Vg10

Hawaiian

Hawaiian

Joined
May 18, 2000
Messages
3,743
Specifically, the VG10 blade on the Almar Sere 2000. My nephew works on a horse farm and I want to get him a good folder for Xmas. The 2000 seems like the right knife for the work he does but I do not know about the VG10. How does it compare to 154? Thanks.
 
I think VG-10 is equal to, if not better than CM154. VG-10 sharpens easily and holds a good edge.
 
Both VG-10 stainless steel and the Al Mar SERE 2000 are excellent, as long as your nephew isn't left-handed, since the SERE 2000 has a right-handed liner-lock.
 
The VG-10 seems to be just a bit softer, thus easier to sharpen, but you trade off a little edge retention. I've been carrying my S2K for about a year and a half and have never had issues w/ it's cutting or utility applications. At one point I was attending a very field intensive school in which carrying a fixed blade wasn't much of an option....my SERE got used for just about everything including cutting plenty of course burlap and vegetation for ghillie suits, eating, breaking down MRE box's, and myriad other tasks. Not to mention being dummy corded to my sorry ass rolling and crawling through all sorts of dusty, wet, muddy, gritty ****. Long story short...the edge was usable if not shaving sharp when I got home.
 
The softness, hardness issue is a matter of the manufacturer's choice in heat treatment when making the blade. VG10 has greater technical potential for edge holding ?and toughness than ATS34 / 154CM. I only have 2 knives in VG10 - an AGRussell pocket knife and a Spyderco folder, and both hold an edge far better than any ATS34 blades on my other knives. I had a good close look at the blades, and the grain structure looks very fine, much finer than the grain on other blades I own in ATS34 and 440C. The fine grain would also help. VG10 looks like it is becoming my favourite stainless steel in a factory knife. (Previously was ATS34). Jason.
 
I also think that edge retention/ease of sharpening depends on heat treatment/ manufacturing as much as the choice of steel. I own several 154CM and VG10 knives made by a variety of makers and manufacturers, and I think that overall, I prefer the VG10. In the specific case of the Al Mar Sere 2000-- I think that the edge retention, toughness and cutting ability of that particular VG10 blade are at least as good as, if not better than, any 154CM blade by, say, Benchmade that I own. (And I'm not complaining about the Benchmades.)
 
Mr. Cutter, I am curious, what magnification is needed to see the grain structure of the steel?
 
Will it show the grain? Supposedly it goes to 100X. I've got 20X and it'll show pits and the striations from sharpening the edge, but not the grain of the steel.
 
Thank you all. I guess my nephew should be happy with it. And it will give him a reason to come visit us when it needs to be sharpened. ;)
 
I also prefer VG10...to just about any stainless. S30V may be tougher, hold an edge better, etc, but I have 3 VG10 knives (an oldler Fallkniven A1 and 2 Spyderco SPOT knives), and I can get them sharper than anything else I own. VG10 just seems to get absolutely razor sharp. They just slice through everything like butter! Must be due to the grain structure.
 
Just a guess, but maybe since S30V is tougher (more ductile?) than VG10 it may be harder to sharpen well and completely remove the burr?

Hardness potential is so close will all these steels that it really depends on the heat treat and tempering... They're all good and it pays to have experts making them.

Wait.. someone said VG-10 is better than any stainless, but isn't VG-10 categorized as stainless? It has as much chromium as S30V and 154CM, so...
 
The issue with the high-alloy steels (most stainless steels) is that the better the edge retention, usually the greater the wear resistance and difficulty in sharpening.

The grain structure can actually be seen without magnification, but the blade needs to have a decent finish on it and you need very good light. This will give you a rough idea. Of course to properly examine the grain, you will need magnification.

When I look at blades, I play it in the light and beneath the surface finish (satin hand rubbed finishes can make it a bit difficult to see) there is a waterry pattern that some people see more clearly in D2 - they would call that the "orange peel" texture, because the grain structure is rather large. On steels like ATS34, the grain structure is smaller and more even, and that "orange peel" texture is there, but it is simply in much smaller scale.

On my forged and stock-removed carbon steel blades, I want the hardened edge portion to have a grain structure so fine, even when etched, the grain structure looks like an even matte texture. Ie.- you should NOT be able to see the grain at all, with the naked eye. For this reason, all my carbon steel blades are etched in ferric chloride to inspect for quality control, as per Ed Fowler's recommendations. Many other knifemakers do that too.

Hope that makes sense. If this is total BS, please correct me. These are some ideas I've been operating with for some time. Jason.
 
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