What am I missing?

bbbowers

bbbowers

Joined
Dec 25, 2009
Messages
109
I will start by saying I have read "The Count's Standard Reply to New Knifemakers V35" and continue to read this. I have also ordered several books from there to continue learning. I want to say thanks in advance to anyone who reads this and can help me. I appreciate your time.

My goal is to begin in the forge and forge the blade to shape. From there I am really stuck because I could use a wheel grinder, belt grinder, or files. I had originally thought that I should start with files to learn the art but wasn't sure if this was even better.

I had even thought of this progression:
1. Forge to shape
2. Rough grind with a KO grinder attachment (would need to purchase), or bench grinder
3. Sharpen on KO sharpener
This would not be efficient obviously, but would get me started at least. Is this crazy?


Here is what I have/have coming so far:

Atlas Mini Forge
railroad track anvil + beat up forged steel 75lb anvil
Cheap Drill press
KO Worksharp (been using that to sharpen blades)
Cheap bench vice from menards
Old bench anvil vice
Safety equipment (eye protection, apron, hearing)
blacksmith hammer (still deciding which one)
blacksmith tongs (still deciding which one)
1084/1080 steel (still deciding what size/where/shape to get)

Between now and february I will have about $1000 coming my way and am just trying to use it the best I can. Has anyone else started where I am or have any suggestions? I don't foresee myself going strait stock removal method in the next 5 years, but I guess you never know.

I also have a couple of antique saw blades which will occupy me in the meantime (using the punching out the blade method).

So:

1. What am I missing that is essential or should be in my "need to purchase" category within that 1K I will have.
2. Should I skip the belt grinder for now and get a bench grinder to finish roughing out the blade and then use my KO worksharp to sharpen it?

I forgot to mention that I will not be starting out with any hollow grinds. I plan to do flat, saber, and scandi grinds in the near future.
 
That looks better than what i started with, I started with stock removal only.

I think you should stick to the belt grinder and skip the bench grinder, I never use one, and definitely use the ws for sharpening.

I usually use a fine grit or trizac belt for sharpening but whatever works for you!

Make sure you post up some pictures of the first knife you make with this setup and shoot me a message if you would like any more information as i would love to share.

Good luck
 
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You will need a belt sander. Get the most you can afford. You can either build one from a GIB or EERF kit type, or buy one. If at all possible, get a 2X72" type. This is the #1 tool in a knife shop. Money spent here equals time and quality in your finished blades. At the minimum, a 2X42" Sears or similar belt sander is required. If nothing else can be found, a cheap 1X30 will work for starters. Your KO Worksharp won't really work for more than sharpening.

You need several files, and lots of metal type sandpaper in grits from 100 to 800. I would recommend a 12" flat bastard file, a 10-12" second cut, a 10" finishing cut, and a 8" round file. You will get more as you need them. The "Magic-cut" files are really good. 3M sandpaper is good, and other types ,like "Ryno-wet" are great.

Get a respirator with cartridges. A half face type is what most use.

Good set of metal drill bits, and extras of 1/8, 3/16, 1/4". A good 6-8" dual sided bench stone for sharpening. Normal shop tools ( hammer, pliers, wrench, screwdrivers, etc.).

You will want a filing jig for grinding/filing the plunge and the tang shoulders. They start at around $30. The carbide ones are more expensive, but are far better. There are many good ones out there. Uncle Al's - Riverside Machine - makes good ones and other special tools. http://www.riversidemachine.net/item576493.ctlg

Start with a 3# cross peen hammer. After you get used to it, you will decide what you need additionally. A cheap one from HF/Menards will work to start with. a 2# ball peen is also good to have.
Get a pair of general use tongs, like "Wolf Jaws", and a set of "Z-Box" or "U Box" tongs. I recommend 1.25" X .25" as a starter size. You can't beat Tom Tongs. You also need a simple pick-up tings for putting things in and out of the forge. A pair of comfortable leather gloves is needed for forging. I wear a half-finger glove on my hammer hand ( like a batting glove) and a full glove on my tong hand.

You will need a "hot-cut" for the hardie on your anvil, or make one from 1/2" or 3/4" steel and clamp it in the vise for making cuts. Eventually, you will want other hardie tools like fullers and such.

Get a 48" bar of 1084 in .25X1", .185X1", and .125X1.25". These three will make you plenty of starter knives and you will know what you need next. TIP - Start with smaller knives. A 3" blade drop point hunter is a very good size and shape for your first knives.

You want a gallon or two of canola oil for the quenchant and a sturdy metal container for it. Have a top for the container. If you can get commercial quench oil instead of canola, it will last many times longer and do a better job. Any "fast" quenching oil will work. Lots of things make great quench tanks - Old fire extinguishers, old oxygen/gas tanks, old soda syrup tanks,

I wish I could tell you that this is all, but you will need many more things as time goes by.
 
Thank you Harden and Bladesmith. That is some excellent advice! I figured I couldn't get away with the KO. I have been on the fence for a grizzly 2x72, rather than a 2x42 craftsman.

I will start looking for files that you suggested, as well as the cross peen hammer and tongs. I do have a couple nice drill sets but will pick up some more that size as backups.

I have not seen one of those filing guides so that will be something I need to look into.

That is a great idea with the different sized steels. If you don't mind my asking, where do you suggest getting that steel? I have been looking at new jersey steel baron.

That list is very helpful as well as the insights. Thank you very much for both of your time!
 
Ok, I must be blind. I have been searching for "magic-cut" files for the past 20 minutes and am finding only one place to buy (http://www.eroko.com). Is that the only source you buy them from? I could't even find them on amazon.
 
Aldo Bruno is who I get my steel from:
http://newjerseysteelbaron.com/


Sorry, I typed the file name phonetically so you would know what it was called, as boogaloo said, the actual name is "magicut". Pretty much any knife supplier or industrial supplier should carry them. (FWIW, I get the same search results with magicut as well as magic-cut)
 
Where are you guys finding your quench oils? Do I really need 5 gallons if I am starting out with small knives? I did get a 2x72 grinder, belts, and steel 1084 from steel baron.
 
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