VG-10 SE Vs. H-1 SE edge retention?

Cow51

Cow51

Joined
May 6, 2016
Messages
662
Hello,

Can anyone tell me which will hold an Serrated edge better, VG-10 or H-1? I have a DF2 SE in H-1. It seems to hold an edge fairly well, but I want to know how it'll hold up compared to VG-10.

Thanks!
 
Now according to Spyderco's official testing that they did in their own lab they found that H-1 serrations performed the best overall.

It's interesting though that you compare H-1 to VG-10 because VG-10 for years has been a favorite, Go-To, Hard use blade steel and I still use a lot of my VG-10 Spyderco models folders and fixed blades both. Now one distinction I've found with VG-10 is that it's one of those rare blade steels that performs good in plain edge and Spyderedge both. Because there have been many blade steels in the past that I've found really stand out in Spyderedge but I've found them to have a lot to be desired in plain edge>> some of those steels include GIN-1, AUS-8, ATS-55 and 440V just to name some of my favorite Spyderedged blade steels.

But to answer your question Spyderco has already declared H-1 to be the king of Spyderedged blades. And I can't dispute that because the serrated H-1 blades I own do perform well>> but I don't really like H-1 for plain edged blades at all.
 
I've heard that H-1 is sub par for PE too. Why is that H-1 is better for SE, but not PE?
 
Cow51 said:
I've heard that H-1 is sub par for PE too. Why is that H-1 is better for SE, but not PE?
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I wish I could answer that for you but I'm not a metallurgist. I just know what works when I use it. And I use a lot of serrated/Spyderedged blades. I admit that it does seem strange that H-1 would make for great serrations. It's classified as a "Work Hardened" steel which doesnt' get heat treated like most conventional blade steels. It's also a nitrogen based steel rather than a carbon based steel like most blade steels are. But I have a funny feeling that we will be seeing more nitrogen based steels because LC200N is gaining popularity by the day.

Benchmade was actually first to come out with H-1 blade steel that I can remember. I actually had the one model they made with H-1>> it was called the 100S-H2O model. it was a dive knife>> that knife couldn't hold an edge for anything. And it really surprised me that Spyderco ended up taking it on. But they obviously knew about it's strongpoints and discovered that it made a great steel for serrations. They still make that BEnchmade dive knife I mentioned but I've heard they now use X-15 TN stainless instead which is a steel that also has great anti-corrosion properties. I hope that at least gives you an overview.
 
Serrated H1 has been found to have better edge retention than serrated VG10 in Spydercos testing and many users report the same. The advantage that serrated VG10 has is that it can be flat ground.

So you can basically choose between the edge holding of serrated H1 vs the FFG of serrated VG10.
 
H-1 does great on my Tasman Salt...better than my combo Delica. A little harder to compare with one being a combo edge, but I would opt for the H-1 is getting serrated. Just my opinion.
 
ScooterG said:
H-1 does great on my Tasman Salt...better than my combo Delica. A little harder to compare with one being a combo edge, but I would opt for the H-1 is getting serrated. Just my opinion.
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I would be the last to disagree with you that H-1 serrated blades perform well because they do. The H-1 SE blade on my Spyderhawk is a beast that saws through virtually anything.

But again I've also found Spyderedged VG-10 blades to be good too. VG-10 I believe will still be around for quite some time. It's actually lasted longer on the main line up than any other blade steel that I'm aware of. It's getting very close to 20 years since the first VG-10 Spyder was released and that was the first release of the Moran model>> then shortly thereafter the C-54 Calypso I believe was the first folder with it.
 
I would like to add that there are a few blade steels that are good in Spyderedge and plain edge both. Because over the years I've found that most steels either excel at one or the other. For instance the old GIN-1 that Spyderco used in their early days was a great steel for Spyderedged models>> but I didn't really like GIN-1 for plain edges.

Now VG-10 is kind of a rare bird so to speak because I've always found it to be good in SE & PE both. And most blade steels you can't say that about. ATS-55 is another blade steel I always liked in both edge types. But I've found that most are either better at one or the other.
 
JD Spydo said:
Now VG-10 is kind of a rare bird so to speak because I've always found it to be good in SE & PE both. And most blade steels you can't say that about. ATS-55 is another blade steel I always liked in both edge types. But I've found that most are either better at one or the other.
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Won't argue with that.
IMG_3431.jpg
 
H1 does well in spydiedge because it work hardens. When it is turned into a serrated blade it gets very hard at the serrations. It is soft as a plain edge because it's harder to work harden it. I want to say it was mentioned something like 65 rockwell in a spyderedge from one of the Glesser's videos talking about one of the salt series knives. I want to say it came out earlier this year and it was Eric Glesser talking about the fish hunter but I don't have the video to get exact details. I think it was being thrown around the forums around 2017 shot show.
 
As bikerector bikerector stated, the general consensus is that the specific process Spyderco uses to cut the serrated edge basically work hardens the blade. There is quite a bit of dispute about that from folks in the industry who say that even if that was the case, sharpening on the sharpmaker etc would remove that very very thin exterior coating of "work-hardened" material.

However it can't be denied that many people who hard-use these claim the SE is much better than the PE.

I have a PE and really like it, for what it's worth. I actually used a dremel and buffing wheel to polish the edge out, thinking maybe the heat/friction will do this magic work-hardening. I don't think it made much of a difference.
 
With this comparison of H-1 and VG-10 has some interesting discussion points. But really the comparison should be H-1 vs LC200N. Because these nitrogen based blade steels are truly a different animal all together. Actually I'm looking forward to the release of more of these nitrogen based blade steels.

Now I've talked to a couple of guys who tell me that LC200N works very well in plain edges but I've yet to be able to test drive it in Spyderedge which I'm anxious to do so. As far as VG-10 goes I'm looking for it to still be around for some time to come. I've always liked it better than it's American counterpart S30V and I've had much better results with it over S30V.

If any of you guys have done a lot with LC200N in Spyderedge I truly wish you would share your results with us.
 
JD Spydo said:
With this comparison of H-1 and VG-10 has some interesting discussion points. But really the comparison should be H-1 vs LC200N. Because these nitrogen based blade steels are truly a different animal all together. Actually I'm looking forward to the release of more of these nitrogen based blade steels.
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The reason for the comparison of VG-10 and H1 is because many of the H1/salt blades are available in either VG-10 or H1 so the comparison is necessary for someone to figure out which is better for their purposes if they wish to be educated on those choices. I haven't checked the product catalog lately but LC200N isn't offered on much though I have read that it was being considered as a replacement or substitute for H1 towards the start of the year (maybe shot show?).
 
bikerector said:
The reason for the comparison of VG-10 and H1 is because many of the H1/salt blades are available in either VG-10 or H1 so the comparison is necessary for someone to figure out which is better for their purposes if they wish to be educated on those choices. I haven't checked the product catalog lately but LC200N isn't offered on much though I have read that it was being considered as a replacement or substitute for H1 towards the start of the year (maybe shot show?).
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Yeah I can agree with that. I was just thinking that with the advent of these newer nitrogen based blade steels that I feel like we've not really seen what many of the advantages will be in the long haul. And I'm a fan of VG-10 by the way and own many Spyders with VG-10. My all time favorite fixed blade which is the TEMPERANCE 1 model ( in SE & PE) and frankly I would have to be really be sold on any other blade steel to replace it.

Now two of the guys I chat a lot with on the other Forum have told me that LC200N is much better in plain edge than H-1. And I would have to give VG-10 a huge thumbs up in plain edge because even with all the new supersteels out there I still like VG-10 a lot and have no plans on giving up any of the VG-10 Spyders I still own and use. But I see where you all are coming from and I'm enjoying this thread.
 
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