WA knife handle with dowel method question

W

Whatsup

Joined
Aug 25, 2023
Messages
27
Hi there :)

I've seen some tutorials about using the dowel method for WA handles. They show how to use this method with 5 minute epoxy. Is 5 minute epoxy essential to this method? I like to use it with G/Flex epoxy because that is what I have.

Sometimes I see them applying vaseline or another fluid to the dowel to prevent the epoxy glue to stick to it during the initial glue up. I don't understand how this could NOT hinder the final glue up?

Some clarification on both my questions would be very nice :)

Thanks!
 
Last edited:
Whatsup said:
Is 5 minute epoxy essential to this method?
Click to expand...
No, just faster.
Whatsup said:
I don't understand how this could NOT hinder the final glue up?
Click to expand...
Yes, but the reason for this is to give a "custom fit" pocket for the tang to set into, and then remove the handle for final finishing/shaping without risking damage to the blade. Then you clean off the Vaseline good and re-glue.
 
Five minute epoxy lasts a bit longer than 5, Slow cure West Tech G-Flex two part epoxy is the way to go. I have wooden handled knives that have been used up to 25 years and even by uniformed people put them thru a dishwasher without a failure . Also score the steel tang & leave the inside of the hole rough. The 80-100 grit surface area , works better for the epoxy to bond with.
 
For those who don't understand the question:
The dowel method on a Wa-handle (Japanese kitchen knife handle) is done by drilling the handle blank with a round hole the size of the tang width and splitting dowel that fits on each side of the tang. The dowels are slightly tapered to slide in easily on each side of the blade tang. You apply epoxy to the inside of the tang hole, grease the tang so the epoxy won't stick to it, slide in the tang and then the two dowel halves on each side. Tap the dowel halves in on each side leaving them proud. Let the epoxy set, pull out the tang, and let the epoxy cure. Five-minute epoxy is used because it is strong enough and the short set time doesn't take more than a few minutes. Once the handle and blade are both finished, the tang hole has a good grade epoxy dripped in it and the tang is epoxied in permanently. This creates a perfectly fitted handle with minumum cleanup. In some cases the bade is only tapped in friction tight. This is because the handles are considered ependable and can be replaced.
 
So the 5 minute epoxy is used because you can easily wait until it sets. The epoxy has to be set to a certain amount before you pull the tang out?

One of the things I like about the dowel method is that you just drill a round hole into the parts of the handle; you don't have to make slits in it to fit the tang

Another thing I like is the fact that you can let the dowel run towards the but end of the handle and stick the dowel in the rear end of a handle - every bit of the handle can be connected by the dowel

What I don't like about the method is that you're gluing the tang into a hole that is smeared with vaseline.

This gives a clear impression of the dowel method

Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith : The slight tapering of the dowel is a good point btw, thanks. I hadn't picked that up from other sources. Thanks!
 
Last edited:
No need to "smear" the tang with Vaseline. Just a very light film is plenty.

There should be little or no epoxy on the flat sides of the dowels. Once the epoxy in the mix pot sets you just pull out the tang and wipe it off with acetone. The slot should be fine as far as the second glue-up when all is done.

Most times I have put nothing on the tang and just pulled it out when the work pot gels. I wipe it off, push it back in, pull it out and wipe off, repeat a few times and then just let the handle cure.
 
Whatsup said:
One of the things I like about the dowel method is that you just drill a round hole into the parts of the handle; you don't have to make slits in it to fit the tang
Click to expand...
:)

yCPgEkv.jpg
 
I use West System 105 resin and 205 hardener and add graphite powder to color the epoxy black. I do not use Vaseline and just pull the tang out before the epoxy completely sets. Even though the 205 hardener is their fast hardener, it can take up to an hour or so depending on temperature. I pull the tang for the first time after twenty minutes, clean the black epoxy off the tang with isopropyl and reinsert the tang. I pull it out again and see how much epoxy is on it. When the tang comes out almost clean and the residue does not want to come off with isopropyl, you're done. Otherwise, wait ten minutes and try again. If you do this out in a hot shop or use a faster epoxy, it will go a lot quicker. For this whole process to work without the pieces shifting when you pull the tang, I recommend a wooden hand screw clamp with one of the jaws slotted for the tang. I cut the slot on a small table saw sled in multiple passes. The clamps are cheap at Harbor Freight and work well enough for this purpose.

When the epoxy is cured the next day, the tang normally fits, but sometimes you cannot fully insert it again. You can either heat the tang and burn it in, or grind away the spot where it hangs up. I much prefer the second method, it only takes a few minutes and there is no bad odor. Plus, there is no concern of weakening the epoxy that is holding the handle together. I grind the tang before final glue up anyway to add some roughness and a couple of notches and can kill two birds with one stone.

The latest youtube knifemaker trend seems to be to wrap the tang in Teflon tape and coat it in Vaseline. Seems like a lot of work to solve a non-existent problem. As long as your tang is tapered a little bit both ways, it is not a problem.

SfZcRnz.png
 
In Japan to set the tang, makers prefer to use hot glue these days. Hot glue allows you to replace the handle without destroying the existing handle if you want to put on a different one down the road but want to keep the existing one intact to use again.

Here is a video (timestamped) that shows a man burning in the tang and setting the tang with hotglue strips.

Later he seals the opening with a tube of sealant, not sure exactly what type, maybe just a latex or silicone. The sealant goes on white in color but dries clear.
 
Last edited:
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
For those who don't understand the question:
The dowel method on a Wa-handle (Japanese kitchen knife handle) is done by drilling the handle blank with a round hole the size of the tang width and splitting dowel that fits on each side of the tang. The dowels are slightly tapered to slide in easily on each side of the blade tang. You apply epoxy to the inside of the tang hole, grease the tang so the epoxy won't stick to it, slide in the tang and then the two dowel halves on each side. Tap the dowel halves in on each side leaving them proud. Let the epoxy set, pull out the tang, and let the epoxy cure. Five-minute epoxy is used because it is strong enough and the short set time doesn't take more than a few minutes. Once the handle and blade are both finished, the tang hole has a good grade epoxy dripped in it and the tang is epoxied in permanently. This creates a perfectly fitted handle with minumum cleanup. In some cases the bade is only tapped in friction tight. This is because the handles are considered ependable and can be replaced.
Click to expand...
Must of been late or just not focused when I read the questions, Duh? Stacy is correct. For a trial run to make sure everything fits flush, 5min with Vaseline on the tang works well. Then use G-Flex for your final assembly …
 
Hubert S. said:
I use West System 105 resin and 205 hardener and add graphite powder to color the epoxy black. I do not use Vaseline and just pull the tang out before the epoxy completely sets. Even though the 205 hardener is their fast hardener, it can take up to an hour or so depending on temperature. I pull the tang for the first time after twenty minutes, clean the black epoxy off the tang with isopropyl and reinsert the tang. I pull it out again and see how much epoxy is on it. When the tang comes out almost clean and the residue does not want to come off with isopropyl, you're done. Otherwise, wait ten minutes and try again. If you do this out in a hot shop or use a faster epoxy, it will go a lot quicker. For this whole process to work without the pieces shifting when you pull the tang, I recommend a wooden hand screw clamp with one of the jaws slotted for the tang. I cut the slot on a small table saw sled in multiple passes. The clamps are cheap at Harbor Freight and work well enough for this purpose.

When the epoxy is cured the next day, the tang normally fits, but sometimes you cannot fully insert it again. You can either heat the tang and burn it in, or grind away the spot where it hangs up. I much prefer the second method, it only takes a few minutes and there is no bad odor. Plus, there is no concern of weakening the epoxy that is holding the handle together. I grind the tang before final glue up anyway to add some roughness and a couple of notches and can kill two birds with one stone.

The latest youtube knifemaker trend seems to be to wrap the tang in Teflon tape and coat it in Vaseline. Seems like a lot of work to solve a non-existent problem. As long as your tang is tapered a little bit both ways, it is not a problem.
Click to expand...
Good post, thanks for sharing your experience :)
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top