what are the needs of an urban survival blade?

psy-ops

psy-ops

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Sep 27, 1999
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This question was raised on a recent thread about urban survival knife choices.

What possible tasks would our knife have to be used for?

1. Would be to cut or pry yourself(others) free from debris/wreakage.

2. Self defense protecting your space and/or innocent people being preyed upon.


3. utilty for making bandages, food, etc


4. in extreme situations,forcibly entering into a store for supplies and/or for safety.(as a B&E tool)


I hope others add to this since I feel mine is lacking.
 
I think #2 and #3 are most likely. A crowbar is better suited for #1 and #4 and can be improvized easier in the "urban jungle." I lean towards a claw hammer for light demolitions like prying, breaking cement, and twisting off chain. Of course, that's what I do for a living, (light demo, not B&E). There's not much you can't wreck with a 20+ framing hammer, and enough time. It's probably decent as a defensive weapon as well.
 
but do you have one with you ALL the time?
(maybe you do)


I guess I didn't word the post properly. it was referring to BOB's and what knife would be carried and what are the possible demands of that knife. in an urban setting.
 
Here are some of my thoughts on this.

In core style highrises (office buildings)there are a lot of wires running above the ceilings (plentum area)in the hallways.In fires these drop down and entangle you.I'm thinking that in earthquakes and bombing this may happen also.We had a hell of a fire Fri.night one of the guys got an electrical wire caught around his neck(the insellation was burned off so just the bare wire)another guy got tangled in it and started pulling it at the same time.They pose a real hazzard.

Utilty use yes.

Self defense yes.

As far as forced entry, egress and prying, things like a crash axe,Tac Tool and knives like the CS SRK have a very limited use IMHO.Look at the guys at ground zero.What are they using? Sure I bet theres a lot of pocket knives ,Leathermans ect on belts.But for hand tools its bars and sledges,and its cranes and torches that are the real tools.Look at the rubble what could you cut with a knife? I have forced all kind of doors,cut through walls and cars and I think most others who have done so would carry a small bar over the biggest knife.

Me I'd take a CQC7 and a 16 inch pro bar over any fixed blade for urban survival.If I worked in a building I would keep a much larger bar there.The 16 would be for my kit.Big knives shine in the woods for building shelter,making fuzz sticks ect.,but its called the concrete jungle for a reason.

Most cutting that a knife would do would be freeing your self from entanglement in wires ,cable or cutting awy your clothes that are caught.
 
I'd chuck a good Estwing hammer, or hatchet in a BOB. Generally, I don't like the all metal hafts for all day work, but in a survival situation, you won't be pounding 16 penny nails all day, and it'd be better for prying. The blunt end is better for busting concrete than a crowbar as well. Bolt cutters would be nice for rebar, and chain link as well.
 
Social cameleon,any tool is better than no tool.I'm just trying to pass on what people who do this sort of work for a living use.:) Its not hammers and knives.There are many urban search and rescue teams in the country,Miami/ Dade,Fairfax county are 2 of the best you may want to ask them what they recomend.

Bolt cutters for instance are fine for the wire they sometimes use in concrete pads,but rebar is cut the saws and torches.We have 3 foot bolt cutters on the rig and I've seen 2 strong men fail to make a mark on things much weaker than rebar.

When we go in a highrise (I'm on my cities highrise team)we leave the flathead ax behind and take a sledge to use with the Halligan bar,because even a full size ax isn't up to the task of these buildings.Yes you can't lug these around all day.Now when I say bar this is not a "crow bar" its a bar made for forced entry/egress.Typicly has a flat bill at one end that is 90 degress to the handle and a tapered pike.The other end has a large split claw.Often you can get one with a lock puller on one end,for the 2 ways out, through the door or through the lock. You can shut off gas lines with the split claw and break the hasp of a padlock with the pike, it is made for lot of the problems faced in an urban setting.You can get small 16 inch bars that you could carry in a bag.These are tools made for this type of work,what the people who do it use,what I use on the job and keep in my car
 
but remember we are talking about carrying in the car daily or at the office in an apt.

adding a crowbar or axe or sledge.

I do some stone carving maybe I should pack my tools.


webster ny has highrises?
 
Live in Webster,town motto "Webster where life is worth living",work for city of Rochester,home of Eastman Kodak,Xerox,Bausch and Lomb.City motto at least a drug house isn't a vacant house.;)

Take care.
 
Hey Hunter, where can I get one of those bars? I do my shopping in pawn shops, and hardware stores. I know the tools you're talking about, I just can't buy one.
By rebar, I ment the mesh type often found in slabs. The big honkin' ferro-concrete supports require a grinder, which is a bit impractical for a BOB.
I do demo for a living, not quite rubble rescue, but pretty damn close, and the hand tool I use most is a 23 oz framing hammer. I have a sledge, prybar, grinder, and 10' ladder for that matter, but none of them fit in my tool bags. Second place goes to a mason's hammer for precision wrecking.
If I could get one of those rescue bars, I'd take it to work with me!
 
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