Weight Variations Among The Same Model Knife

[Douglas Wever]

Three identical Randall Model 12 (12-9) Sportsman Bowies with Model 14 grinds, but the weight range among them is striking.

Beginning from top, the first model Randall weighs in ounces 21.3; then the black with micarta handle weighs 19.4; and finally, the leather and horn handled one is over a quarter pound lighter than the first at 16.8.

What gives? And the heaviest knife (21.3) is the only one with a shorter 8 and 7/8" blade, the other two lighter ones are a full 9". Is it simply variance in the craftsmanship such that there is less left of the blade in some than others? If you look at the Randall web site, and bring up for example the Smithsonian, Randall gives a range of weights there, 28-34 oz. So this is normal, I'm just interested in what accounts for it. Thanks

 

[jux t]

I've noticed variations in production knives too, in my case the cold steel master hunters. I've weighed dozens of them, and even in the same grind/steel configuration they differ in weight. Although not to the extreme that you report in your Randalls.

I see that some are ground a bit differently, and vary in length. Perhaps in bigger knives like yours, this adds up to be a more significant difference.

Edit: also the difference in handle material should be accounted for.

 

[Douglas Wever]

Perhaps in bigger knives like yours, this adds up to be a more significant difference.

Edit: also the difference in handle material should be accounted for.

Actually, a ca. 1982 Model 14 is the largest and only Randall I have, but I'm on a little buying spree since selling a Wilson Combat CQB Elite in .45. When I went to order the Randal Model 12-9 in the Sportsman Bowie, I encountered the weight differences. If the difference is predominantly in the blade then I want the heavy one. The two heavier ones both have micarta handles and the handles should weigh virtually the same. I also have a 1-7 on order since Monday due by Friday week.

 

[palmerdl]

Looking at the A.G. Russell catalog, where your pictures are from, the differences I see are in the handle configurations and materials. There will be some variation in blade weight because they are hand ground... human variations. The Handle dimensions may vary because they too are hand shaped. The stag handle has an aluminum butt cap and the lightest handle materials. Your top picture has a beefier guard than the other two guard shapes. All these add up to fractions of an ounce and may account for the 2 oz. difference. I have a hard time thinking there is an actual 4.5 oz. difference from heaviest to lightest.
Also, catalog specs. are not always absolutely correct. Seems that when changing the specs for different knives of the same model some numbers/ materials either don't get changed or there are just plain typos that don't get caught before printing. Call Russell for confirmation. They all say 'Low Stock' so you have to call anyway.
I'd pick the handle you like the most and go with it. In fact, I would be more interested in the diameters of the handles. That stag looks skinny in the picture. Along with no contour, if you have larger hands it might not suit you. Since you're leaning towards blade weight as a deciding factor, I'm guessing you intend it to be a chopper. Grip just might be important.

 

[Douglas Wever]

So I simply ordered the heaviest one from A.G. Russell today and confirmed the published weight. That 21.3 ounce knife with the longer 9" blade will round out a Model 14 I have at 14 ounces, and a Model 1-7 at 9.5 ounces. Obviously I don't have it yet, the picture is from the retailer's web site.

 

[Petunia D. Feeble]

Three identical Randall Model 12 (12-9) Sportsman Bowies with Model 14 grinds, but the weight range among them is striking.

Beginning from top, the first model Randall weighs in ounces 21.3; then the black with micarta handle weighs 19.4; and finally, the leather and horn handled one is over a quarter pound lighter than the first at 16.8.

What gives? And the heaviest knife (21.3) is the only one with a shorter 8 and 7/8" blade, the other two lighter ones are a full 9". Is it simply variance in the craftsmanship such that there is less left of the blade in some than others? If you look at the Randall web site, and bring up for example the Smithsonian, Randall gives a range of weights there, 28-34 oz. So this is normal, I'm just interested in what accounts for it. Thanks

I believe those are hidden tang knives. I suspect that's where a lot of the variance lies. Some may be narrower or thinner than others. They also have different guards, both in shape and material.

Randalls have a reputation for a reason though. I wouldn't worry about it much.

 

[Gaston444]

They are good knives, but quite loosely made dimensionally.

The four I owned, including a 12/14 grind, were all one tenth of an inch short of their blade specs (I'd rather they be over than under). More annoying still was the stock on the 14, 18 and 12, which was 0.21, 0.19 and 0.22" respectively mid-blade (and not any thicker at the ricasso except for the 14). Way thinner than the claimed spec of 0.25" (except at the tang itself)... Even the $100 UC Rambo licensed copies are a meatier 0.23"...

Strangely the Clinton dagger was a full 0.25", but seemed to have less edge holding. I did not like the weird, uneven swirly Randall metal finish, and kept only the 14 because I had it Cerakoated, so it is nicer to look at.

They do perform given their thin edges.

Gaston

 

[Douglas Wever]

My Randall Model 14 is very robust, be interesting when the 12-9 gets here.

 

[jux t]

They do perform given their thin edges.

Gaston

What have you used them for?

 

[Gaston444]

Chopping wood, and saving my freaking life in a sudden cold spell.

Gaston

 

[Dr Heelhook]

I think a lot of people underestimate how much the handle weighs on a knife, there's a lot of material there. Especially when there's brass involved, brass has a higher density than steel and much higher than aluminum. I'm guessing that's an aluminum butt cap on the last stag handled one? There's a pretty big chunk of metal in those butt caps to balance out those long blades. Also the stag handle looks a bit more narrow than the commando shape handles on the two first knives. I believe micarta is generally denser and heavier than stag also.