Waterstone Help

Joined
Jan 19, 2004
Messages
551
I've been trying various things to get my ESSEs sharp. I can get them so that they shave my arm but with pressure and a little drawing motion. In other words, not as sharp as they came from the factory. I want them like insanely sharp. So that I can push cut pieces of paper or shave my arm by just lightly pushing the hair--like my Shun kitchen knives.

So, today I bought a Norton 1000/4000 combo stone. The knives were ok but not razor sharp before I started on them. (I typically use DMT bench stones and DMT flat folding thingies--Blue, Red and Green).

I could not accomplish ANYTHING with the waterstones except to make the blades dull.

I'm pretty decent with bench stones so why should these be any different? I soaked them, followed the directions, etc.

It's a frustrating feeling to know that my knives are sharpest the first day I get them and then downhill from there.

I've heard good things about waterstones, apart from the maintenance/wear issues.

Can anyone provide any advice?
 
I can only offer the same advice my Dad gave me a long time ago......practice, practice, practice. With free hand sharpening, the most critical factor is technique. Technique is only something you'll gain with time and practice. You will slowly gain muscle memory for the right angle and pressure. Practice with cheaper knives first and eventually you'll see positive results. Good luck man.
 
I agree with mtndude, Practice, it took me a long time to get really good with water stones. I have probaly sharpend 2-3 hundred knives before i got really good at it. One thing that took my shrpening skills to the next level is a leather strop with a compound. It helps take wire edges off and refines the edge.
 
I use the Norton 220/1000 stone and I get those results off of the 1000. There are a couple of things that I keep in mind when using the stone though. In no particular order of importance...

1. Pressure
2. Flatness and Smoothness
3. Starting with the right grit

You want to use very light pressure. The stones don't really wear fast, but they don't work very well with a lot of pressure on them. It's hard to quantify how much pressure is too much, but I typically try to stay with knife-weight on folders. A little bit of pressure is okay, but too much and you'll gouge the edge into the stone. It's something that you kind of have to get a feel for.

The flatness and smoothness of the stones is really important, especially at the grits you're talking about. I mean, I don't have first hand experience with the 4000, but myself personally I can't get a good edge unless I have the stone perfectly flat and at a good roughness. I feel the Norton flattener leaves it too rough. Lapping with 220 sandpaper is better but I've found that 320 grit seems to leave a very nice polish. In any case, flatness is of more importance than the surface roughness, but it's made a different in my edge quality in the past.

My biggest suspicion is that the 1000 grit is too fine to establish a very good edge, which is making the 4000 side useless as well. The 1000 side can produce its own bevel, but it takes a very long time, and if you're just trying to sharpen an existing bevel it doesn't do a good job unless it's a very symmetric grind. Most factory knives really aren't. My Izula was no exception, so I had to reprofile on the 220 to get a good, flat and keen edge first. I would try establishing a basic edge with your Blue DMT hone, and then moving on to the 1000.

Which ESEEs are you sharpening? I reestablished the bevel at 40 inclusive and stropped on CrO and got a hair whittling edge. Even shaves my face, though at 40* it's not the most comfortable shave I've ever had. So I definitely think the equipment is capable. Like others have said it's probably a matter of practice, but those are the tips I would have given myself when starting with my 220/1000.
 
Thanks, guys.

I think I might be applying too much pressure. What I'm really trying to get back into shape is the HEST that I abused at the Wilderness Ops course. The edge was very badly damaged from about 10,000 scrapes on a fire rod. I got all the nicks out and got a nice, smooth edge now, just not as sharp.

I will take your advice, Kenny and let you know.
 
Use the spine of the knife for your firesteel.

I get better results on waterstones when I vary my pressure on each stone. The first few passes will be with moderate pressure and ultimately the last few passes on the same grit stone will just be blade weight passes. Then, I progress to the next finer grit stone and use the same technique. I then finish with a leather strop and it I am in an OCD sharpness mood, I'll strop on a pane of glass.
 
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