Wet moulding - Dyeing ?

harronek

harronek

Joined
Nov 29, 2013
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2,493
Who here dyes the leather before wet moulding , or does everyone dye after ?


Ken
 
I'll start, :) I dye everything after I wet mold it and let it dry thoroughly. I did try back in the day to dye first and the after effects are at best blotchy.
 
Wait a minute Mr Puckett. You wet mold, then dye, then stitch??

I'm never gonna get this down....
 
I've done both ways but how even it turns out depends on the dye penetration as well as the type of hide. I've found some hides pre dyed will become splotchy and uneven but others turn out great. If it's much help I've had the best luck pre dying wickett and Craig more than Hermann oak. Imported hides it's anyone's guess.

Take care!

Luke
 
schmittie said:
Wait a minute Mr Puckett. You wet mold, then dye, then stitch??

I'm never gonna get this down....
Click to expand...

you can call it mold/dye/stitch

or you can call it dye/mold/stitch

or you can call it stitch/dye/mold

or you can call it Ray Jay Johnson Junior :p

Just dont mold your dye stitch, THAT can only end badly.
 
So has anyone tried molding leather already dyed with water based leather dye ? ( because I'm about to find out :) )

Ken

PS - In the short time I've been playing with making sheaths I've always dyed the sheath after molding , but have read recently about some knowledgeble people that dye first .
 
It's Nope from me, one of the reasons is I use the fiebings professional oil dyes as they dye more evenly but also it puts some oil back INTO the leather which helps the leather to remain in good condition longer, as the wet forming and subsequent drying can remove oils that were there.

But, that's just me :)
G2
 
harronek said:
So has anyone tried molding leather already dyed with water based leather dye ? ( because I'm about to find out :) )

Ken

PS - In the short time I've been playing with making sheaths I've always dyed the sheath after molding , but have read recently about some knowledgeble people that dye first .
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The water based dye might act differently than spirit based, please do let us know how it works out. :)
 
Regarding whether or not Feibing's Pro Oil Dye contains any oil or not, please refer to the old thread here on BF discussing this subject along with other things. I would really like to know once and for all does it or does it not contain oil. I believe as I did then that it does not.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/984610-Dye-vs-oil

http://shop.fiebing.com/c/leathercraft_dyes_professional-oil-dye

The second link mentions alcohol based, but does not specifically state any oil content?

Paul
 
Having handled an old bottle that had evaporated considerably, the condensate at the bottom of the bottle was very oily in both appearance and feel. Whatever it is, its thick, does not evaporate easily, and slows the "cure" rate of the dye considerably.

If its not oil, its a very oil like substance. Possibly a retarding agent, similar to whats added to oil paint to make it more pliable for an extended time, that substance is not considered an oil either but its very much oil like.

But that is not the subject of this thread, it needs its own thread so this one does not get too far off track, yes?
 
harronek said:
So has anyone tried molding leather already dyed with water based leather dye ? ( because I'm about to find out :) )

Ken

PS - In the short time I've been playing with making sheaths I've always dyed the sheath after molding , but have read recently about some knowledgeble people that dye first .
Click to expand...

Back to the subject at hand, I've wetted the swatches I made for testing the water based green dye, we can combine our results here and see what happens to it when it gets wet through and through versus only surface and how it acts when abraded as when you are wet molding.
 
I will post up some pictures later , but I think it has been reasonably successful . Problem is I haven't ever moulded pre dyed leather of any kind to compare it with . One thing of note - even though I thoroughly cleaned up the leather after dying it ( no residue of any kind or coloration coming off onto a cloth ) after wetting the leather and moulding it I had quite a bit of dye on my hands , not really bad but some .

Ken
 
Yea, that was one thing I was afraid of, and has happened with this green as well. It seems since the dye is water soluble it will rehydrate and migrate out of the leather like a sponge. My green dyed leather looks noticeably lighter now that its nearly dry, and its not all that even anymore either. This comes from the piece that was not messed with by molding, only soaked.
 



Here is a couple of photos I took while forming the leather .
I don"t think I'll dye the leather first in future . It has turned out alright , but I did have problems .

Ken
 
The black appears to be staying in the leather a bit better! :) I do understand the mess factor though, that would be a deal killer for me as well.
 
I should have mentioned pre dying leather will make more of a mess for wet molding and it makes the leather more rigid so it's tougher to get the same level of detail. When I started making holsters I always dyed at the end of my process but after visiting with a maker who's been doing it for 40+ years with absolutely some of the best work I've seen he dyes before assembly. So I tried it and still do some both ways depending on the rig. If I'm dealing with contrasting colors or exotics I often dye before assembly. That said I still don't have 100% consistent results and I've taken some brown rigs that weren't even and dyed them black and rebuilt a few times.

Like anything with leatherwork practice is key and it's not a bad option but it doesn't work for everyone everytime.

Luke
 
luke213 said:
I should have mentioned pre dying leather will make more of a mess for wet molding and it makes the leather more rigid so it's tougher to get the same level of detail. When I started making holsters I always dyed at the end of my process but after visiting with a maker who's been doing it for 40+ years with absolutely some of the best work I've seen he dyes before assembly. So I tried it and still do some both ways depending on the rig. If I'm dealing with contrasting colors or exotics I often dye before assembly. That said I still don't have 100% consistent results and I've taken some brown rigs that weren't even and dyed them black and rebuilt a few times.

Like anything with leatherwork practice is key and it's not a bad option but it doesn't work for everyone everytime.




Luke
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Its interesting that you mentioned how pre-dyed leather is harder to mold . I certainly found this to be true with this latest sheath .
I had to over - work the leather in my opinion and this and the mess factor were the two biggest problems I encountered .
If your sheaths dont require any molding ( some fixed blade sheaths for example ) then I would pre dye everytime .
From now on I will pre dye any components of my sheaths that dont need molding , but all the wet molding on the rest of the sheath will be done first .

This Black water based dye isn't actually to bad , I just need to learn how to use it . I did try some lighter brown water based dye a couple of months ago and didn't like the results at all , maybe the darker the colour the better ?

Ken
 
The darker the color the better
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Yep, that is the conclusion I came to as well. :) Lighter colors, especially saddle tan, do not do well.
 
I think I do some sort of version of this.

I cut the sheath - wet form a bit as I am working the sheath - it is damp and I certainly don't fully impress the sheath. I then work further and while I am dying I do a bit of wet forming as well (knife covered of course). This allows me, when making pouch sheaths, to keep the sheath more flat (better edge stitching) while I am making the holes for hand stitching while allowing for a much better wet form later.

However - I can see how this would not be an option with other designs.

TF
 
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