Visiting an old friend

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Gary W. Graley

Gary W. Graley

“Imagination is more important than knowledge"
Knifemaker / Craftsman / Service Provider
Joined
Mar 2, 1999
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Morning crew, ever dig out some of your old sharpening stones and put steel to them once again? I have the small and large version of the Norton double grit stone and they have sat for several years as I used 'new' stones for this and that. The other day I dragged them out of the catch all cabinet and took them out of their boxes to give them some sunshine and steel. Pleasantly surprised at how nice and toothy the edge came from these more 'common' sharpening stones. And lightly touched the blade on my Fallkniven CC4 and a light strop. The resulting edges were very keen and toothy hair popping edge.

Now I don't use oil on these, but sharpen dry and then use lighter fuel to clean the stones off as that brings it back quickly, my friend Tim Wright explained that to us several years ago at one of the Ashokan seminars.

Untitled by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

I've sharpened up several knives after getting these stones back out and really enjoy the edge they are providing.

If you have an old stone that might be glazed over, take some fine grit carbide powder, used in lapidary stone polishing, and sprinkle some on a glass plate, a small pile of the powder and drop some water on it. Then in circular/figure 8 moves you can refresh/resurface your old glazed stone and also start to flatten it out as you go along. I'll warn you the noise of the resulting grinding will be quite loud so you may want to do this outside before your better half says you shouldn’t

G2
 
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Decades ago, individual stones were all I used. A Norton carbide double grit, soft and hard Arkansas. I had no problem putting on a keen edge that would last through skinning at least two deer. Most I dealt with at one time. Then I found modular clamp and rod style sharpeners. Worse thing that ever happened to me. I think it is time to pull out and clean up the stones. Will take some practice getting back to where I was but that is ok. Winter is coming so I will be inside more.
G2, thanks for the prompting to get me back to my knife sharpening roots.
 
You're welcome sir and yes, these new fangled things can be terrific but also a detriment sometimes.

One thing I found is the height relationship between you and the stone as you are sharpening. When I was trying to use a sink bridge, the stone was lower than when I was sitting at a desk and sharpening and sitting at the desk things just went a lot better in keeping control of the angle forward and backward while sharpening, a more consistent control I think and it was just a natural feeling that I didn't struggle at all to get a really toothy sharp edge much easier!

Here's a couple of old photos of the carbide grit as well as some stones I use to take with me when I did a lot of traveling for work;

carbide grit by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

travel kit by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

If you buy some grit I would start with 100 grit or so and you'll not need a lot as a little goes a long ways.
G2
 
That Coarse/Fine India stone is essentially my favorite for the knives I use everyday in 1095, CV, 420HC & similar steels.

Back before I'd learned to sharpen properly, I had this picture in my mind, as my goal. It revolved entirely around an 'old school' ideal about sharpening on simple stones by hand, like the 'wise old-timers' I revered for this sort of skill. I first went down the path with a guided setup, which did a good job illustrating why angle control is important and how that affects the crispness of the finished edge, as well as introducing me to the burr created in doing so. I was absolutely clueless about the significance of the burr and didn't even recognize what I was looking at when I created the first BIG, obvious burr - it broke off onto my fingertip when I was feeling the edge and I thought something was wrong with the steel, seeing a big sliver of it just falling off. Then the light bulb clicked 'ON' for the first time, in that moment, and I was hooked for learning more.

So now, I'm finally in that happy zone I pursued as my goal and getting the most enjoyment out of doing it 'old school' with results that years ago I never thought I could achieve. Even now, when I do spend a little money on some new stone, it's usually one of the simple ones. My most recent purchase was a $9 Smith's dual-grit stone I picked up at Walmart. I wanted to see how it compared to my India, and it worked surprisingly well on the same knives. There's a lot of satisfaction in knowing that even a simple, inexpensive stone can still get the job done - and does it pretty well at that.
 
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Gary W. Graley said:
You're welcome sir and yes, these new fangled things can be terrific but also a detriment sometimes.

One thing I found is the height relationship between you and the stone as you are sharpening. When I was trying to use a sink bridge, the stone was lower than when I was sitting at a desk and sharpening and sitting at the desk things just went a lot better in keeping control of the angle forward and backward while sharpening, a more consistent control I think and it was just a natural feeling that I didn't struggle at all to get a really toothy sharp edge much easier!

Here's a couple of old photos of the carbide grit as well as some stones I use to take with me when I did a lot of traveling for work;

carbide grit by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

travel kit by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

If you buy some grit I would start with 100 grit or so and you'll not need a lot as a little goes a long ways.
G2
Click to expand...
Nice travel kit. Thank you for the info on the grit
 
a little grit goes a long way, that container would last a lifetime of resurfacing for a normal sharpening stone.
G2
 
Yes, my added experience since putting away earlier stones helps me understand and appreciate them more.
Because that Shapton Pro 5000 felt like slick tile when I was new to sharpening - little feedback, I was really flying blind on that one. It's the dog of the lineup but part of the most recommended set of Shapton Pros.
Now my hands know what to look for and that makes all the difference.
 
Sometimes things seem wrong but it can just be a matter of patience and understanding what you need to do. I recently ordered a shapton 500 and a 4k. Why? Lol dunno just curious how much they can aid in my sharpening journey. The 500 arrived and has a good feel during sharpening so I think it will be an asset in my collection of stones
G2
 
I went with two stones when I started, a medium india and hard arkansas, wanting the finest edge possible out of a 2 stone setup. I eventually added a crystolon for thinning and certain steels but the india/ark combo works well for me. There is probably 2-3 stones I want to pick up and try and see if they'll be better but that medium india will be hard to beat, cleaned it the other day with barkeeps friend and a abrasive pad and it's like new cutting nicely.
 
My Shapton bench stone 4k arrived today, did not disappoint, tempted to get the 1k and might just do that to round out the set, have the 500 and it's a good jump to the 4k but it's all a mixture of other different stones so I might be ok, but I do like how these cut.

My sharpening stance at the sink with a wooden sink bridge that I made doesn't really work well for me. I don't seem to be as consistent as when I am seated with the stones at about the height of my elbows. With that setup I have more control than over the sink so I will not work with that as it hasn't produced good results, but that's just me. It seems being sitting and closer to the stones I have far more control and I can maintain the angle while sharpening.

G2
 
Gary W. Graley said:
My Shapton bench stone 4k arrived today, did not disappoint, tempted to get the 1k and might just do that to round out the set, have the 500 and it's a good jump to the 4k but it's all a mixture of other different stones so I might be ok, but I do like how these cut.

My sharpening stance at the sink with a wooden sink bridge that I made doesn't really work well for me. I don't seem to be as consistent as when I am seated with the stones at about the height of my elbows. With that setup I have more control than over the sink so I will not work with that as it hasn't produced good results, but that's just me. It seems being sitting and closer to the stones I have far more control and I can maintain the angle while sharpening.

G2
Click to expand...
My jig is 15* off vertical on one side and 20 on the other. I rotate the rig 180* when switching between R & L bevels. At the kitchen table, I sit for small knives and stand for large ones. The Shaptons are spritz and go, and the “Sink” catches the drips.AC70B0BC-7A34-489B-A8E5-5A2CA42BA8EA.png
 
Them India's are pretty nice stones and I like the feed back. They are a real burger if you come across an older dished one with the intent to flatten it.

It sometimes takes awhile for me to find my way with a new stone. I have a couple of stones that I hated when I first got them and now they are some of my favorites. Mostly due to preconceived expectations based on what I had heard or just the feel and how they work with or with out slurry and pressure too. It's been a learning process for me, an enjoyable one.
 
Gary W. Graley said:
My Shapton bench stone 4k arrived today, did not disappoint, tempted to get the 1k and might just do that to round out the set, have the 500 and it's a good jump to the 4k but it's all a mixture of other different stones so I might be ok, but I do like how these cut.

G2
Click to expand...
I have Shaptons, the 500 Shapton Glass is a favorite then usually go to a 2K. Going to the 1k is too small a jump.
I've recently been experimenting with going from 500 to a 5K stone - it's a question of how much tooth I want to retain.
 
I figured the jump from a 2k to the 4k was too close so that is why I went with the 1k
I’ll see how that goes
G2
 
Did a sharpening yesterday going with
Shaptons
500
1k
4k
Light strop
Ended up with a really nice polished bevel edges and a very sharp edge on 14C28N blade
G2
 
Well I ordered the Shapton 220 to finish out my set and took some scraps of cedar boards to make a small cubby to hold them when I go to sharpen. Helps to keep things more organized and a little neater
;)
There are wooden spacers glued in to separate each stone which makes it easier to draw each one out. Right now the 220 grit is on its way so that space is empty right now.

https://flic.kr/p/2nRQ9r5

https://flic.kr/p/2nRMKAc

While I won’t always need to start with the 220 it’s good to know that I can have a more aggressive grit to set the initial bevels if the blade is in rough condition

G2
 
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My Shapton 220 arrived today, folks be aware that Amazon does take things back and in this case, they placed it back in stock as a NEW item, it wasn't. I was surprised to find that the packaging showed banged up corners and not wrapped in plastic, nor was the sheet of paper that comes in the Shapton box was not there. The stone showed glazing over and slightly dished center areas, obviously used and put away without any attempt at surfacing the stone.

I contacted Amazon, gave them my tale of woe, as I did NOT want to return it and have them think I had used the stone. They apologized, as they always do, pretty good manners they have but then they should I suppose. I warned them that taking back a wear item and selling it as NEW is very very bad practice, I don't think they have a dent and scratch section of the store so they just took the return and placed it back in stock as new. They must get millions of returns so there are probably many other items that may be suspect.

SO, the person said I did not need to return, smart on their part so as not to put it in stock again and asked if I wanted the refund started? Well, I could have just taken the refund and resurfaced the stone but I did make the tidy holder and I will just give my grandson this 220 grit for him to use as he is starting to show some sharpening talent. ;) Amazon took care of this, well when I see the replacement I'll know for sure, but the 220 is pretty coarse as I had figured it would be and I think it will help set the bevels on knives that need that type of start for the edge. I spent about an hour working on the stone with a small stone to clean up and level out again, looks and feels better and I sharpened a small folder that I use for opening boxes and it neatly set the new bevel nicely!

G2
 
One of my weaknesses is getting the angle on the opposite side of the stone, I can see on the near side what's happening but not so much on the far side. I've been tempted to buy those plastic wedge thingys but held off. So I tried using a piece of plastic that I cut up and flattened the ends so when you tighten down the stone it grips these posts. Depending on how wide the blade is, and the angle of the bevel, I can tilt the posts to the side to get it close and match each side up. So when I go to sharpen, I just need to rest the spine of the blade on the post, near the very edge of it, and then using two hands I can make sure that I maintain that angle while I push the blade across the stone. On the opposite side, same thing, rest on the post and draw the blade towards me, using my left hand as a sensor type thing to make sure I don't wobble or change angles. It reminds me of when I use the Ken Onion sharpener that you reference on the flat plate and carefully bring the blade up to the belt.

Untitled by GaryWGraley, on Flickr

G2
 
I find I have the same issue when I try to swipe the entire bevel in one pass, one side I hold well the other so so. Doing it in two sections, or three if it's a long knife, helped.
 
Yep sharpening in stages helps, I know some people use a couple of coins but this seems to work well for me so far.
G2
 
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