Whack Test - 5 Knives

4

.45acp

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May 25, 2002
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Spine Whacking – A Tale of 5 Knives

After reading the today’s threads of the merits and demerits of spine whacks, I thought I’d give the test to the liner and frame locks I consider bulletproof EDC’s. In fact I carry them daily.

The Test
I whacked each knife in 3 positions. If you will visualize a knife, blade open, horizontal with the blade up. Holding this position, I rotated 45 deg to the left, blade vertical and rotated 45 deg right while holding a horizontal position of the knife. This applied the force of impact to each side and center of the locking juncture. I whacked the blades against a pad on my desk. The results were certainly a huge surprise to me.

The List
A, Large Plain Sebbie – Frame Lock
Passed the spine whack in all positions.

B, Strider AR - Frame Lock
Passed the whack on the center and right sides. But failed repeatedly when whacked on the left or frame lock side.

C, Darrel/Wilson Tactical Elite - Frame Lock
Passed the whack in all positions

D, Benchmade Tsunami – Liner Lock
Passed the whack right and center. But repeatedly fail on the left or liner lock side.

E, Emerson CQC7 – Liner Lock
Failed miserably in all positions every time.


The biggest surprise was the Strider failing on the lock side. BTW, the AR is one of my favorite EDC's.

Interesting to say the least. Anybody with similar or different results?


Steve
 
How hard were you whacking? Could you give this kind of whack on accident while using the knives? Has this experince made you less confident in your knives, or do you not see a real world application of this whacking?

I use slip joints mostly, so the whole lock strength thing is rather foreign to me.
 
Originally posted by Mike_Chandler
How hard were you whacking? Could you give this kind of whack on accident while using the knives? Has this experince made you less confident in your knives, or do you not see a real world application of this whacking?
.
Click to expand...

Mike, I did not whack em hard by any means, and took care to try and apply the same force to each knife. You could whack em in the same mannor in use if you did not pay attention to what you were doing.

No, I'm not worried about anything but the Emerson.


"or do you not see a real world application of this whacking?"
Don't know.
 
Interesting. I'm very surprised that the Strider failed in one position, I've always thought of them as being heavily overbuilt. I wonder if that is common to all, or just an issue with that sample. It does help me reaffirm my decision to purchase a Sebenza...which should be arriving tomorrow.
 
I just tried this test (only along the spine of the blade) on 3 of my knives. A quick, sharp snap on the spine to see if the lock would fail. 2 are liner locks and one is a back lock.

1.) Kershwaw Avalanche---Liner Lock---passed 1st whack then failed

2.) Spyderco Delica FRN---Back Lock---would not fail (but then, it's not supposed to but I had to check.)

3.) Emerson Mini-CQC7B---Liner Lock---would not fail after repeated whacks...WOULD NOT FAIL.

This has worried me about the Avalanche and I have fired off an e-mail to Kershaw...I can post when I hear about it.

:eek: :( :eek: :confused:
 
I of course had no thoughts of this failing, but I was bored.

Spyderco Endura II (back lock) Passed at all three angles, no problem. COuld probably do this all day and have no problem. Spydercos have great locks in all my experience, but this one in particular was fitted better than any spyderco I've seen(that's why I bought it, and why I pay a bit more to shop locally so I can actually check out a knife before I buy it)
 
This is why my $ goes to lockbacks pretty much exclusively. Complain all you want about the cheapness or ugliness of FRN, I trust a ltwt Spyderco or Cold Steel more than a G10 BM linerlock. (Of course, I like my steel lined G10 Spydies even better!)

Hard use? Hardly.
 
My handling of a Emerson CQC (can't remember which) didn't make me feel secure about the liner. I wasn't surprised that the CQC7 failed miserably for the spine whack test.
As to the Spyderco lockbacks holding up against a spine whack, let me put it this way, Spyderco is so demanding that even though Endura satistfy all my needs, whenever i sent it back for sharpening (I just somehow wreck it beyond my patience), they almost always breaks it testing its strength. And I mean every time, even though I've done impromptu tests on the Endura before and there's no way for me to close it unless I touch the lock bar. Their standards are really high.
 
Yeah, send you AR in for a tuneup, mine just passed in all postions.
 
When it comes to the spine whack, there's a difference between a framelock and just about any other lock. With a framelock, for just about any reasonable real-life action, your hand will be wrapped around the lock, helping to reinforce the lock itself (in theory). Although I think it's perfectly reasonable to expect any lock to pass a simple light spinewhack.

I'd comment about which of the test results above I somewhat expected, but given the popularity of some of the above names, I'm afraid I'd be declared a heretic and burned at the stake :)

Joe
 
All I know is that if my Strider AR's lock was going to fail, I would want to know about it.

That sucker will surely break your forefinger with the large choil snapping back at you. If you were really unlucky enough to be holding the knife further back when the lock failed, then you can kiss 2-3 fingers good bye.

I whacked my AR on a 2x4 when I first got it just to be sure. Strider has had about a dozen large folders go back to them for warranty work due to back initial construction.

Heretic or not, thems the facts.:)
 
was an M-16-03Z AFTER I abused it relentlessly and it developed a little blade wiggle. It still passed. I always have a slip joint in my pocket and just take care how I use it. If I'm going to do any serious cutting I'll take a lockback, or better yet, my Arclite:p

Frank
 
OK, first you asked:
How hard were you whacking?
Click to expand...
and i let it slide. But then you said:
Has this experince made you less confident... or do you not see a real world application of this whacking?
Click to expand...
Come on man, surely you can see how irresistable this is? :) The fact that you closed with talk of a "joint" is just too much! :D
 
Emerson CQC7 – Liner Lock
Failed miserably in all positions every time.
Click to expand...

I have owned about 6 Emerson's and I was not happy with NOT ONE of there lock ups. Light tap on the palm of the hand was enough for most of them to fail. They need to recalibrate their machines
 
FWIW, i have/had about 10 EKI's and about 2 dozen BM's, and all have passed a light whack test. the only ones i have had probs with were the CRKT kasper and a REKAT sifu, both fixed by maker and subsequently would pass the test.

also all my custom knives have passed too (crawford perfigo/kasper, DDR mini and madd maxx.)

and all my microtechs (SOCOM, elite,2 LCC's)and a heckuva lot of CRKT's and others, have passed w/no probs.

greg
 
I was surprised that the Strider failed, not because it is a Strider, but because of the mass and stiffness of the locking bar. Tonight I plan on thoroughly degreasing the lock up and trying the whack again. I have been using CRK fluorinated grease on all my folders and some may have migrated into the locking area.

The Sebbie has the pocket clip; this attachment adds a significant amount of pressure to the locking bar. Did this make a difference? I don´t know.

The Emerson has been carried a lot since 91 or so. It also has the thinnest liner material. I was not surprised that it failed…..just disappointed that the failure rate was in the 100-percentile range.

The Darrell/Wilson Tac Elite was a little surprising; it has a fairly limber locking bar, compared to the Strider and Sebbie, but held tight every time.

One of these days, I may return the AR to Strider, but considering the hassle of international shipping and customs, it can wait a few months until I’m in the US again.

The result is that I am not worried with any of these blades in my pocket. I have not had a knife close on my hand in a number of years. Most likely due to paying attention and using folders like a slipjoint.
 
To be technically correct the AR Striders are not framelocks, they are liner locks the SNG Striders are true framelocks.



However I was amazed to read that the AR failed! I went out to my garage and proceeded to duplicate what your tests involved. I used my Strider GB folder and wacked the hell out of it, against the wall and my work bench and a 2X4 no problems from any side, I used all my force and varied the angles I had on a glove just in case :o

I would send that AR back, it might depend on when the knife was made as there were some problems with the fisrt ones Strider put out.

Also if the AR is new or the liner lock has not broken in, my GB liner sits full on the blade when I first got the GB the blade and liner only engaged about 25% The liner was designed that way for wear in application.

Snap that AR open hard and try the testing again report what you find

Good thread though very informative
 
Tonight I plan on thoroughly degreasing the lock up and trying the whack again. I have been using CRK fluorinated grease on all my folders and some may have migrated into the locking area. [/B]
Click to expand...


CRK advise you to put a spot of lube on the lock ramp when you clean & lube :eek:

I have done so whenever I have stripped and cleaned my Sebenza and never had any problems with the lock slipping but it does seem a bit of a strange thing to do?
 
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