds like something Art Arfons would have said after crashing his jet car after a LSR attempt at the Salt Flats.
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Don LeHue
The pen is mightier than the sword...outside of arm's reach. Modify radius accordingly for rifle.
Sounds like something Art Arfons would have said after crashing his jet car after a LSR attempt at the Salt Flats.
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Don LeHue
The pen is mightier than the sword...outside of arm's reach. Modify radius accordingly for rifle.
I have to say this, but only once:
I once dived with my S&W 66 in a sealed plastic bag (suitable for canoeing - NOT good for underwater pressures) in order to see how it works underwater.
Well - it worked just fine, the bullets dont travel that far anyway...and it took hours to get all the moisture and salt away.
Anybody interested in a used 66?
(just kidding - this is the last gun I would sell)
I once dived with my S&W 66 in a sealed plastic bag (suitable for canoeing - NOT good for underwater pressures) in order to see how it works underwater.
Well - it worked just fine, the bullets dont travel that far anyway...and it took hours to get all the moisture and salt away.
Anybody interested in a used 66?
(just kidding - this is the last gun I would sell)
- Joined
- Oct 3, 1998
- Messages
- 4,842
I love the delica/endura as salt water dive knives for exactly the reasons Sal mentions -- lightweight, easy to open, great cutting performance, and VERY important for a dive knife, inexpensive if lost.
I found that if I just take off my suit after being in salt water and leave the knife clipped to it, I will have surface rust the next day. A good cleaning with fresh water at night seems to prevent that. Nowadays, I use tuff cloth as well.
Joe
I found that if I just take off my suit after being in salt water and leave the knife clipped to it, I will have surface rust the next day. A good cleaning with fresh water at night seems to prevent that. Nowadays, I use tuff cloth as well.
Joe
- Joined
- Jul 9, 1999
- Messages
- 3,316
Tuff Cloth is probably the best counter measure for rust that there is, short of a full chroming of the knife blade. I use it on my file knives, and it works very well at keeping rust at bay here in Florida.
As you all know, in Fla. we're in a subtropical environment where high humidity and rain are around for a large part of the year. Things that are "stainless" rust PDQ down here if left out in the elements.
Tuff Cloth has been the best remedy I've found for the humidity and salt air environment.
BTW, when I'm snorkeling, I carry an Endura coated with the TC in my waistband and it has not stained yet. Of course, I rinse it afterwards with fresh water.
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If it's stupid but works, then it isn't stupid!
As you all know, in Fla. we're in a subtropical environment where high humidity and rain are around for a large part of the year. Things that are "stainless" rust PDQ down here if left out in the elements.
Tuff Cloth has been the best remedy I've found for the humidity and salt air environment.
BTW, when I'm snorkeling, I carry an Endura coated with the TC in my waistband and it has not stained yet. Of course, I rinse it afterwards with fresh water.
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If it's stupid but works, then it isn't stupid!
Welcome to the forums Dutch. I' d like to add that all Diver models from Spyderco are long discontinued. Ditto for Gerbers Moray. You may find a Diver variant once in a long while floating around out somewhere and even then they can command high prices. There are probably more Morays in the aftermarket though. For possible purchase in quantity you may take a peek at Bucks rendition of Kit Carsons U2 Dive Knife, the Intrepid series. Seems like some no nonsense, good priced tools.
L8r,
Nakano
[This message has been edited by Nakano 2 (edited 02-02-2000).]
L8r,
Nakano
[This message has been edited by Nakano 2 (edited 02-02-2000).]
- Joined
- Jul 9, 1999
- Messages
- 3,316
Blilious,
My wife buys these clear colored bars of some fancy pants soap that she says is high in Lanolin. That takes the smell off my hands lickity split quick. She gets it at KMart around the specialty bath area I think. You know, where they keep the loofahs and other bathroom knick-knacks. Wish I could remember the brand name. Sorry, I'm drawing a blank and the wife is away right now.
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If it's stupid but works, then it isn't stupid!
My wife buys these clear colored bars of some fancy pants soap that she says is high in Lanolin. That takes the smell off my hands lickity split quick. She gets it at KMart around the specialty bath area I think. You know, where they keep the loofahs and other bathroom knick-knacks. Wish I could remember the brand name. Sorry, I'm drawing a blank and the wife is away right now.
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If it's stupid but works, then it isn't stupid!
- Joined
- Nov 1, 1999
- Messages
- 223
Leo-
I'll see what I can find. The 440C knife I have is over 10 years old. I know that the particular style I have is no longer made. If you're planning to use it in or around salt water, you have to be meticulous on the maintenance because it will rust quickly if not rinsed and treated.
Ben
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"If you're upside down and burning, you probably went too fast."
I'll see what I can find. The 440C knife I have is over 10 years old. I know that the particular style I have is no longer made. If you're planning to use it in or around salt water, you have to be meticulous on the maintenance because it will rust quickly if not rinsed and treated.
Ben
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"If you're upside down and burning, you probably went too fast."
Ben,
Was your knife designed and signed by Blackie Collins? If so, I might have one of those...
And you're right, they do rust quickly if you neglect them (not that I'd do that, of course...
). I like the fact that you can take the rubber handle apart to clean it.
Regards,
Leo Daher
BTW, mine is about 12 years old.
Was your knife designed and signed by Blackie Collins? If so, I might have one of those...
And you're right, they do rust quickly if you neglect them (not that I'd do that, of course...
Regards,
Leo Daher
BTW, mine is about 12 years old.
- Joined
- Jul 9, 1999
- Messages
- 3,316
Blilious,
Sorry about not getting back to you sooner.
The wife sez it is Glycerin soap (no brand name available, sorry) and you can get it at any health food store. I thought it was the stuff she got at KMart, she's always picking up stuff like this, but apparently this isn't the same. I hope this helps.
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If it's stupid but works, then it isn't stupid!
Sorry about not getting back to you sooner.
The wife sez it is Glycerin soap (no brand name available, sorry) and you can get it at any health food store. I thought it was the stuff she got at KMart, she's always picking up stuff like this, but apparently this isn't the same. I hope this helps.
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If it's stupid but works, then it isn't stupid!