Water Quenchable Steels

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GrahamCopeland

Joined
Mar 11, 2013
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I have finally gotten the supplies and everything I need to forge some basic knives. I was wondering what type of steel would be best to use as a beginner for making knives. I would like for it to be water quenchable for ease of use and be able to stand up to rust pretty well. I am open to any tips or pointers any of you may have.
 
Nothing that i know of is both water quenched and stain resistant to much of a degree. Anything reasonably stainless should not be heat treated in a forge.
 
Any carbon steel is obviously going to rust which makes this a great time to also start etching the knives you're going to make. Invest in some good brand name etching liquid or go the cheap route and freeze white vinegar. As it starts to thaw pour and keep what turns to liquid while its still 2/3 frozen. Discard the frozen part. The resulting liquid increases from the standard 5% acidity to a much higher level.

I would start with a standard 10XX steel if you want to go with new purchased knife steel.

But I highly recommend you start scrounging through scrap yards and find a set of leaf springs... they won't be the "best" steel to make knives with, but your first knives are not going to be that great (believe me, mine are still not that great) and IMHO you're wasting money by making those first knives out of purchased steel.

You could easily make a dozen large knives out of one leaf spring and when you're finished you'll be ready to move on to purchased steel. You wouldn't believe the amount of carbon and spring steel that is just sitting there waiting for you to pound on it.

Good luck and I hope to see some pics of those first knives...
 
Oh... and buy some Canola oil... you're not going to be happy when you hear one of those first knives comes out of the water either warped or worse yet completely snapped in two. It's not fun...
 
Thankyou for your advice. Hopefully I can find some steel. What would be the best steel in the 10XX range for kitchen knives.
 
I'm no expert on steel by any means... at my level of experience I went with Aldo's 1084 on http://newjerseysteelbaron.com/ because it's very easy to work and the heat treating is not complicated. And if/when you are ready to try it I've been told it takes a very nice hamon with a clay quench.

I don't know your financial situation, but whenever I order steel I tend to order more if I can afford it... the shipping charges on two sticks of 1084 versus 4 or 6 sticks is very minimal. But if you order two and go through them like I went through them in a month you may as well have ordered 5-6 to save on the shipping charges.

If you want some really tough stuff and don't mind working a little harder (I'm assuming you don't have a power hammer) then get some 5160... the heat treat is basically the same as 1084 or any of the basic carbon steels.
 
Thankyou that really helps a lot. And no unfortuneately I do not have a power hammer. It's on the dream list though. I will keep looking into it and hopefully get some more knives made.
 
The struggle is real my brother... the 5160 is not that hard to work depending on how hot you get it. I try to work everything at a lower temp to minimize grain growth... there are makers out there that work 5160 at 2000 degrees and I'm sure it feels like butter at that temperature... I work carbon steel at between 1500 and 1650 to inhibit the nasty grain structure.

There are those who will disagree and say I'm wasting my time, but I have personally broken somewhere around 25-30 blades, all but 3 of them mine, and I have seen the grain structure and discrepancies inside steel that has been abused and over-heated. Try it for yourself on some scrap carbon steel and you'll see what I'm talking about.
 
Graham, I would call Aldo at The New Jersey Steel Baron. Get some 1084 or 1075. Both are easy to forge, easy to heat treat, can be quenched in canola oil. They will rust, but a good finish can minimize that. I would personally use canola oil over water for quenching, much less chance of cracking and other nasty things. 5160 is a good steel, but the chromium content can cause some problems. I love 5160 and it does require a little more hammer work, getting a little bit red hard, does not move quite as well under the hammer. I forge it at 1800 to 1900 and use good normalizing techniques to refine the grain.
Good luck
Brion
 
I have a coal forge and I managed to get some 5160 damascus hot enough to quench but I am defineately leaning towards 1084 now.
 
Water is a awful quenchent, most who use it stand on there tip toes awaiting that awful "pinging" sound. A good place to start is some 1080/1084 steel, and mineral oil, or car oil? anything but water. I use a known quench oil made for hardeneing steels, but if I didnt have any and low cost way a big factor I wouldnt want to waste a nice blade due to a crack that could have been prevented by using a oil instead of water. Have fun, and unless you are a master sword maker from Japan, try oil...
 
Do not use motor oil as it has additives that are dangerous to your health !! If you can't use the commercial quenchants then use veggie oil like canola oil .Make sure the steel used is compatible with that oil. This brings up the subject of "hardenability " You match the speed of the quench with the hardenability of the steel. The higher the hardenability the slower the quench. Stick to the beginner steels 1084 and 5160 .They make good blades , yet forge and heat treat easily.
When you get to complex quenching you have to know more than a few things.Yesterday Sam Salvati and I had a nice conversation about water quenching 4140 for a post anvil.Yes it can be done but oil would be easier and safer !
 
Mete I wish I would've gotten that advice a year ago... I used some old diesel motor oil to quench my first knife and the garage stunk for a week... I've been using canola oil ever since as I am too cheap to pay for proper quench when what I have works so great... if I ever got into the more complex steels I would probably have to give in and buy it though.
 
BRTATCK said:
Graham, I would call Aldo at The New Jersey Steel Baron. Get some 1084 or 1075. Both are easy to forge, easy to heat treat, can be quenched in canola oil. They will rust, but a good finish can minimize that. I would personally use canola oil over water for quenching, much less chance of cracking and other nasty things. 5160 is a good steel, but the chromium content can cause some problems. I love 5160 and it does require a little more hammer work, getting a little bit red hard, does not move quite as well under the hammer. I forge it at 1800 to 1900 and use good normalizing techniques to refine the grain.
Good luck
Brion
Click to expand...

this! and 1084 can be air cooled!
 
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